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Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=16564		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Chris aka Sniggly [ Mon Mar 24, 2008 9:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Thought I would provide some of you with an update on my progress. First guitar...and am spending more time on tooling and setup than making the guitar. This is a follow up to this post....http://www.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=16552

1st pic - Previously I posted that I was worried about my rosette because I already thickness sanded my top and profiled it....thus loosing center and having less top to work with etc. Here is the top.

2nd pic - This is me cutting the rosette on my press. It's nearly 5/8 wide East Idian Rosewood Burl. I bound this piece with 50 thou Bloodwood on the inside and the outside...you can see the bloodwood in the next pic...and me cutting the rosette channel in one of the pics...

It was tuff doing this with the top so thin...took all day...but it looks really good. Wanted to say thanks to all that suggested ways to 'proceed'.

gaah Okay...the pics are backwards...please read from the bottom up...as if you were in a pig latin class learning how to use an upside down coke machine.... [uncle]
Author:  kkneeburg [ Mon Mar 24, 2008 9:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Very nice. I haven't see one done quite that way, but should look fantastic once there's some lacquer over it
Author:  Chris aka Sniggly [ Mon Mar 24, 2008 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Lacquer?....I was a thinkin bout usin sum dat mimwax poly ultra thane and a foam brush from Harber frait!

laughing6-hehe laughing6-hehe laughing6-hehe laughing6-hehe
Author:  kkneeburg [ Mon Mar 24, 2008 9:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Heck, just use some vaseline to shine that up Bubha. It'll look purdy

wow7-eyes
Author:  Jim Watts [ Mon Mar 24, 2008 10:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Good recovery [clap]
Author:  Chris aka Sniggly [ Mon Mar 24, 2008 10:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Thanks Jim....I am a little concerned about the thickness of the top because....or should I say the 'final' thickness of the top because I haven't sanded past 100 grit yet. The rosette is only inlaid by about 50 thou....the top is Adi Spruce btw.

I don't have my thickness calipers set up yet (still tooling)...so I can't get real accurate numbers but my calipers around the sound hole can go as low as 89 thou. OM size guitar.

Tomorrow I am going to build my thickness guage and use it. I spent A LOT of time making that rosette...and one of my best rosette blanks....i'm going to be aggravated if I have to do another top
Author:  Jim Watts [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
The rosette being inlayed .05 is fine.
It's hard to say on your top, just because it's Adirondack doesn't mean it's really stiff, but it might be. But for a OM size guitar you should be able to work with it. If your careful with your sanding you'll probably only lose a few thousands or so.
Author:  Dave Fifield [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 3:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Don't worry about the top thickness Sniggly old chap....you can just make the soundboard braces a little taller/thicker to compensate. Easy! [:Y:] Oh, and keep your bench clean and dirt/woodchip free for the rest of the build to minimize the amount of sanding you have to do later.

Good save on the rosette, I must say! If you hadn't told us, none of us would know....

Cheers,
Dave F.
Author:  JRessler [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 6:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
All's well that ends well! Excellent recovery. Just think of the education you are receiving! Next time you do this you will wonder what the struggle was all about.

Yes - your first several builds you will spend more time setting up, making fixtures, etc than you will actually building the guitar.
Author:  Hesh [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 6:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Nice going Snig buddy [:Y:] [clap] [clap] [clap] [clap]

I would not worry about the top either and my reason for this is that you said that you are building from the Antes OM plan - that plan is notoriously over braced. So with your thinner top just build to plan, with the heavier bracing and I think that you will be fine.
Author:  Chris aka Sniggly [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 7:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Hesh I was going to ask that question. I know there are many posts here regarding the bracing of the tops on the Antes plans...and I was considering taking them down in size. So I shall proceed as 'planned'... 8-)

And thanks again all for the input....keep it coming....the ideas are great...

Also here are some other pics....I gave my guitar a wedgy!!!!
Author:  Hesh [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Well snig you will get many opinions regarding this plan from people who have built them. Mine turned out over braced but my top was thicker then yours - in the .115 neighborhood. So my thinking is that if you braced to plan with your thinner top your results will probably sound more "open" then mine.

As for taking the bracing down further from the plan that is up to you. I would suggest that you pay attention to excess mass on the braces found on the sides when profiling them to a triangular side profile. Height wise I would go with the specs on the plan since we have no idea how stiff your top is.

This first guitar is an enormous learning experience and to me the most important thing is to complete it, have it sound decent and it will, and enjoy the process. Not in the order mind you...... :D

You are doing great and need to pat yourself on the back. They say that only 10% of golfers ever shoot under 100. Do you have any idea what percentage of the population can and has build a guitar? [:Y:]
Author:  Hesh [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Sorry Todd I did not see your post prior to posting.

Snig Todd has some very good ideas and I would be very comfortable with all that he recommends for you here.
Author:  Chris aka Sniggly [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
I am trying to think of a way that I can 'express' the stiffness or not so stiffness of the top here in words...so here we go.

When I hold the top up...think of peering across the plane of the top as if you were looking to see something sticking up........with one hand holding it on one side where the lower bout is the widest....fingers on the bottom and thumb overlaying the edge.....there is no deflection on the other side of the bout.

If I hold it in both hands...in the same places (lower bout)....fingers on the top this time with thumb supporting the bottom....I am able to bend it...but I have to push up with the thumbs...

Okay...I can see how this is nearly impossible to explain. I am going to brace the top today and before I take my planes to it....post some pics with height and width....and go from there.

Once again...cheers and beers to all...
Author:  kkneeburg [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Progress looks good Homestyle. Why could you not have done this when I lived 3 miles down the road from you and had my shop tooled up. I move to Texas and now you jump on the wagon.. idunno ...LOL
Author:  Chris aka Sniggly [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Kevin...I have no idea why I didn't get into it....but look at it this way....if I had....you'd be stuck here...you would not have met Elvia...and you'd be selling plywood banjos to people driving 1985 Ford Aerostar vans with water heaters hanging out of the back. laughing6-hehe laughing6-hehe ....now THAT...IS FUNNY!!!!

Todd...I am using a neck block kinda like Colin's....with a fingerboard extension...bolt on. Would you split the UTB and just butt it up against the fingerboard extention?....See the pic
Author:  KenH [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Youre looking good so far. Keep up the good work.

by the way, I just found out that we are closer than you might think. drop by to see me if you want to. I'll be glad to help you out.

Ken
Author:  KenH [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Just wanted to say that I had a GREAT visit today from Chris (aka: sniggly) and had a blast talking about guitars and construction. I hope to get more visits form him and enjoyed the visit very much. He did a fantastic job on the rosette but I'm afriad the top was a wee bit too thin. He has a new top to work with and hopefully he sees what a good top should feel like now. I look forward to seeing some excellent guitars from this guy!
Author:  Chris aka Sniggly [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Woooohoooooo.......me too....I agree.......here here!....

Ken could very well be the SOUTHERN ZOOT MAN in disguise yall.....

I am drawing a new rosette now....should be....different.... 8-)
Author:  Chris aka Sniggly [ Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rosette progress and other pics (first build)
Todd.....can you clarify for me? The Antes plan calls for .380 wide by .500 tall for tone bars, x brace, and side bars. The plan also specifies 500 by 500 thou for the big brace above the sound hole...a UTB I think it's called. If my measurements are correct my fingerboard support block is going to stop just short of the UTB. If I read your post correctly you suggest .290 wide by .380 tall for the x brace....and .250 wide by .625 tall for the tone bars?.....

Ken...man I wish I had brought my plans and my mold so we could have discussed this in more detail. I'm gonna finish this puppy and bring it to you to critique...
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