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voicing on a first guitar
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=17171		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Neil Gardiner [ Tue May 13, 2008 9:39 am ]
Post subject:  voicing on a first guitar
So I am building my first guitar from scratch.

It is Mayan Walnut with an Alaskan Cedar top.

I am just carving the braces on the top now. I am carving, tapping, carving, tapping.

My question is where should I be removing material. The tap tone seems to be quite high pitched at this point. So I probably want to remove more for more bass. Where should I be concentrating my carving? Just on the X-brace?

Thanks
Neil
Author:  Bruce Dickey [ Tue May 13, 2008 9:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: voicing on a first guitar
Neil, Pictures are a boon in this area.

It's amazing what a trained eye can pick up and give you feedback on as you progress.

Start with standard sizes, and start your shaving, sanding.

Many of us can tell you if it's over-braced.

Tapping is very subjective. and so is judging without touch and sound. Good luck.
Author:  Mike Collins [ Tue May 13, 2008 3:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: voicing on a first guitar
Neil;
Al Carruth will be the builder to contact for this info!
He's available in the forum!
mike [:Y:]
Author:  Steve Saville [ Tue May 13, 2008 6:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: voicing on a first guitar
Neil,
Welcome to the forum!
If you post a picture or two of your bracing, some of us could answer a little better.
What size are you building?
How thick is your top and how tall and wide are your braces?
Think about removing width, not just height from the braces. Make the braces narrower towards their top. That removes mass to let the top move without reducing a lot of stiffness. Remember, stiffness is increased much more with height than width of the brace.
Be very careful not to run the chisel into the top.
You'll want to cap the X-brace joint with a thin (.05") piece of brace material and think about tapering the x braces on lower bought to the top rather than in-letting them into the rims.
Keep carving until the tap tone is pleasing and musical to you, but the key is knowing not to go too far. That comes with experience, but you probably do not want to be much less than 9/16" at the X and that should be your highest point. If you get to the point where the top sounds dull and muddy, you've gone too far. That is the point when you'll know if you have gone too far. You want to get close to that.
If you have the time and material, you might want to keep carving and listen while you go too far on purpose. Then remove the braces, and put new ones back on, and start carving again, but this time, stop short of going too far. If you do that, you'll be way ahead of the game.
Remember, this is just my opinion based on my experience.
No warranty/guaranty etc. :D
I think it should give you a good start.
Author:  Jody [ Tue May 13, 2008 7:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: voicing on a first guitar
The first one is tough on your own . , you may get some ideas from this thread ... Jody
viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=17118&hilit=luthiers+wild
Author:  Neil Gardiner [ Thu May 15, 2008 7:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: voicing on a first guitar
Here's some pictures I took last night. The guitar is an OM size. Back will be Mayan Walnut. Top is Alaskan Yellow Cedar. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Neil
[img][/img]
Author:  Neil Gardiner [ Thu May 15, 2008 7:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: voicing on a first guitar
Wait...what am I doing wrong. How do I post pictures?
Author:  Steve Brown [ Thu May 15, 2008 8:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: voicing on a first guitar
I had problems with pictures too. The advice that I got worked. Set up an account on http://photobucket.com/ then cut and paste the url address for your image using the Img tool between the brackets[img][/img]

That will work and we would love to see you pictures!

Steve
Author:  Neil Gardiner [ Thu May 15, 2008 9:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: voicing on a first guitar
Let's try this...here is a link to my photobucket page.

http://s279.photobucket.com/albums/kk158/neogardguitar/?special_track=nav_tab_album
Author:  Flori F. [ Thu May 15, 2008 9:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: voicing on a first guitar
I'm no expert (just building my first too), but Bill Cumpiano suggests that you actually want to carve your braces so that the top loses its musical tone when tapped (while unjoined from the sides). The exact language is something along the lines of "you want the tap to produce a low, fluttery sound." Once you join the top to the sides, the musical tone of the tap will return, big time. I've got the body of my guitar (OM) together and, so far, my experience matches his description.

You can also continue to carve the braces down once you attach the sides, but I found it's hard to do so without marring the top with the chisel.

As far as achieving the tap tone you want goes, I went to a couple of guitar shops nearby and tapped the tops and backs of OM's. I just played the ones I liked the sound of best, tapped, and tried to remember the sound. I'm trying to replicate that in my build. So far, so good. But who knows how it'll sound when played. eek

There's also a good deal of literature available on the web that discusses which movements of the soundboard influence bass, treble, and mid range response. I've found Ervin Somogyi's essays interesting.

Don't know if that helps. Just thought I'd share.
Author:  Steve Saville [ Thu May 15, 2008 10:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: voicing on a first guitar
Copy and paste the IMG code to add pictures here.
Here is your top.

Image
Author:  Neil Gardiner [ Thu May 15, 2008 10:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: voicing on a first guitar
Thanks Steve

Finally got it!

Neil



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