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French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
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Author:  Rod True [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:09 pm ]
Post subject:  French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
I'll start with the questions for those who FP and know. This is my first every attempt at French Polishing shellac so I'm sort of running at it. I've read the Milburn tutorial and 2 other tutorials on the net. I've read almost everything here in the archives as well as what ever is in the archives on the MIMF and I've watched some guy on youtube do a fp session. That's my experience before last night.

1st question: I was using old tee shirt material for the muneca cover and it seemed to disintegrate rather quickly. I went through 7 or 8 covers after I was done the body (all surfaces). Is this normal? I'm thinking I should be using cotton which is tougher (a tighter weave as JJ has told me).

2nd question: I had a hard time seeing the "cloud" behind the pad when bodying. Every once in a while I saw it as I looked at the surface from a different angle and it seemed to be exactly as I read but I'm wondering if I was laying down the material right (not to wet). Where should my light source be for me to be able to see the "cloud" most effectively?

3rd question: It was getting late when I finished the first session and I didn't spirit off the body, I did stiff each surface after though. Is it ok to leave it overnight and spirit off the next day or should I really wait the hour and spirit off after the session? I didn't want to get to bed that late so I left it thinking that this was the first session and I'd be ok.

On to the pictures and neck detail. The neck will be finished with watco danish oil over thick CA pore filler.

The pictures of the neck are bad in that they don't show the color correctly (the first picture is very close to the actual color) but I'm happy with how it's coming out. The CA pore fill was really easy, a little burning on the eyes but not to bad (I wore my respirator and didn't have to breath any of the fumes). It leveled very well and it was ready to start applying the finish within 1/2 hour. I put three coats of the danish oil on in 40 min intervals and this morning it is pretty hard. I'll leave it for a couple of days, give it a good scuff sanding with 600 and than apply a couple more coats, leave that for a couple more days and do a final rub out up to 2000 wet and than use paste wax and oooo steelwool for the final polish. I think it's going to be nice and slick. Thanks to JJ for the suggestion [:Y:] here's a couple pictures of the neck, remember the pictures don't show off the color right.

Attachment:
finishing maple guitar 001.jpg


Attachment:
finishing maple guitar 002.jpg


Attachment:
finishing maple guitar 004.jpg


Attachment:
finishing maple guitar 006.jpg


Now the body, remember this is the first bodying session with at least 6-8 more to go.

Attachment:
finishing maple guitar 012.jpg


Attachment:
finishing maple guitar 013.jpg


Attachment:
finishing maple guitar 011.jpg


Attachment:
finishing maple guitar 014.jpg


Sorry for such a long post. I'm really excited about the finishing of this guitar as it's been 1.5 years in the making and nearing completion. Thanks for looking.
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
Looking good so far.

Question 1: Yes tee shirt material will desintigrate quickly. This is why I do not recommend it. I use either cotton Linen of Muslin. Muslin I find to be the best but is some times hard to find.

Question 2: Having your work light in advantage position helps here. It should not be directly above but at and angle from the opposite side you are standing but not directly across from you either. This makes the vapor trail more evident. I hate the word cloud for this because it is actually the oil and alcohol rising through the newly laid shellac and rapidly flashing off.

Question 3: Yes you can spirit off the next day but it will take more passes to level as the shellac has hardened. best to do 15 min after the the body session for ease and effectiveness. There is really no part of the process that has a firm deadline as the shellac is always workable. there is beat time frame for convenience and ease of workability.
Author:  burbank [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
Rod,

I put the light like Michael said, so that I can see it easily in the reflection off the finish.

It's harder to see the trail in the early stages and harder over a light-colored wood like maple.
Author:  SteveCourtright [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
Looks great, Rod, I love the curly maple. As far as the vapor trail is concerned, I am sure it will get easier to see when the surfaces becomes smoother, but it also occurs to me that the maple will not show the vapor as much as a darker background might. I will find out as my current build is myrtle and I will probably do a shellac finish. I used as a cover old handkerchiefs and found they worked a lot better than t-shirt material, but have no experience with the materials Michael mentions.
Author:  JJ Donohue [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
Congratulations, Rod!!! It looks real nice.

Listen to what Michael says! He's one of the best teachers, along with Colin and Robbie!

How's the elbow...probably hasn't been this sore since you were a young teenager! laughing6-hehe
Author:  SteveCourtright [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
Well, Pat, it looks like we concur - that makes our opinion a fact, Rod. :)
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
SteveCourtright wrote:
Looks great, Rod, I love the curly maple. As far as the vapor trail is concerned, I am sure it will get easier to see when the surfaces becomes smoother, but it also occurs to me that the maple will not show the vapor as much as a darker background might. I will find out as my current build is myrtle and I will probably do a shellac finish. I used as a cover old handkerchiefs and found they worked a lot better than t-shirt material, but have no experience with the materials Michael mentions.


Hankies typiclly are linen or muslin. Mostly linen
Author:  Rod True [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
I too was thinking that the vapor trail (Thanks Michael) would be hard to see on the light color surface like Maple. Every once in a while I did see it depending on my angle of view so I feel better about that :) I'll move my light to a better angle as well.

I'll go the fabric store (incognito like Hesh does) and look for cotton linen or muslin and give that a try tonight.

Glad I can just spirit off and than get back to the bodying sessions. I'm also glad I don't need to wait an hour to spirit off, I can get to bed earlier :D
Author:  Rod True [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
JJ Donohue wrote:
Congratulations, Rod!!! It looks real nice.

Listen to what Michael says! He's one of the best teachers, along with Colin and Robbie!

How's the elbow...probably hasn't been this sore since you were a young teenager! laughing6-hehe


pfft hardie har har.

Actually it's not to bad at all. My fingers feel it the most. Being a desk jockey they don't really get much of a work out other than typing all day. I'll let you know how I feel next week went It's all done laughing6-hehe
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
Rod True wrote:
I too was thinking that the vapor trail (Thanks Michael) would be hard to see on the light color surface like Maple. Every once in a while I did see it depending on my angle of view so I feel better about that :) I'll move my light to a better angle as well.

I'll go the fabric store (incognito like Hesh does) and look for cotton linen or muslin and give that a try tonight.

Glad I can just spirit off and than get back to the bodying sessions. I'm also glad I don't need to wait an hour to spirit off, I can get to bed earlier :D


If you buy new linen or muslin,wash the linen or muslin 6 or seven times to remove all loose fibers first. All new fabric will have lots of loose fibers. You do not need to dry between washings ;)
Author:  Hesh [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
I cut up my ex-girlfriends 100% cotton tight weave dress blouses and used those and they worked great......... :D

JJ Rod just had another kid so it was not as far back as when he was a teenager............ :D

Looking great Rod!!!! [:Y:] [clap] [clap] [clap] [clap]
Author:  Rod True [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 3:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
OK so just got back from the fabric store and I picked up a yard of muslin. We have a large East Indian population in my city and they have great fabric stores. I figured I'd be able to get the muslin or linen there as I know it's used a lot in Indian textiles. Now I'll have enough covers to last me oh about 20 guitars. Cheep too, it was $3.66 total for 15 sft of the stuff. Now it's in the wash for several cycles than in the dryer.

Thanks again Michael and all for the suggestions and JJ and Hesh for the hysterics :D
Author:  jhowell [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 7:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
This search - "linen tablecloth" just brought up 758 hits on e-Bay. I got a couple of them at $5 each a year or so ago for a near lifetime supply.
Author:  JohnAbercrombie [ Thu Feb 28, 2008 11:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
re: Linen
If you go to a fabric store (in Canada (and the UK?) ) you are looking for 'handkerchief linen' .
This is much thinner (and smoother) than tablecloth material, or the linen in most clothing. Or if you can find them, linen handkerchiefs will serve, though they are likely more expensive on a per yard basis.

I just threw my linen in the laundry basket and let it go through with the laundry every time for a couple of months- it softened up pretty well.

Cheers
John
Author:  Todd Rose [ Fri Feb 29, 2008 10:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
Just a small point of clarification, which may help some folks find what they're looking for - linen is not cotton. It is made from the flax plant, the same plant from which linseed oil is made.
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Fri Feb 29, 2008 1:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: French polish first bodying session & some questions. Lot o
Todd Rose wrote:
Just a small point of clarification, which may help some folks find what they're looking for - linen is not cotton. It is made from the flax plant, the same plant from which linseed oil is made.



True point!! Not an issue with the process of French polishing
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