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Huh? More questions from a Newbie?...Yup
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Author:  Chris aka Sniggly [ Sat Feb 23, 2008 9:36 am ]
Post subject:  Huh? More questions from a Newbie?...Yup
Hey Yall!!!!!!
Been lurkin round here....good place for aspiring guitar makers to learn. Consequently I have a few questions. Long time high end furniture maker here with lots of family history in wood working... none of which is tackled guitar making...so I will. Here goes.

I have many tip profiles (drill bits) I use for different applications. What's your preference for tip profile in guitar making?

Anyone using shellac and hvlp for finishing on guitars? I don't mean Zinssers Seal Coat or some other such you can buy from Home Cheapo. I mean quality purified flakes with controlled mix rates and such. Some say Shellac is Shellac but I gently disagree. I know NC lacquer is the finish of choice here and I am set up to spray it but was curious about the use of shellac.

If you are using Shellac what's the mill thickness of the final finish?

If you use a fly cutter or circle cutting apparatus for your drill press can you supply pictures? I am leaning toward milling my own parts and making it. Don't want to spend what LMII wants.

I'll leave it at that for now...and thanks in advance for your input.

Chris
Author:  Mitch Cain [ Sat Feb 23, 2008 9:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Huh? More questions from a Newbie?...Yup
Welcome to the OLF! Great to see another quality woodworker entering the obsession.

As far as drill bits, you will find your Forstner bits and brad points most useful - lots of good stuff in the archives here, just search on those terms and you will see how each is applied.

Shellac is definitely a highly used finish by many up here. French polish is the preferred application and as such, many do make their own from flakes. There are a lot of folks who use NC lacquer as a finish, and, just as in furniture and cabinetry, water-based finishes, like Target USL, sold in this world as ColorTone, and LMI's KTM-9 are leading that pack. There are also some who are advocating the polyester finishes and UV-cured. Pretty much finishing runs the gamut here, just like in the furniture and cabinet world.

I think the thing you'll find most interesting up here is the wide range of woodworking experience and skill set - It'll be pretty obvious once you see some of the setups used, jigs that folks have created, etc, that there's some pretty good woodworking chops up here - check out Grumpy's site for examples.
Author:  WaddyThomson [ Sat Feb 23, 2008 10:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Huh? More questions from a Newbie?...Yup
There are also a number of people who use Seal Coat and Liberon Hard Shellac for French Polishing and spray applications. Nothing like a quality, dewaxed, consistent product to give consistent results. Many also use flakes. Also, some of our Down Under members have been having great luck with UBeaut Hard Shellac. Many ways to go and numerous opinions, as is the case for almost every aspect of guitar construction.

Welcome to the OLF. You'll find us generally a friendly bunch, so post away, and you'll get opinions. Usually many of them.
Author:  SteveCourtright [ Sat Feb 23, 2008 10:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Huh? More questions from a Newbie?...Yup
Robbie O'Brien has French Polished, sprayed and brushed Shellac and reports that he can't tell the difference visually. I think Michael P. (correction: I think it is Colin) reports that it is his experience that French Polish will produce a harder finish than other techniques, and this makes plenty of sense considering how the finish is applied in that technique.

Welcome to the OLF!
Author:  KenH [ Sat Feb 23, 2008 11:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Huh? More questions from a Newbie?...Yup
Welcome to the forum Chris!
I got into guitar building after a long run of other woodworking projects also, so I'm sure you will see how it all goes together and be able to make the joints necessary. The biggest difference that comes to mind for me is that all of the tolerances are so much tighter in luthery than in other woodworking.

As far as the shellac, I dont see why you couldnt spray it, but as Steve mentioned, I dont think you will get teh hard finish that you would using the french polish method. Even with french polishing, it is a delicate finish that requires a lot more care and upkeep than some of the other finishes.

Keep in mind that anybody can build a guitar. It is the details that have been proven over time that can make it an exceptional sounding guitar.
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Mon Feb 25, 2008 10:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Huh? More questions from a Newbie?...Yup
I am not sure why you feel that Zinsser Seal coat is not a quality shellac :? It is purified 100% wax free. Yes the color is the darker than blond and lighter than garnet because it is a mix of the Amber and blond shellac. But I like the light amber tint It provides But none the less. Yes I have used custom cut shellac via HVLP spray. In fact I spray shellac as my pre-finish sealer on every thing and have done as well as several complete sprayed shellac finishes as well as 30 some years of french polishing experience.

I use a 2lb cut for preliminary cut and 1.5lb cut for finial three coats. I don't measure the mil thickness, I do know it will fall between 4-6 mils

Yes Shellac can be refined to a various levels of purity but other than color when it is all boiled down shellac is shellac at a give state of refinment.
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Mon Feb 25, 2008 10:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Huh? More questions from a Newbie?...Yup
I am just guessing here but a lot of people get Zinzzer's "Shellac Sealer" and Zinzzer's "Seal Coat" confused. The Shellac Sealer has a yellow label and is not wax free the Seal Coat has a mauve label and clearly states it is 100% wax free. there is a world of difference in these two products.

From many years of using it I can tell you it is an excellent product suitable for any fine shellac finish
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