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I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
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Author:  miramadar [ Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:13 pm ]
Post subject:  I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
...I want to build a guitar.

I have very little woodworking experience (I did build my own deck and helped build a house once upon a time)...I own practically no tools...heck, as I browse around this forum, I don't even know what most of the tools are...much less how to use them. Crazy and stupid idea huh??

Here's what I do have though...a absolute love of the guitar. I love everything about them. I've been playing guitar in some form or another for almost 20 years now (I'm 36). I mostly play classical guitar, but I have played electric guitar and bass in bands. I consider myself a fairly good classical guitarist, although I'm almost completely self-taught. I've found, as time has gone on, that I love the instrument as much as I love the music it can make...if that makes any sense. I mean that I like looking at a guitar "almost" as much as listening to one. I have almost as great an appreciation of being able to craft a fine instrument as I do for the ability to play one well.

I think every musician (and I'm sure there are more than a few musicians on this forum, regarless of skill) has a sound or sounds that, when they hear it, stirs something inexplicable inside them. For me, the major tenth interval is one. Another is the last measure of Villa-Lobos' Etude No. 1. When I hear these things, it triggers some sort of "euphoria" mechanism in my brain; it stirs my soul. Some sounds, when put together in just the right way, embody all that is right and good in the world. Schubert's Ave Maria and Beethoven's Ninth Symphony come to mind...

Well, I feel the same way when I see some guitars. I'm just awe-struck. And just like I have a burning desire to reproduce the sounds that stir my soul, I also have developed the desire to create an instrument that will do likewise.

The question is, can I do it? I can play the guitar pretty well, and sometimes I reach that euphoric point. Can I do the same with building a guitar? And can I do it in the same manner as with playing...completely self-taught??

Here's what I'm going to do...research, research, research. I'm not the sort of person who just jumps into something blindly. (I've got a family to support, after all!!) My first step is to read a few books. I've ordered the Cumpiano book and the Bogdanovich book. I'm going to read these very closely over the next few months, while I continue to browse the online forums. After that, I might buy O'Brien's DVD. I'm going to look for opportunities to do things with wood. I've got a little 3/4-sized guitar that I'm attempting to replair for my kids. I have to replace the nut, and try to fix the fretboard (it's a very old guitar and the fretboard, which is laminated wood, is pulling away from the neck at the 1st fret). I've got a clamp and some glue on it now. I've got a friend who builds furniture (quite well). I'm going to pick his brain. And I'm going to continue to read, read, read.

Months from now, if I've found that this "luthier envy" isn't just some passing fancy, I'm going to buy a serviced classical guitar kit from LMI and see if I can at least do the basic assembly. If that goes well, I'll try to buy a basic kit (along with some proper tools) and do the whole thing from scratch. By "well" I don't mean create some magnificent work of art...I just mean a guitar that will stay together and can be played. I don't have any illusions of becoming the next Robert Ruck or Jose Ramirez. I would just like to make a guitar I could be proud of.

That's my plan. Someone talk me out of it.

Andy
Author:  PaulB [ Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
miramadar wrote:
...I want to build a guitar.

That's my plan. Someone talk me out of it.

Andy



Too late for that.

Sometimes I think the hardest part, when starting out, is deciding that maybe you can build a guitar. Most people don't ever get that far.

Don't let anyone talk you out of it, though, I suspect that it wouldn't occur to anybody here to try.

Welcome aboard and good luck!
Author:  Kevin Gallagher [ Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Andy,
It's awesome to hear that you're considering the route that you're going to take WHEN you build your guitar. Just know that you will have a great resource available 24/7 right here at the OLF as you open that box and smell the indescribable aroma that can only waft to a nose from a box of exotic wood guitar parts. From that moment we'll be anxious to hear updates on how things are going and to answer questions for you when you're stumped.

Have fun and get ready for a ride that will never stop inspiring you. The builders that you'll get to know here are some of the finest in the world and I'm honored to be able to communicate with them and be challenged and inspired by them on a regular basis.

Regards,
Kevin Gallagher/Omega Guitars
Author:  Hesh [ Mon Apr 14, 2008 9:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Hi Andy and welcome to the OLF my friend! [:Y:] [clap] [clap] [clap]

As for can you build a guitar? Absolutely!!!!

Your story is very much like mine. Prior to starting to build guitars several years ago about the only thing that I had ever made prior was dinner reservations....... I had no wood working experience, no tools, no one to teach me, and nothing but a life long passion for the guitar.

Your plan sounds like a good one and I would add that a kit is a great way to get started too. Some kits require fewer tools and jigs to complete and are a more economical way to get your feet wet.

Most of all know this - it is entirely possible with a little care to build an instrument that is better sounding then anything that you could purchase from a traditional store. Many of us will not even pick up factory instruments anymore - they just don't flip our switches any more.

You have the bug and the passion, your approach sounds great to me, and I suspect that you will do great with your guitar building efforts.

Lastly - get to know a member here named Waddy. He is also a classical guy and is just finishing his first. From the looks of it Waddy built a superb instrument and would be a very good guy to learn from. And knowing Waddy as I do I am sure that he would help you too.

Again welcome to the OLF.
Author:  miramadar [ Mon Apr 14, 2008 10:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Quote:
Lastly - get to know a member here named Waddy. He is also a classical guy and is just finishing his first. From the looks of it Waddy built a superb instrument and would be a very good guy to learn from. And knowing Waddy as I do I am sure that he would help you too.


Actually, I'm also a member of the DelCamp classical guitar forum. Waddy posted a thread over there about his guitar project...and viewing it and the guitar is what has inspired me to try it. It's an awesome-looking guitar and to think that it's his first one is just unbelieveable!! Waddy also did everyone a HUGE favor and posted a great number of pictures he took throughout his project. Judging by the pics, its appears to me that Waddy is no stranger to the workshop...like I am. That's something I'll have to overcome. His pictures were really great because they show the real dedication, attention to detail and methodical nature you've got to have. That really appeals to me and makes me think I can do it. I was a philosophy major in college, and so I've got this thing about logical reasoning. My profession is workforce management in a call center...which requires A LOT of attention to detail. And the way Waddy created his pictorial diary, it just clicked for me. But yeah, he's a giant inspiration to me personally, and a lot of others, I'm sure. And, from reading his posts, he does seem like a great guy. Hopefully he won't mind me picking his brain a little once I get rolling. :D

Thanks to you all for the words of encouragement and the welcome. I admit that sometimes, when I try to think about all the little things that I think go into the creation of a guitar, I think to myself "You Idiot, you can't do this!". But there's a bigger voice in me that says "You Can".

I wonder how I'll feel about it when, like you say, I open that box of exotic (albeit 2nd or 3rd grade) woods and smell the smells and feel the material for the first time. That will be the pivotal moment I think. If I do my homework, I'll know I can do it. If I don't, I'll be calling LMI for a Return Authorization Number eek !!
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Mon Apr 14, 2008 11:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
The good thing about this hobby (passion) is that you can get started with relatively few tools. 'Course, you will have to get a few as time goes on.

Don't know if you went to college, but the learning curve here is by far less expensive. I blew it on my first attempt (total cost of blowing it, about $250). Started over, asked the wise ones here a lot of questions, and now I am on my final lap. Crap, for four weekends of golf, I can learn a lifetime of skills with these wonderful folks.

So can you.

Mike

PS: Do yourself a BIG favor and contact John Hall at bluescreek (one of the sponsors here)
Author:  LuthierSupplier [ Mon Apr 14, 2008 11:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Hi Andy!
A big welcome to the forum. Your story sounds exactly like mine when I started out. I had very few tools, didn't know what a bandsaw was, or never seen a router used. I actually built my first from scratch but with the help of a local luthier - Robert O'Brien. So I was lucky to hook up with him. But I still did about 70% of the work without his help. So the answer is 'yes' you can do it. Hookup with your furniture building friend, as his thickness sander will save you hours of work! Good luck and ask lots of questions!
Author:  Ken Franklin [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Andy, another good thing to do is visit some of the luthier websites for techniques and inspiration. It's amazing how much great information is out there.
Author:  Sam Price [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:27 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Hesh wrote:
Many of us will not even pick up factory instruments anymore - they just don't flip our switches any more.


Amen to that.

Welcome Andy. :)
Author:  Chansen [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 1:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Welcome Andy!
I'm relatively new to this too. I say new because I am still on my first build... I say relatively because it's been 13 months now (well there was a 6 month or so sabbatical :oops: ) and I'm not quite finished. I'm in the same boat, the only tool I had was a little drive and even that flickered a bit with a few frustrating points. But all in all this is the coolest thing I have ever done and hope someday to be able to claim #100 like our friend here Grumpy - even if it takes me 50 years yo do so. Good luck with your first build and please post pics of your progress!!
Author:  Billy T [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 1:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Building is not playing!
There are many that can't even play the guitar that build. (of course there's more that can't build but play :D )

I say try it and see if you like it! If you don't have much wood working experience it may be a little difficult but then again maybe not.

If you run into a rough spot these are the guys to talk too they build some pretty mean machines!
Author:  Dave Fifield [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
'ello Andy! Welcome to the OLF [:Y:]

Dive right in, the water's fine! You'll love it :D

I'm still building my first guitar. I was apprehensive at first, even with prior woodworking experience, but once I got stuck in, with the help of all the great books/plans/journals/DVD's/forums/vendors out there, I found it a most enjoyable and rewarding activity.

I'm not a guitarist (I'm a keyboard player, who is slowly learning to play the guitar), but I'm not letting that stop me. I can tell the difference between a clean sounding guitar and a duffer. I'm planning to make many many guitars in the future, so most of my time on this first build has been spent making jigs! Subsequent guitar builds should go a lot faster, and with no errors too, hopefully!

Anyway, bite the bullet, dip your toes in the water, and just do it! Oh, and remember, we like pictures, lots of pictures (just like Waddy's posts)!

Cheers,
Dave F.

P.S. Don't forget to post a picture of yourself for Billy T's archives of OLF members! I must remember to do that myself one day soon.....yah, right! laughing6-hehe
Author:  Don Williams [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
miramadar wrote:
...I want to build a guitar.......That's my plan. Someone talk me out of it.


Well...if someone had done that for me years ago, I could have saved thousands and thousands of dollars for retirement! LOL

Once bitten.... well, you're just going to have to go down that road and see. I'm betting that in a few years you'll be a regular around here and showing off pictures of your 10th guitar.

laughing6-hehe
Author:  Matt Bouchie [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Hi Andy,

I've been lurking here for a few weeks but thought I'd respond to you with my first ever post.

My story is very similar to yours (except that I don't play classical or very well). I researched and researched for a couple of years after I got the "crazy idea" into my head. After reading several books, I decided that I might need some help since I had zero woodworking experience. I started looking into classes and eventually found a luthier here in NH who works with students, Alan Carruth. I emailed him last August and asked about building a guitar in his class with zero woodworking experience. He responded that some of the best student guitars to come out of his shop were built by people with no woodworking experience. That made me feel tons more confident so I signed up. I started last September and go every other week on Saturdays. I think it was a good idea because there have been many steps where I would have had a lot of trouble figuring things out. Plus, Alan's been great at showing me how to use all these tools. I know I would have struggled a lot more without his help! Also, I think I'm a little slower than others because I had no clue how to use a hand plane or a scraper or a drill press planer or a band saw or a chisel or you name it. But now I'm getting a lot better with these things and every class I feel more and more like I could do this on my own. If you can find a luthier near you who offers classes like Alan does, I suggest looking into taking one. It's really been extremely helpful to me and I'm going to end up with a really cool guitar that will sound awesome that was built by ME!

The other neat thing about going to a class like this is that there are other people there who are obviously into building guitars. I don't know about you but none of my friends or family are into building guitars and they all get quite bored hearing me talk about it non-stop. Being in the class gives me an opportunity to talk to people about it face-to-face who are actually interested. Like others have said, though, once you build one you will want to build more! I've already got my second planned! I even bought wood for the top already. I supposed I should finish this first one before looking too far ahead but it doesn't hurt too much to think a little about the next one.

Matt

PS I almost forgot! I'm building an OM with a bearclaw European Spruce top and Indian Rosewood back and sides with Bloodwood binding.
Author:  hoosieruke [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
PaulB wrote:
miramadar wrote:

Don't let anyone talk you out of it, though, I suspect that it wouldn't occur to anybody here to try.


I was at Rockler yesterday. They are running a sale on some really great figured bubinga. A customer asked the clerk what it could be used for. Tables were suggested. I piped up and suggested guitars and was met with a blank stare. Oh well.

Go and build. I read a great quote today re: creating art...

"The thing to remember about art, is to dispense with success and failure and to just get on with it." Sue Ellen Bridgers, writing instructor at John C. Campbell Folk School
Author:  Bill Greene [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Talk you out of it? Heck, that's one of the more sensible things I've read on here, especially that second paragraph. :D

I've built two: 90% of the first one was with a teacher, 10% of the second one was with a teacher. In the meantime, I've met some incredible people, and made some significant friends. So that's my only recommendation: use your online resources to find someone in your area who is a builder, and see if they'll let you peer over their shoulder for a bit, borrow some advice here and there, make recommendations on tools...or better yet, let you try'em out until you can make an informed decision on your own. That'll help a lot with the learning curve.

So, post up where you are. You might have more friends in this crazy hobby than you think!
Author:  douglas ingram [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 1:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Andy,

We've all been there, contemplating that first build, thinking "can I do this?".

The hardest part is starting.

Its also easy to over-think the first project. Get a good book, make it your friend. Pick a good first guitar to build (one that you will enjoy playing) and get good plans. Consider the total project as a series of smaller, discrete, projects which accumulate into a finished larger project. That way you won't so easily get overwhelmed but the guitar building in its entirety.
Author:  Jonas [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
miramadar wrote:
...I want to build a guitar.

That's my plan. Someone talk me out of it.

Andy


Don't do it! It's a curse! Once you start you'll never stop until someone chops your arms off. But even then i guess you could use a CNC with your nose...

just kidding, it's not THAT much of a curse. It's soo much fun and you'll learn soo much it will change your way of thinking.

do it [:Y:]


, andrew
Author:  Robbie O'Brien [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
I was in your shoes years ago. I had no tools and no space to build. After looking at the prices of materials I had all but talked myself out of it. My wife was the one who talked me back into it.
I say go for it!
Author:  WaddyThomson [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Hi, Andy, welcome to the OLF. This place is great. I did much of what you are doing, i.e., lots of research before actually cutting a piece of wood, or even buying a piece of wood. I don't recommend waiting for 25 years to pull the trigger, though, like I did. Now I'm old, and don't play or move as well as I used to, and I probably don't have time to excel at this venture. There are so many good resources. Another good book, if you are into classical construction, is the Courtnall book, "Making Master Guitars". It has a lot of information in it about famous builders and their guitars and philosophies of building and what they do when building. It also takes you through a complete build in the fully traditional manner. Then, you couple that with information from this forum, and some folks here who really do a lot with classical construction, and you have the beginnings of an education in the process. And it is a process. One made of hundreds of small projects that finally come together as a guitar. Take a look at my build album, below, and if you have any questions, or if I can help in any way, from what I know (very little), I'll be glad to tell you what I can, and help you find someone else to really answer your question. There are lots of folks, here, who can, and will, really give good answers.
Author:  Robbie O'Brien [ Tue Apr 15, 2008 3:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
I was in your shoes years ago. I had no tools and no space to build. After looking at the prices of materials I had all but talked myself out of it. My wife was the one who talked me back into it.
I say go for it!
Author:  miramadar [ Thu Apr 17, 2008 8:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I've Got This Craaaazy Idea...
Well, I've received the Cumpiano and Bogdanovich books. I'm starting with the Cumpiano text first since it seems to focus on the more traditional methods. I read the first 4 chapters last night and I'm very happy to report that I seem to understand everything pretty completely thus far. Some things, like the way they described how to create a stacked heelblock, I had to read a couple of time to understand exactly, but I think I caught on to everything pretty easily. The pictures in the book are in black and white, so that makes it a little hard to actually tell what's photographed...especially since I'm not familiar with the process anyway. But all in all it seems to be a very good book and very well written.

Thanks again to everyone for the encouragement. I'll keep you posted.
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