Official Luthiers Forum!

Owned and operated by Lance Kragenbrink
It is currently Sun Dec 01, 2024 4:07 am


All times are UTC - 5 hours


Forum rules


Be nice, no cussin and enjoy!




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 4:34 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1707
I would like to use a rope style purfling for my build. It is .080” thick so it’s substantial for purfling, do I try to bend it with the binding in the bender or do I just pull it around the guitar like the regular small stuff?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 4:45 pm 
Offline
Mahogany
Mahogany

Joined: Sat May 30, 2015 10:01 pm
Posts: 73
First name: Blake
Last Name: Dyson
City: Hillsborough
State: NC
Zip/Postal Code: 27278
Country: USA
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
I tend to hand bend the thicker purflings I use. I always have problems with them cracking otherwise. YMMV

I don't know how well it would do in the bender, but I just haven't ever tried that. Might as well give it a go and see what happens! Tape them all together in the correct orientation and that will help stabilize them in the bend.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:58 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1707
Luthier1975 wrote:
I tend to hand bend the thicker purflings I use. I always have problems with them cracking otherwise. YMMV

I don't know how well it would do in the bender, but I just haven't ever tried that. Might as well give it a go and see what happens! Tape them all together in the correct orientation and that will help stabilize them in the bend.

So still use moisture and heat?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 6:27 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:20 am
Posts: 5968
For rope and herringbone I soak them in water for a minute or so , take them out, and allow the water to be absorbed a little. Then I hand bend them into the channel sometimes using the binding to back them up. Wetting the purfling softens the glue a little and allows the pieces to slide around a little. If you use too much water the purfling falls apart so it is a bit of a balancing act.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:17 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:47 pm
Posts: 2523
First name: Jay
Last Name: De Rocher
City: Bothell
State: Washington
I do basically the same as Clay for rope and herringbone purfling. I fill a large baking sheet with warm water, place the purfling in the water for 60-90 seconds, and then tape them on edge to the sides of the guitar body and let them dry. Once dry, they hold their bent shape.

The herringbone I've done was 0.130 wide and the rope was 0.100 wide.

_________________
Once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right - Robert Hunter


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:53 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1707
So just water ...
They are the same width as the binding so I COULD tape them up between binding parts when I bend, but I guess the heat may cause it to delaminate


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 12:09 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:20 am
Posts: 5968
If you have an extra piece or two you can experiment to get a feel for how the stuff you have acts. Even a two or three inch scrap can help you know the right amount of moisture to use. Testing to destruction a small scrap might save some heartache later. I do one piece at a time rather than wetting them all at the same time.



These users thanked the author Clay S. for the post: SnowManSnow (Sat Dec 14, 2019 7:26 am)
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 7:26 am 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1707
Thanks for the help folks
I’ll get it done:)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 9:07 am 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2014 9:33 pm
Posts: 305
Location: Mount Vernon, Ohio
First name: Greg
Last Name: Maxwell
City: Mount Vernon
State: Ohio
Country: USA
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
Stew Mac has a video somewhere on their site showing how Dan Erlewine bends herringbone.

_________________
It will probably be alright.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 9:15 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member

Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:52 pm
Posts: 3076
First name: Don
Last Name: Parker
City: Charleston
State: West Virginia
Zip/Postal Code: 25314
Country: USA
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
I think the key to bending any layered purfling is to not ask any more than 2-3 layers to bend while still glued together. The trick to bending herringbone referenced by Greg is to disconnect the outer layers of fiber from the inside layers. The inside diagonal layers and spine then bend very easily.

Is the rope purfling attached to some outer layers? You might want to pull one of those layers loose before trying to bend. But be careful about separating both outer layers. It might all fall apart if you do that.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 9:33 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:20 am
Posts: 5968
https://www.stewmac.com/How-To/Trade_Se ... ng_it.html

That is a good information for doing tight bends. I cut the herringbone down the middle to do rosettes and other tight bends, but what the video shows looks like it will work better. If you cut the herringbone down the middle you can use it as a small rope binding or turn it sideways and use it for alternating block molding.


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:44 am 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1707
This is it
Image


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:57 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:20 am
Posts: 5968
If you are bending it around the typical acoustic guitar, just wetting it will probably be enough to make it bend. Dan used heat, that might work too (I haven't done that). When you separate the layers you always run the risk of things falling apart. For a Venetian cutaway separating the layers would be helpful, so the risk might be worth it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:03 am 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1707
Clay S. wrote:
If you are bending it around the typical acoustic guitar, just wetting it will probably be enough to make it bend. Dan used heat, that might work too (I haven't done that). When you separate the layers you always run the risk of things falling apart. For a Venetian cutaway separating the layers would be helpful, so the risk might be worth it.

It’s a standard 000 shape so nothing crazy and fairly gentle curves


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:34 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2010 1:46 pm
Posts: 2150
First name: Freeman
Last Name: Keller
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
I've used that premade "rope" style material for purfling and rosettes on a couple of guitars. I routed a little groove a piece of some sort of scrap material and prebent it using a heat gun and some water. It seemed to hold the bend well enough and not delaminate

Attachment:
IMG_1892.JPG


Attachment:
IMG_1893.JPG


Attachment:
IMG_1895.JPG


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 12:46 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member

Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2013 4:58 pm
Posts: 1449
First name: Ed
Last Name: Minch
City: Chestertown
State: MD
Zip/Postal Code: 21620
Country: United States
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
Rank amateur here and in the last week I have bent both .130 rope and .110 rope on a hot pipe set on high. I squirted some Windex with ammonia on it. I went much tighter than you did to fit it to a rosette and had no problems. The narrower stuff was full depth, but the wider stuff was quite thin and needed care to keep it flat. I also bent ivoroid with a hair dryer and fit it into a groove to hold it and keep it flat, as it was .040 thick. The last picture is my rosette on my redwood top (with shellac). It all went easier than I thought it would

Ed


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: guitarmaker78 and 29 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
phpBB customization services by 2by2host.com