Official Luthiers Forum! http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/ |
|
Working with Ziricote http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=51466 |
Page 1 of 1 |
Author: | guitarradTJ [ Tue Jan 15, 2019 1:30 pm ] |
Post subject: | Working with Ziricote |
Hi all, I recently had a birthday and I want to build something special to commemorate the big 4-0... I found this Ziricote... I've never worked with it and have found most people find it a PITA to work with. Chips, cracks, the whole nine yards. I recently got a Fox style bending machine along with a silicone heating pad. I'm always up for a challenge, but am I just asking for trouble? Also, I'd appreciate any input on the wood... I love the look of it, does anything concern you from looking at the picture? Questions I should ask the seller? I should add, I want to build a cutaway....of course Thanks for any advice! Raúl Sent from my R1 HD using Tapatalk |
Author: | Chris Ensor [ Tue Jan 15, 2019 1:37 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
I've only built one with Ziricote, but I love it as well. My first concern with the set pictured is it looks decently flatsawn- which may exacerbate ziricote's inherent problems. When I built with it, I flooded all pieces with thin CA prior to bending/jointing. This helps with stability. It's a nasty process and adds some noxious fumes to the bending process (plus will require barriers between the wood and blanket/slats), but helps to fill any small internal issues you can't see. |
Author: | J De Rocher [ Tue Jan 15, 2019 1:57 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
I'm another fan of ziricote. I've only built one guitar with it so far. The back and sides set I used presented none of the problems on your list, but maybe I was just lucky. The only thing that stood out was that the sides took more effort to bend on my hot pipe than other woods. I pre-treated the sides with SuperSoft and they bent without cracking or cupping. Here's a photo of the wood I used to compare with the wood you have: Attachment: M parlor 6r2.jpg
|
Author: | guitarradTJ [ Tue Jan 15, 2019 1:59 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
Chris Ensor wrote: I've only built one with Ziricote, but I love it as well. My first concern with the set pictured is it looks decently flatsawn- which may exacerbate ziricote's inherent problems. Thanks for your advice. How did you like your results? Was it worth the trouble?When I built with it, I flooded all pieces with thin CA prior to bending/jointing. This helps with stability. It's a nasty process and adds some noxious fumes to the bending process (plus will require barriers between the wood and blanket/slats), but helps to fill any small internal issues you can't see. Sent from my R1 HD using Tapatalk |
Author: | guitarradTJ [ Tue Jan 15, 2019 2:08 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
J De Rocher wrote: I'm another fan of ziricote. I've only built one guitar with it so far. The back and sides set I used presented none of the problems on your list, but maybe I was just lucky. The only thing that stood out was that the sides took more effort to bend on my hot pipe than other woods. I pre-treated the sides with SuperSoft and they bent without cracking or cupping. WOW! That's gorgeous!Here's a photo of the wood I used to compare with the wood you have: Attachment: M parlor 6r2.jpg About 70% of what I've read online talks about those problems... The rest say they've bent like butter. SS is a product that seems to come up a lot for a successful bend. I love the look of it! Sent from my R1 HD using Tapatalk |
Author: | Woodie G [ Tue Jan 15, 2019 2:53 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
I think I might build with ziricote for my own use, but never commercially...we've repaired too many cracks not to understand why the wood deserves its reputation. |
Author: | dpetrzelka [ Tue Jan 15, 2019 2:57 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
I've only built one with Ziricote and was fortunate to have a set that bent like butter. Would love to use it again. Thinned sides to approximately .080" Light misting with water on both sides Wrapped in kraft/butcher paper Sandwiched between two metal bending slats Heated my silicone blanket to roughly 300°F Was patient with the preheat Bend smoothly with no cupping/splitting or creasing. Planing the back/sides to thickness was the only area I needed to exercise caution. Use a very sharp smoothing plane on a skewed angle or cabinet scraper as its very hard and almost crumbly. If my plane was the least bit dull I would get slight crumbly tear-out. With a sharp plane or fresh cabinet scraper it finishes like glass. |
Author: | guitarradTJ [ Tue Jan 15, 2019 3:51 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
dpetrzelka wrote: I've only built one with Ziricote and was fortunate to have a set that bent like butter. Would love to use it again. That's beautiful!Thinned sides to approximately .080" Light misting with water on both sides Wrapped in kraft/butcher paper Sandwiched between two metal bending slats Heated my silicone blanket to roughly 300°F Was patient with the preheat Bend smoothly with no cupping/splitting or creasing. Planing the back/sides to thickness was the only area I needed to exercise caution. Use a very sharp smoothing plane on a skewed angle or cabinet scraper as its very hard and almost crumbly. If my plane was the least bit dull I would get slight crumbly tear-out. With a sharp plane or fresh cabinet scraper it finishes like glass. How was it gluing? Sent from my R1 HD using Tapatalk |
Author: | dpetrzelka [ Tue Jan 15, 2019 3:58 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
It doesn't seem oily all (so that was not a concern), but on any wood with this hard of a surface, I usually wipe with naphtha to be sure there is no surface contamination before gluing. I used both hot hide glue and Titebond I without any issues. |
Author: | Chris Ensor [ Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:20 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
guitarradTJ wrote: Thanks for your advice. How did you like your results? Was it worth the trouble? Well worth the insurance to flood it in my opinion (same goes for BRW and others that tend to crack with time). I'm happy with the results: I used it for the B/S, bridge, fingerboard, and headstock overlays. I'll echo what Daniel said- it sure is crumbly. I found it unpleasant to carve for my bridge. |
Author: | guitarradTJ [ Tue Jan 15, 2019 4:23 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
Chris Ensor wrote: guitarradTJ wrote: Thanks for your advice. How did you like your results? Was it worth the trouble? Well worth the insurance to flood it in my opinion (same goes for BRW and others that tend to crack with time). I'm happy with the results: I used it for the B/S, bridge, fingerboard, and headstock overlays. I'll echo what Daniel said- it sure is crumbly. I found it unpleasant to carve for my bridge. Sent from my R1 HD using Tapatalk |
Author: | kwerry [ Thu Jan 17, 2019 12:14 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
I've built one and just closed the box on a second ( a commission) it bends OK, I bend it @ 295 and that seems plenty.. Cracks and splits easy until closed up then seems fine.. I don't flood with CA but do use a few extra side braces.. My first was for me and it is 4 years old no issues just left sitting on a a stand.. Kerry |
Author: | Ben-Had [ Thu Jan 17, 2019 11:18 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
I had none of the problems expressed and did nothing differently than I have with mahogany or EIR. |
Author: | Pat Foster [ Thu Jan 17, 2019 1:14 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Working with Ziricote |
I've built two. The first is 4 years old the second 3 years old, no issues with either one. Both sets were well-seasoned, no problems with splitting nor bending. These were steel string, but I'm considering a classical or two with Ziricote. Attachment: IMGP9163.jpg
|
Page 1 of 1 | All times are UTC - 5 hours |
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/ |