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Binding issues
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=16999		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  gozierdt [ Sun Apr 27, 2008 6:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Binding issues
I'm having trouble getting a nice looking, tight fit on the second piece of binding & purflings on the back. The problem comes from the binding being (usually) a little too long at the top of the body after I start gluing at the heel graft and work up and around the body. So there I sit, with glue drying, while trying to make a precise cut on the binding and purfling- doesn't give me the time to do the nice, tight fit I'd like. I know the problem is caused by the binding fitting tighter when I put the binding tape ever inch or so, which I haven't been doing while doing the dry fit. Is there a way to get it to fit tighter while doing the dry fit without wasting all that tape? I'm thinking as I write this that I could sticky tape the bottom end tight, then wrap my 40' of elastic tape around the body almost all the way to the top, then do the final fit- I'll try that next time. Does anyone have a better, or different technique? I'm using wood bindings exclusively, and gluing it with Titebond I.
Author:  Alain Moisan [ Sun Apr 27, 2008 6:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Binding issues
I always leave the bindings and purfilng a little proud (or 'too tall', as you said) and then level it down with a cabinet scraper once the glue is dry. I'm pretty sure that's the method used by most people here too.
Author:  Rvsgtr [ Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Binding issues
If somebody's got a better way than taping dry, removing everything, then starting all over with glue let me know.

I always fit it close with just minimal taping then do a dry run with tape about every 2 inches or so. Sometimes I have to do a little adjusting. I try to "trim" the ends with a small sanding block and some 150 fre-cut being very slow and deliberate to try to keep the ends square both ways. Sometimes this takes a while. All in all the taping, gluing and scraping take about the same time for me as the fitting. I do find that with hardwood bindings they must fit just right...a little to long and you'll have gaps trying to appear near the end of the piece you'r running that are very hard to close up. I've pulled off more than one peice trust me [headinwall] . Plastic is a little more forgiving it seems although I much prefer wooden bindings unless trying to replicate a vintage guitar or something to a customer's order. I usually try to encourage wood bindings though.

Sounds like you're doing it right it just gets tedious there sometimes. Good luck.

SR
Author:  Hesh [ Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Binding issues
Gene my friend I dry tape and cut the butt end to size. I always start with the tape and glue at the butt end of the guitar. Then while gluing, I use Titebond for binding, when I get to the neck end of the body I stop with the tape about 6" from the joint. I press it into place and draw a line with a pencil at what I believe to be the center. Next I use a razor saw (Zona 42 TPI) and holding the binding just off the guitar I make the cut and continue to tape and glue it in place.

I also think that Terry Kennedy just showed some pretty neat little jigs he made for cutting bindings and purflings and if I remember correctly one of these jigs was a great looking little miter box designed just for this final, fitted cut.
Author:  Alain Moisan [ Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Binding issues
Ok, now I see I totally misunderstood the problem.

I actually sruggle with the same problem myself...
Author:  Todd Rose [ Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Binding issues
This issue is one of the reasons why I'm going to try the wick-in CA glue method on the guitar I'm building right now. No need to untape and start over with glue after the dry fitting. Just wick in CA after it's all perfectly fitted and taped up. Sounds very good to me. Thanks to all the great tips I got in a thread I started recently about this method, I feel ready to go forward with it and fully expect it to work out great. I should be doing it this coming week, and I'll probably report back.
Author:  gozierdt [ Sun Apr 27, 2008 8:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Binding issues
Thanks everybody. The lesson is that, as usual in making a really fine instrument (I'm not there yet, but I keep trying), there are no short-cuts. Why do I have to keep learning that [headinwall] [headinwall]
Author:  Jeremy Knight [ Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Binding issues
I also use exclusively wood bindings and LMI instrument glue. And I run into the same problem. I made a little miter box out of a small piece of HDPE plastic that keeps all my initial miter cuts at 45 degrees using a small, find backsaw.

Glueing from the butt-joint, I pause the glueing at the upper-bout and cut it close on the miter box. If I need to trim it I use an extra sharp chisel pressing down on the HDPE plastic. I always try to err on the long side rather than cutting it short. Once it's too short, there's nothing to do but start over.

I've also started taking off the tape after the glue has set for about 10 minutes. This allows me the opportunity to make some minor adjustments with a iron to soften the glue and a little retaping to cinch up any gaps that happened in the process.
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