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| Blue Steel vs. White Steel http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=17306 |
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| Author: | Michael Jin [ Wed May 21, 2008 11:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Blue Steel vs. White Steel |
So as I was looking through some Japanese chisels, I noticed that they were often divided into two categories: blue steel and white steel. None of the sites I've been to seem to provide any comparison or any information at all as to what the difference between the two is and what functions each is better suited for. Could anyone here fill me in? I also noticed that western chisels generally are not divided into these categories. Why is it that the Japanese separate their chisels like this while western companies don't? |
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| Author: | PaulB [ Thu May 22, 2008 1:02 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Blue Steel vs. White Steel |
Have a look here http://www.woodworking-forum.com/woodwo ... 36937.html Should answer your question |
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| Author: | PaulB [ Thu May 22, 2008 3:52 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Blue Steel vs. White Steel |
Ok, so to save people going over to that link to see what's what, I'll post the important info here: White steel is a common shorthand name for white paper steel ("shirogami hagane") which can be any of several fairly simple high carbon, water hardening steel grades. The carbon content varies by grade, and runs from 0.8 to 1.4%. The range of carbon content within a grade is a tight 0.1%. For example, the carbon content of Shirogami Hagani No1A is specified to be between 1.3 and 1.4%. Each grade also contains 0.1-0.2% silicon and 0.2-0.3% manganese, and only trace amounts of the impurities sulfur and phosphorus. Blue paper steel ("aogami hagane") is also offered in several grades, with carbon content ranging similarly to the "white" grades. However, blue steel contains the additional alloying elements chromium and tungsten, and one grade ("aogami super") also contains molybdenum and vanadium. The blue steels can be quenched in water or oil, whereas most of the white grades need a faster quench and require water. So, I'm not an expert on steel, but I'd expect that a carbon steel that has added chromium, tungsten, molybdenum, or vanadium, to be a bit tougher than standard carbon (white) steel. Whether that equates to a chisel that holds an edge better (or for longer) is for someone else to say, 'cause I don't know. Cheers, Paul |
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| Author: | Alexandru Marian [ Thu May 22, 2008 7:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Blue Steel vs. White Steel |
I'm shopping for japanese chisels atm too, and I will probably get white steel. In theory blue will hold their edge better if you work more in hardwoods, but that's not really the case in instrument building where we mostly do delicate paring on softwoods. I am sure either steel will work just as great, as long as the maker did a good job, AND the tool is well sharpened! |
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| Author: | Eric Mathre [ Thu May 22, 2008 9:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Blue Steel vs. White Steel |
Sorry for the OT reply, but am I really the only one who is low-brow enough in their movie tastes that they initially thought this post was somehow going to be about Zoolander? |
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| Author: | Michael Jin [ Thu May 22, 2008 10:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Blue Steel vs. White Steel |
emathre wrote: Sorry for the OT reply, but am I really the only one who is low-brow enough in their movie tastes that they initially thought this post was somehow going to be about Zoolander? How would you read it as being related to Zoolander? 
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| Author: | PaulB [ Thu May 22, 2008 10:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Blue Steel vs. White Steel |
The first hit I got for "blue steel" on google was an entry in Wikipedia for Zoolander. |
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| Author: | eugeniodilampp [ Fri May 23, 2008 9:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Blue Steel vs. White Steel |
Dear Michael, I am having a few of fishtail kusumi chisels. Japan Woodworker (http://www.japanwoodworker.com/dept.asp ... t_id=12711) blue steel, stay very sharp, cheap but nice quality. a friendly of mine is who pro classical guitar luthier suggest them to me. Eugenio |
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