Official Luthiers Forum!
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/

Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=17357		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Lillian F-W [ Tue May 27, 2008 6:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
Thanks Todd for the link. Your timing is wonderful.


Todd's suggestion of printing the thread is a very valid one. After it falls off the page it could be years (2+ so far) before it makes it to the library. At the very least, save it as an html file. I have several links in my bookmarks that are for all intents and purposes, dead because they went to purgatory and are still waiting.
Author:  JJ Donohue [ Tue May 27, 2008 7:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
Thanks for the heads up on this, Todd. Mario's Guitarmaker article was also a great tutorial but I'm still just a little squeamish about using the Lancelot (rotary chainsaw) for shaping. The tools used in Larry's thread are similar to what I do. I really like his method of organizing the order of operations.

One thing I don't do is to glue the FB so early to the neck. From what I saw, he glues the FB while everything is still fairly square and rather beefy. I glue the fretted FB when most of the shaping is completed and all I need do is blend into the sides of the FB. My rationale is to allow the neck wood to become stable at the various stages before reducing its size. I know there are other opinions and methods which produce great results, but I seem to have fallen into a predictable and reproduceable method. I'd be interested in yours as well as others opinions regarding when to glue on the FB.

Another departure from that method is when I rout the tenon. Once the body is closed up and bound, I use the Woolson neck tenon routing jig to find the angle leading to the bridge and then rout the tenon to that specific angle. I do this while the neck is squarish and after the TR slot is routed. That slot is used as a center indicator on the jig. As a result, I have found that my flossing and neck fitting activities have been significantly reduced.

Neck making continues to be the single most enjoyable operation for me and the MIMF tutorial was a welcome and thought provoking explanation of one person's method. Like Lillian, I have saved it for future reference.
Author:  SkyHigh [ Tue May 27, 2008 8:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
This is great Todd! It actualy makes sense to a newbie like me. Now I need to go get me a bastard file

Have couple questions.

-What can I do to replace his bull nose plane? or should I make a plane like that?

-How do you make sure you're taking down even on both sides of the neck? The caliper is used to measure overall thickness of the neck but don't see how you can measure the contour of the neck and make sure its identical shape on both sides.

-Do you glue on your FB before or after shaping the neck?

THanks!
Author:  Dave White [ Tue May 27, 2008 8:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
Todd,

Thanks - that was interesting. I particularly like that simple but clever jig bolted to the bench that he made for holding the neck.
Author:  Alain Desforges [ Tue May 27, 2008 8:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
Well guys, I'll have to take your word for it... :roll:
Author:  JJ Donohue [ Tue May 27, 2008 8:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
Alain Desforges wrote:
Well guys, I'll have to take your word for it... :roll:


Why the skepticism? I sense you may have had some bad experiences on this? idunno

C'mon, Dude...get it off your chest! beehive
Author:  jhowell [ Tue May 27, 2008 9:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
Todd--

Thanks for the heads-up. That is a nice tutorial and will come in very handy as I am about to embark on my first scratch neck. I'd also like to put a tip o' the hat out to Lance and Brock for allowing these cross forum posts. They are invaluable as a learning tool and it is refreshing to have them seen as colleagues and not competitors! [:Y:] [:Y:]
Author:  Mark Maquillan [ Tue May 27, 2008 9:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
I just saved the article as a Word file for reference later. Thanks

Mark
Author:  Dave Anderson [ Tue May 27, 2008 10:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
That's a good one Todd. Thanks
I glue my fretboard on after I shape the neck close to finish for
the same reason JJ stated. I do like making necks a lot. For me
it's one of those enjoyable tasks in guitar building!
Author:  douglas ingram [ Tue May 27, 2008 10:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
For anyone interested in using an angle grinder for wood carving, (like I do a lot!) you don't HAVE to use the Lancelot chainsaw cutter. You can use any number of abrasive discs, according to the speed and surface finish you want. I start with 24 grit and finish with 100, but you can easily start with 50 or 80 grit and carve away. OK, so it makes a lot of dust, open the door!

And practice on scrap.

Also, the MIMF library entry process has changed to speed it up.
Author:  Howard Klepper [ Tue May 27, 2008 10:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
I also have the board and binding on before shaping. But from there it's very different. I first get close on the thickness in the center with a spokeshave (recently have begun using the belt sander holding the neck across the table. Power shaping of course increases your ability to err. I also use a small drawknife for roughing, which is a very aggressive tool and I disclaim all responsibility for mentioning it). I check thickness with a caliper. Then I do longitudinal facets (I thought this was how everybody did it unless they have a power system) with a spokeshave, and then Nickelson rasps; when these get fine enough I round with a file. The file strokes are a combination of moving longitudinally and sweeping around the latitude. I rough the heel and headstock transitions while doing my facets, but don't finish them with rasp and file until the shaft is pretty much done. I don't use a plane at all, except sometimes to rough the sides down close to the width of the board at the very start. Spindle sander is a great help in getting a good transition to the heel in the center of the neck, where the change to end grain can cause trouble. I check for a straight line along the center of the shaft with a 6" rule, but I find that hand and eyeball are pretty accurate on this, and the faceting method helps keep the longitudinal lines straight. I agree that the last place to shape is the transition to the fretboard binding; I leave a strong 1/16" or so until I am filing.

I never time myself doing anything in the shop, but I guesstimate that this takes about an hour. When the shape feels good I put it aside for a few hours or overnight and then feel it again; I find that when you have been shaping for a while, your sense of it gets fatigued and coming back the next day you may notice places that aren't right. I pay particular attention to the bass side where the thumb rests; I flatten the curve a bit along that side for comfort. I'll come back to it a few times to get the feel right and any little high or flat spots shaped, and then I sand. Sanding is mostly with a tri-folded strip of paper held taught between both hands and a longitudinal push and pull.

In my experience, a beginner is much more likely to leave too much wood on a neck than to take too much off. FWIW.
Author:  Dave White [ Tue May 27, 2008 11:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
ToddStock wrote:
I'm actually not wild about the neck holder, as it places a lot of stress right at the turn of the neck should you be a little too agressive...I use something close to what a lot of other builders use, which is a little more flexible in terms of positioning.


Todd,

It's a good test of the scarfe joint :) My method is a lot like Howard describes, cutting facets with a spokeshave and I clamp the headstock to my Workmate leaving the neck free-floating and have the fretboard end wedged against my thigh or belly (plenty of padding there :oops: ). If I had a wizzy vice like yours I'd probably make a similar jig though. One trick for sanding is to cut strips of sandpaper after putting a couple of strips of the brown tape used for binding on the back. You can then bootstrap or push-pull the strip as Howard describes.
Author:  jhowell [ Tue May 27, 2008 1:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
These tips are wonderful! I do have a question -- Do you fit/floss the heal to the body before gluing the fretboard? In my limited experience, I have found that flossing is a whole lot easier with the fretboard off of the neck.
Author:  Billy T [ Tue May 27, 2008 2:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
JJ Donohue wrote:
Alain Desforges wrote:
Well guys, I'll have to take your word for it... :roll:
Why the skepticism? I sense you may have had some bad experiences on this? idunno C'mon, Dude...get it off your chest! beehive

Now I don't feel so bad about putting you in a sports bra JJ!!! :D
Author:  Terence Kennedy [ Tue May 27, 2008 4:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Good Neck Shaping Photo Essay on MIMF
We had one of our 10 perfect days in MN today and I was doing a couple of necks so I moved outside. Here's a picture with some of my weapons. The Nicholson and Grobet rasps are great.
Terry
Image
Page 1 of 1 All times are UTC - 5 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/