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figured woods
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=18492		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Christian Staub [ Fri Aug 22, 2008 12:19 am ]
Post subject:  figured woods
Do figured (curly, birdseye, etc) woods have any differences in stregnth than their nonfigured counterparts?
Author:  Laurent Brondel [ Fri Aug 22, 2008 11:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: figured woods
Not usually, but it depends. Some curly woods want to break on the curl. On the other hand every German spruce top with Hazelficte and/or flame I've used has been extremely stiff. It seems to be the case with bearclaw Sitka as well.
Author:  Christian Staub [ Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: figured woods
laurent wrote:
Not usually, but it depends. Some curly woods want to break on the curl.




Does curly cherry do this?
Author:  Mike Collins [ Fri Aug 22, 2008 2:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: figured woods
Christian as Laurent has stated curly woods can break on the curl .
The curls are wood grain running in a different direction to the base grain.
That's a simplified explanation !

How tightly packed the curls are also makes a difference.
The tighter the more likely they'll break!

Thin your sides to .080 (2mm) do not wet them heavily -this can really make them break fast.-because of the 2 different grain directions!
It's best to cover the convex side of the bend with a piece of moist veneer or a thin sheet of metal.
Go slow -listen to the wood -it usually gives you a "chik" sound before breaking.

Curly Cherry is beautiful!!! [:Y:]
Good luck!!

Mike
Author:  TonyKarol [ Fri Aug 22, 2008 2:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: figured woods
Usually the more intense the curl looks, also the increase in the angle of the run out in the piece. A chunk of curly or birdseye maple may be a stiff as a piece of straight grained maple, but it will more than likely be more unstable, ie. wanting to move/warp more, twist, or at the very least, the curl lines and birdsyes will show as ripples/dimples after a while in service under a finish, as the grain moves at different rates and/or in different directions, and the woods density changes in localized areas.

As for cherry, it will really depend on the piece. Same rules as above will apply IMO
Author:  joel Thompson [ Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: figured woods
I think your question has been answered but i wanted to add that curl can change the ammount it the effects the stregth of the piece of wood depending on the type of wood and the type of figure.
for example curly maple tends to be very strong and less likely to split with he curly grain fibers than say curly mahogany.
if you have very tight deep curl with mahogany it can be very week and can break very easily.
this does not seem to be as bad with soft maple with equal curl.
i belive its becouse the grain fibers are more closely knitted in the maple but this is just a guess.

with cherry the curl tends to long and shallow and therefor the run out not as severe as a fiddle back figured peice of wood.
this tends mean the wood is a little stronger and less likely to split when bending or snap with the curl if being used for a neck.

an interesting point then i have been doing some deflection testing on curly and plain peices of wood cut from the same same planks of wood.
in general the figured wood will only take half as much presure before it breaks(depending on figure and wood) than a plain peice cut from the same stock.
I have been doing this in my search for suitable neck woods.

i have great photo,s on my other computer showing examples of split curly redwood, mahogany and maple from deflection testingwhich help explain what i am trying to say.
i will post when i get back home on monday.

In general dont worry about it too much unless the wood is for a top (curly redwood0, neck or binding.
we usualy cope with curly woods very well for back and sides but the deep curled peices can be bad for necks in some cases.
Also curly binding can a royal P.I.T.A.

Joel.
Author:  Christian Staub [ Sat Aug 23, 2008 8:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: figured woods
so what I'm hearing is: don't use the curly cherry for a thru neck
Author:  joel Thompson [ Sat Aug 23, 2008 10:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: figured woods
No Thats not what i am saying eek

figured cherry is usualy much stronger than figured mahogany (i am talking fiddleback here) and most of the time it is fine to use for a neck.
but the very tightly figured stuff can be week due to the run out cuased buy excessive curl.

In my opinion excesivly curly wood can cuase problems but in the most part you will be fine.
cherry is great for necks and the curl tends to be wider and shallower (i have never seen fiddleback cherry).

If you are worried do a deflection test on a peice of scrap about the length of the nut to the body and see how much weight it will take before its breaks.
The chances are it wont break at all but if there is excesive run out due the figure it will break along the fibers of the figure.

Also different types of figure are cuased buy different phenomenon and figures such as roe mottle or ribbon figure will not cause the problems that aggresive fiddleback would.

Its hard to explain with out pics so i will post some on monday or tues to show you what i mean.

But go ahead and use your cherry i am sure it will be fine its great for necks and very strong as the curl is so shallow (just make sure your the grain slop is as flat as possable along the edge of the neck).

Joel.
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