Official Luthiers Forum!

This question goes out to professional builders that take on commissions and also build stock guitars to sell:

1. How much wood do you have stored up at any given time?
2. After buying wood, how long do you generally wait after purchasing before you use it?
3. Do you buy wood to match the commission or do you keep a variety in stock and select from the stocked wood that you have when you receive a commission?

Another somewhat related question would be:
4. Do you show your client the actual piece of wood that is going to be used for a build, or is only the species specified when taking the commission?

1. A s**t load.
2. It really depends on the wood, but usually it is at least a year before I build with anything new. If the wood is old and has come from a known source I am usually more comfortable building with it sooner. But generally I buy while the gettin is good. I have learned with tonewoods ... if you snooze you lose.
3. I pretty much only stock "regular" tonewoods ... a variety of rosewoods, mahogany (cuban/honduran), maple, koa and just a dash of ebony, malaysian blackwood, and ziricote. I can't really sell any of the "alternative" tonewoods. I know other guys do... but that is just me.

On tops, I absolutely have them for at least a year and usually 2 or 3 before I build with them. I stock pretty much everything... a variety of spruces, cedar, and redwood.

4. Yes, my clients usually always pick their own back and sides from a selection I show them, and I pick the tops.

I also stock bindings, bridge blanks, fingerboards, brace stock, etc.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

I worry if I don't have about a two year supply --minimum-- of any material that can't be bought at any time at the local hardware store, and even some that can be. With woods, I like it to be a lot more than that.

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Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.

1. Not enough
2. about a year before I start thinking about using it.
3. Keep a variety but I will order if needed
4. yep

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Say what you do, Do what you say.

1. I try to have enough to build 40-50 guitars
2. about a year before I start using it.
3. Just like Brock, I can not sell any alternative tonewoods. Australian Blackwood is as "out there" as it gets for me.
Majority of my customers stick with Rosewoods, Koa and Ebony.
4. Yes, normally they get to choose their particular set from my stash.

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Peter M.
Cornerstone Guitars
http://www.cornerstoneukes.com

BROCK & PETER,

What do you mean "I can't sell it"? It's tough to market? And what "Alternative" woods are you referencing?

Although I'm not yet in the industry from a business standpoint, I plan to eventually be and it seems to me that wood is a sizable long-term investment... Are you guys sawing your own logs or are you buying from tonewood suppliers? Because it seems having any stocked amount of a wood such as Coco or Ebony could get very expensive very quickly... Then if the customer himself/herself is choosing from that stock, there's always the potential that you're going to have some wood that doesn't move at all... When a luthier does decide to take the plunge into making this his livelihood, how would one generally do this? Do you take out a loan just like a normal business? Also how do you deal with wood that customers aren't choosing? Do you just make a guitar out of it and try to sell it that way?

I believe my buyers prefer to buy "known" or traditional tonewoods rather than alternative tonewoods. I also think that some of the more scarce tonewoods will be more valuable in the near future as a finished product or raw wood...

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Peter M.
Cornerstone Guitars
http://www.cornerstoneukes.com

Yes, it gets expensive very quickly. One can buy boards and resaw, but it's time consuming and there is a lot of waste, and it's hard to find suitable boards, and they can be costly if you are paying retail (although "retail" is not a very meaningful word in the lumber biz; even the commercial hardwood yards--and there are other dealers-- can easily vary by 100+% on the price of a board). That's why we have upcharges that can be substantial for premium woods.

On the other hand, it's always a pleasure to fondle one's best rosewood sets, and take note of how much they have appreciated.

Wood customers aren't choosing? It can always keep you warm for a little while

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Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.

"Alternative" to me would be anything outside the "traditional" tonewood spectrum -- Mahogany, Rosewood, Maple, Koa, Walnut [which I only sell rarely], with a tiny smattering of ebony. I have had a few people consider Ziricote, but in the end they went with Rosewood).

It ultimately got to the point where I sold or traded away most of my alternative tonewoods and just stockpiled the core woods.

I am not saying you can't build a good guitar out of anything but the traditional woods, but I just can't sell anything else.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

I think the best way to get going is to buy wood from reputable tonewood dealers. There is quite a bit to sourcing the best quality lumber (then cutting it up). It can be done (and should be), but I would say buy most of your stuff from the tonewood dealers at first. There is a high amount of waste, a moderate learning curve associated with getting the maximum yeild out of resawing, and it sucks to cut open a board and find a bunch of flaws that were not evident on the surface. The screw ups are expensive when you process your own. Trust me... the tonewood dealers earn their profits in the amount of work that goes into processing the lumber, and the financial risk associated with getting lumber that doesn't measure up.

But... keep your eyes and ears open locally for retired/deceased cabinet makers etc. I just landed on a nice stash of mahogany from a guy who retired. Usually you can find this stuff fairly reasonable, because what was once worth a kings ransom is now a white elephant and the retired wood worker (or his family) is happy to get rid of it, get some money for it, and have someone haul it away.

Unfortunately, you must buy when the opportunity strikes. If you don't it will be gone.

And in the best of all worlds, I try to hand pick as many of my tops as I can. The ASIA symposium (and I suspect the GAL show) are good places to do this.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

1) I have been collecting wood for over 25 years... I now have all the wood I will need for the rest of my guitar building career. Even so, I will occasionally buy wood if I come across something exceptional or just plain irresistible.

2) I have a two year rule. I generally don't use wood until it has been in my climate controlled shop for at least two years. I do make exceptions now and then if I know the history of the wood.

3) I keep a variety in stock. I draw from what I have for commissioned guitars.

4) Sometimes customers choose their particular set of wood, sometimes not. It depends on the situation.

Mark

Resawing is an art… Even with a good setup and some experience it's easy to ruin a perfectly good board, or get a mediocre yield. As others wrote, there is also a lot of waste and it rarely makes sense economically (if you account the time, blades etc.). That being said cutting the back and the sides from the same plank looks great IMO, and if you're not against 4 or 3 piece backs there's plenty of wood around.
One aspect I never saw discussed here (yet) is buying a whole spruce tree, and cut/split/resaw the logs. I know some European makers do it. It is a steep investment at first, and requires a lot of experience in gauging what tree to buy, but apparently it pays off by having consistent tops to work with for a long time, or even a whole career.

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Laurent Brondel
West Paris, Maine - USA
http://www.laurentbrondel.com/

Well said brock,

people sometimes give me a hard time over my prices as its very dificult for people to understand how much work is involved in this trade and the sacrafices us dealers make in order to supply quality wood.
i try to keep my prices in line with the states which is allmost impossable for me as we just dont have the sources over here that you in the states.
also its a steep learning curve you do the math in your head and you think well i can make 100% on "retail" prices what have i got to loose.
well the fact you never yeaild what you expect and in every "pallet load" only 10-20% will be suitable for your uses.
you then have to find a way to get rid of the unsuitable wood which makes our lives very dificult.
the only way i can do it now really is by having the right contacts who will cherry pick there imports for me and pass it on to me.
this is expensive time consuming and thats before i have even thought about resawing,drying,storing the lumber,internet,photo,s,custom orders,and all the over heads that come with running a business.

the fact is we are the not money making monsters many people think we are are and work very hard to bring the very best wood to the market at a price that keeps your overheads ands costs at a minimum.
with the global economic market they way its getting harder to maintain the standards and prices that we have been used to.

That said i think resawing your own woods can be both fun and econimic for the small builder and means you can get some wonderfull woods that you may not have considered before.

Buy the way i seems to sell alot more of the staples (rosewood,maple,mahogany) than the blingy stuff but i think the consumer market is waking up to the fact that their guitar doesent have to made out of rosewood to sound good.
hopefully will only get better as time goes on,


Joel.