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Tools You Need and what they Cost
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Author:  Sylvan [ Thu Jun 05, 2008 2:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Tools You Need and what they Cost
I have finally put together a list of tools I use in the making of acoustic instruments and their approximate costs. I made up the list for my guitar students but thought some here may benefit. See it at my web site or go directly http://www.wellsguitars.com/Articles/Tool_Costs.html. I would appreciate your thoughts and suggestions to make the list as complete as possible.
Author:  Goobie [ Thu Jun 05, 2008 3:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Hey! did you break into my shop and take inventory of my tools?! :mrgreen:
Honestly you've pretty much just described my shop!

A couple of comments...
While the tools on this list will certainly allow you to build a guitar, there's a lot on there a person can do without. For example, with a decent table saw, you could probably get away without having the miter saw. Then there are those who will argue that a table saw is unnecessary if you have a good band saw. Things like the belt sander, while I would never be without one, are also technically not needed. It's one of those tools where you can trade money to save time.

EDIT: You might also want to add a Humidifier/de-humidifier and a fretting hammer to the list as well!

All in all it's a pretty complete list!

Cheers,
Chad
Author:  Sylvan [ Thu Jun 05, 2008 3:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Chad -
Great comments. I have added the humidifier and dehumidifier to the list! I left out the fret hammer since my students do not learn that method. Thanks!
Author:  Frank Aarre [ Thu Jun 05, 2008 3:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
depends on the motivation for building, but a lot of these power tools are not really needed, at least for a hobby builder.
I'm about to start my first build, i do have quite a lot of the powertools on your list. But i'm going to be doing most of my work with hand tools, there's a lot that can be done with a couple of good planes, scrapers and chisels. once you learn how to use and set up these tools properly they're fairly quick to work with too.

most of the fun for me with a project like this, is working with simple hand tools to produce a nice(hopefully) instrument. just my opinion...
Author:  Burton LeGeyt [ Thu Jun 05, 2008 4:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Hey Sylvan!

I think a dust collector and some pipe/hosing is a necessity, especially for the thickness sander at least. I have most of those tools and for many of them paid a lot less than you have listed. It's a great list!
Author:  John Buckley [ Thu Jun 05, 2008 4:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Sylvan,

This is a great list that I'm sure will be very helpful. I just started out about a year ago, and the only thing I didn't notice on your list was hand planes. I guess they're not absolutely essential, but I found I used them a good deal. I ended up spending a fair amount on the jack, low angle and modelmaker planes (Lee Valley) I got. My only other comment regards the going rate for the Performax (Jet) 16-32. It's about $1,000 plus shipping now, though I did recently see it on sale for $900.

Thanks,

johnj
Author:  GregH [ Thu Jun 05, 2008 4:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
If I had seen that list before I started buying tools and wood, I would have started with the alcohol and spent extra - for a good scotch.

:shock: :shock:
Author:  Mike Kroening [ Thu Jun 05, 2008 5:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
GregH wrote:
If I had seen that list before I started buying tools and wood, I would have started with the alcohol and spent extra - for a good scotch.

:shock: :shock:
ROTFLMAO!!! Single Malt anyone :)

Greg someday we need to meet in Grapevine for a Scotch!!!

Mike
Author:  Dave-SKG [ Thu Jun 05, 2008 6:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Most important of all .... CASH and lots of it!
Author:  Lillian F-W [ Thu Jun 05, 2008 10:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
eek Well, that certainly explains why its taken me 8 years to get ready for my first build.

Greg, I'm with you. If I had seen that bottom line, I probably would have just had a guitar made and pocketed the extra $4000.


Now that WAS and TAS has set in, I have to build.
Author:  Dave Fifield [ Fri Jun 06, 2008 3:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Interesting list Sylvan! I think I've spent more than that and I already had all my woodworking power tools before I started making guitars! I've made/invested in some of the best tools, measuring devices, and jigs available though. Some of the prices in there seem a bit on the low side to me, but then, some of them seem a bit high also. Overall they probably even out to about right. [:Y:]

I have to agree with Todd about the go-bar deck. Of course, a newbie will need a few clamps, but for about $350 - $400 they could have a complete go-bar deck setup AND the handful of clamps they will need.

Whatever you do, don't let my wife see this list! She thinks (knows!) I spend too much on my hobbies already. :mrgreen:

Cheers,
Dave F.
Author:  Laurent Brondel [ Fri Jun 06, 2008 5:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
A list like this is a great idea. But the overall cost on this one is sure to scare a lot of chaps…
I think it would be a good thing to encourage people building some of their own tools like dishes, go-bar deck, mould, Fox-style bender, cam clamps and so on. While it is considerably cheaper to do so it's also a good exercise in accuracy and patience before building an instrument. Although as somebody pointed out, none of those are required to do a 1st build.
Also tools can be had much, much cheaper. A quick look on Craig's list and/or your local classified adds paper (Uncle Henry's around here) can save a lot of money. As an example my vintage Delta Homecraft 8" tablesaw/4" jointer combo (3/4 HP motor) was purchased for $125 and it's perfect size for anything lutherie. I never paid more than $50 for a router/laminate trimmer and I have PC, DeWalt and Crafstman models in the shop. I bought all my planes and chisels either on eBay or at lawn sales for a song. Also a Delta 4 x 36 stationary belt sander can be had for around $120 etc. etc.
I would add a few more sandpaper grits (120, 180, 320), a whole set of dry/wet sandpaper sheets for finishing with assorted blocks, steel wool and finally buffing/polishing materials (buffer optional, a buffing wheel can be mounted on a drill-press).
Author:  Sylvan [ Fri Jun 06, 2008 7:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Thanks everyone! I agree with Laurent and Todd's thought that most of the tools can be had for less money. If fact, I encourage student's to peruse Craig's List and eBay, as well as their own local classifieds for tools. But the list published is not just for my students but for everyone on the 'net and the idea was to give everyone some idea of the cost of all of these tools. It is not intended to be "the last word"; to the contrary, the idea was to give everyone "the first word" and let them take it from there. After all, the list is also just a tool and a free one at that!
Author:  D.L.Huskey [ Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
What Laurent said.

I would also want at least a couple of precision squares. I use a 3" or 6" more than others.
Author:  Howard Klepper [ Fri Jun 06, 2008 12:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
I think your prices are a little low on the stationary machines, if they are bought new.

I would drop the chop or radial arm; not needed, and takes a lot of wall space for its table.
I don't seem to need vacuum clamping; but if you use it you need a bunch of stuff besides the pump.
I would make the 6" belt sander a combination w/12" disc and add $100+ to the price. I use the disc all the time.
Don't see the need for a Dremel if you have a laminate trimmer, but I do have a flex shaft (coincidentally a Dremel, but a good one).
Binding machine seems pricey; a good item to make yourself.
I don't have a router table, but I do have an overarm router. I may add a router table, but don't think it's a necessity.
I'd buy the radius dishes if I used them.

I don't see the ROS.

I think a grinder is a necessity.

A small block plane; also, a bigger plane like a #5 could replace the jointer.
A couple of carvers gouges are nice, as is a finger plane.

An electronic tuner.
A stash of strings.
I don't think of bits as expendable supplies, but they do sometimes need replacing. On the other hand, I do think of bandsaw blades as expendable; probably from having been a woodturner sawing a lot of green logs. In any case a couple of spare bandsaw blades in 1/4" and 1/2" widths. And for the table saw a 10" ATB with raker, and a Freud 7-1/4" Diablo.

Glue! More glue!
Transfer adhesive.
Pickguard material
Purfling.
Neck reinforcement (trussrod, carbon)
A sharpening system.

Add a stash of lumber for making parts, cauls, binding, etc. that can add up to lots of $$. Some sheets of plywood and MDF.
An assortment of wood screws.
Assorted veneers.
Assorted dowels.
Some Plexiglass sheets for templates and patterns.
I don't use radius cauls, but most people seem to like them.
I don't use transfer punches. What am I missing? What do you use them for?
Author:  Goobie [ Fri Jun 06, 2008 12:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Quote:
I don't use transfer punches. What am I missing? What do you use them for?


I was wondering the same thing, but felt like I was overlooking something too obvious to ask :oops:

Cheers,
Chad
Author:  Dave Fifield [ Fri Jun 06, 2008 1:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Transfer punches are useful for bolt-on necks. Drill the holes in the body, then clamp the neck in place and use a transfer punch to mark the exact centers for the threaded inserts in the neck heel.

Harbor Freight has a set of transfer punches for less than $20 IIRC ($30 in the list is a bit high).

Cheers,
Dave Fifield
Author:  Hesh [ Fri Jun 06, 2008 2:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Great list Sylvan my friend.

Here are my two suggestions:

1) A 6" metal engineer's scale - I reach for this more in my shop then any other tool.

2) A divorce........ :D
Author:  Howard Klepper [ Fri Jun 06, 2008 3:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Dave Fifield wrote:
Transfer punches are useful for bolt-on necks. Drill the holes in the body, then clamp the neck in place and use a transfer punch to mark the exact centers for the threaded inserts in the neck heel.

Harbor Freight has a set of transfer punches for less than $20 IIRC ($30 in the list is a bit high).

Cheers,
Dave Fifield

Anything else? I use a pencil for marking neck inserts. Crude, but effective.
Author:  JJ Donohue [ Fri Jun 06, 2008 3:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
They're called Transfer Pencils and I have a matched set as well! laughing6-hehe
Author:  WaddyThomson [ Fri Jun 06, 2008 4:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
I happen to have a collected set of unmatched "Transfer Pencils". :D They are excellent, and it's hard to get new ones as good.
Author:  Brook Moore [ Sat Jun 07, 2008 2:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
Howard,

If you use a headstock template with holes to locate the tuning machines, the transfer punches are handy to mark those. I also use them to mark the 2 outer bridge pin holes on the top, as I drill those to locate and help clamp the bridge. So for my uses, a 3/16" and a 5/16" would cover my guitar building needs. Transfer punches usually come in sets, but if you have an extra used pin punch lying around, a point can quickly be ground on the end. Anyway, they are handy, but I am not sure I would list them on an "essentials" list, as pencils, awls, and even nails (properly ground) can certainly do the job.
Author:  Mike OMelia [ Sat Jun 07, 2008 7:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Tools You Need and what they Cost
That is an awesome list! Thanks for posting.

Hey, how about a resource center? Not a forum, but a place where resources are stored (like this list of tools). Another item might be the free Cut List software that I found. I am only talking about "found" stuff. And free too, no legal issues. It could include links... but links can die. Authors should linkable via email for futher off line questions.

Mike
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