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| Another set of newbie questions http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=16587 |
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| Author: | SkyHigh [ Wed Mar 26, 2008 10:49 am ] |
| Post subject: | Another set of newbie questions |
-I'm thinking of applying coat(s) of shellac on my radius dish. Can you tell me what exact kind/brand I need to purchase. Also, is this the better method than shellac for what I"m trying to achieve? -I got a large sheet of leather from one of my student to use for my new wood makers vise. However the leather is purple in color and wondered if this will cause a staining or other issues when coming in contact with wood. -Finally I am going to add a backing on my radius dish to give extra support and stability. I am thinking of MDF, Baltic Birch Ply, or partical board. Any recommendations? Thanks, David |
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| Author: | Michael Dale Payne [ Wed Mar 26, 2008 11:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another set of newbie questions |
If you plan to use this just to seal your dishes then almost any shellac will do. But the odds are you will use this shellac as seal coats on instruments as well and maybe for French polish and if you want a caned product then your choices are limited to basically 2 Libbron Super blond French polish and Zinzzer's Bull’s-eye "SEAL COAT" If you get the Zinzzer's be sure it has 100% wax free on the face of the can if you plan to ever use in on an instrument. Zinzzer's makes several Shellac sealers but only the SEAL COAT is 100% wax free. The leather is not an issue if the wood is in the white and dry as long as the tanning on the leather is fast. But I would not use it if you ever apply a solvent like Naphtha or alcohol to the guitar. |
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| Author: | Michael Dale Payne [ Thu Mar 27, 2008 8:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another set of newbie questions |
SkyHigh wrote: -Finally I am going to add a backing on my radius dish to give extra support and stability. I am thinking of MDF, Baltic Birch Ply, or partical board. Any recommendations? Thanks, David What are your dishes made of? Why so you think you need additional support? I have many dishes all are 3/4" MDF sealed with shellac many are over 7 years old and none are warped. While I do take care of them I am by no means extra carful with them. My personal opinion is when we use these for clamping braces on a go-bar deck the deck 's bottom acts as a backer plate any additional backer plate is just decreasing the affective height of your go-bar deck. That said If you want to add the additional strength by gluing on a backer, then I would use Birch ply and make sure it is flat to begin with (might run it through a drum sander). I would use epoxy and not a water based glue. I would think a ¼” sheet would be more than enough backing. |
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| Author: | SkyHigh [ Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:20 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another set of newbie questions |
MichaelP wrote: SkyHigh wrote: -Finally I am going to add a backing on my radius dish to give extra support and stability. I am thinking of MDF, Baltic Birch Ply, or partical board. Any recommendations? Thanks, David What are your dishes made of? Why so you think you need additional support? I have many dishes all are 3/4" MDF sealed with shellac many are over 7 years old and none are warped. While I do take care of them I am by no means extra carful with them. My personal opinion is when we use these for clamping braces on a go-bar deck the deck 's bottom acts as a backer plate any additional backer plate is just decreasing the affective height of your go-bar deck. That said If you want to add the additional strength by gluing on a backer, then I would use Birch ply and make sure it is flat to begin with (might run it through a drum sander). I would use epoxy and not a water based glue. I would think a ¼” sheet would be more than enough backing. MP, My dish is made of MDF and it's 1/2" thick. I feel that extra backing will give bit more of stability and something to hold on to when using it upside down to sand. Also I don't know if it's just the batch I"m getting but the last two sheets of birch plys I got from Home depot all were some what warped. I'm thinking I need something bit more solid and stable than birch ply...perhaps baltic or another mdf. David |
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| Author: | Chris aka Sniggly [ Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another set of newbie questions |
I know several cabinet makers here that never buy plywood from Home Cheapo or Lowes. Too many voids and not as stable as it should be. If your radius dishes are 1/2"...then I agree you need some sort of backing. If Home Depot is your choice of places to shop....look for MDF in the 24" x 24" x 3/4" thick. You can back with that without having to deal with an entire sheet of the stuff (it's heavy). Shellac is probably the best choice. I have been using it in my shop for years. Tried and True Varnish oil is another alternative. |
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| Author: | SkyHigh [ Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another set of newbie questions |
sniggly wrote: I know several cabinet makers here that never buy plywood from Home Cheapo or Lowes. Too many voids and not as stable as it should be. If your radius dishes are 1/2"...then I agree you need some sort of backing. If Home Depot is your choice of places to shop....look for MDF in the 24" x 24" x 3/4" thick. You can back with that without having to deal with an entire sheet of the stuff (it's heavy). Shellac is probably the best choice. I have been using it in my shop for years. Tried and True Varnish oil is another alternative. Thanks Sniggly, And NO Home Depot is not my choice of place to shop. It's the only place I knew until just few weeks ago as the only place to buy wood...as do most people not in wood related business. |
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| Author: | SkyHigh [ Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another set of newbie questions |
Can someone tell me the difference between Maelmine and MDF? |
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| Author: | Michael Dale Payne [ Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:50 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another set of newbie questions |
SkyHigh wrote: MichaelP wrote: SkyHigh wrote: -Finally I am going to add a backing on my radius dish to give extra support and stability. I am thinking of MDF, Baltic Birch Ply, or partical board. Any recommendations? Thanks, David What are your dishes made of? Why so you think you need additional support? I have many dishes all are 3/4" MDF sealed with shellac many are over 7 years old and none are warped. While I do take care of them I am by no means extra carful with them. My personal opinion is when we use these for clamping braces on a go-bar deck the deck 's bottom acts as a backer plate any additional backer plate is just decreasing the affective height of your go-bar deck. That said If you want to add the additional strength by gluing on a backer, then I would use Birch ply and make sure it is flat to begin with (might run it through a drum sander). I would use epoxy and not a water based glue. I would think a ¼” sheet would be more than enough backing. MP, My dish is made of MDF and it's 1/2" thick. I feel that extra backing will give bit more of stability and something to hold on to when using it upside down to sand. Also I don't know if it's just the batch I"m getting but the last two sheets of birch plys I got from Home depot all were some what warped. I'm thinking I need something bit more solid and stable than birch ply...perhaps baltic or another mdf. David Yep back those puppies 1/2" is really to thin as your deepest dish used better than 1/3 or more of you available thickness. Check with one of the hobby stores in your area to see if they can get you a couple sheets of 2'x2' 1/4" birch plys from Midwest Products they are a distributor of high grade hardwoods and Birch ply for the hobby industry and their ply is 100% void free. It is not cheap but in small precut pieces is probably the best on the market. Midwest Products are also available on the web through many vendors. You will not find AB-1 or 2 grade ply at HD or any discount hardware store. If you have a high end cabinet or furniture makers or supply house in your area check with them for AB-1 or 2 grade ply |
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| Author: | SkyHigh [ Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another set of newbie questions |
Michael, How about Baltic Birch? Is standard Baltic birch not as nice as Birch Ply from Midwest? |
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| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:57 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another set of newbie questions |
SkyHigh wrote: Can someone tell me the difference between Maelmine and MDF? Melamine is that white stuff that some MDF is coated with to make it slick. You can buy shelves, ready made, coated with Melamine. MDF is basically sawdust and epoxy pressed together to make a board. Oh yeah, you can also find melamine is some Chinese made pet foods. 
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| Author: | Michael Dale Payne [ Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:58 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another set of newbie questions |
SkyHigh wrote: Can someone tell me the difference between Maelmine and MDF? Maelmine is a lower dinsity fiberboard than MDF with a formica like jacket. MDF is medium density fiberboard that has had the exterior surface smooth hardend |
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| Author: | Michael Dale Payne [ Thu Mar 27, 2008 4:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Another set of newbie questions |
MichaelP wrote: SkyHigh wrote: Can someone tell me the difference between Maelmine and MDF? Maelmine is a lower dinsity fiberboard than MDF with a formica like jacket. MDF is medium density fiberboard that has had the exterior surface smooth hardend Actually to call it formica like is not really true it is a fish paper coated with a resin film. |
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