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First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=53634		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  DanKirkland [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 12:22 pm ]
Post subject:  First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
I've been working on my third acoustic and for this one I wanted to use some old piano key ivory a retired pool cue maker friend had given me for christmas some years ago.

I wanted to do a segmented rosette and I went a little further with it and I'm really happy with the results. Just wanted to share my excitement on having completed it. Feels like a big step to do one that's more complicated than just a few continuous lines.

the segments came from the various lengths/widths that I had available. The little black fills are ebony cutoffs from fingerboards. A neat side note is that since ivory is slightly opaque it takes on a slight blue tint when you have a black background. I still have to sand it down and such but it should pop when under some finish.

Image
Author:  J De Rocher [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 12:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
Looks good! How did you prepare the pieces from the piano key ivory? Did you cut them into arc shapes or is the ivory flexible enough to bend?
Author:  DanKirkland [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 1:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
J De Rocher wrote:
Looks good! How did you prepare the pieces from the piano key ivory? Did you cut them into arc shapes or is the ivory flexible enough to bend?


The pieces had to be cut. Ivory does not like to bend at all I found out the hard way with a test piece. It took some doing to cut them thin enough but it made the glue up much easier.
Author:  wbergman [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 1:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
https://www.silversmithing.com/1ivory.htm

Here is a link that includes bending ivory. I believe some old guitars had ivory binding that was bent some way or the other.
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 2:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
Your glue is seeping into the grain and leaving a permanent stain.
Author:  Clay S. [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 2:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
I've bent ivory using naval jelly, which has phosphoric acid as an active ingredient. When using piano key tops for inlay I paint the bottom of the cavity with white paint.
Author:  DanKirkland [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 4:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
Thanks for the info on bending ivory.

Barry Daniels wrote:
Your glue is seeping into the grain and leaving a permanent stain.


Yeah I saw that. I'm not too worried about it. Call it a beginners flaw. I should've sealed the channels a bit better.

Clay S. wrote:
I've bent ivory using naval jelly, which has phosphoric acid as an active ingredient. When using piano key tops for inlay I paint the bottom of the cavity with white paint.


I'll try that sometime thanks Clay! I kind of like the blue tint personally so I'm just leaving it on this one.
Author:  wbergman [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 4:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
https://umgf.com/how-did-they-process-t ... 42567.html

More techniques
Author:  DanKirkland [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 4:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
wbergman wrote:
https://umgf.com/how-did-they-process-the-ivory-for-bindings-t42567.html

More techniques


Cool thank you for the info. I guess I should amend my original statement by saying I didn't bend the ivory for this and instead cut the pieces to fit. But ivory does in fact bend and can be bent. Guess I should have read more on the topic duh
Author:  Clay S. [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 9:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
Just as a side note: Some types of ivory can not be sold interstate (Lacey) and some states restrict ivory sales within the state. I will use old salvage elephant ivory on my personal instruments, but if it is something I might sell I'll use bone or one of the "legal" ivories - mammoth, warthog, hippo, wild boar, etc..
Author:  DanKirkland [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 9:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
Clay S. wrote:
Just as a side note: Some types of ivory can not be sold interstate (Lacey) and some states restrict ivory sales within the state. I will use old salvage elephant ivory on my personal instruments, but if it is something I might sell I'll use bone or one of the "legal" ivories - mammoth, warthog, hippo, wild boar, etc..


I'll have to research some on that but that is a good point. There's several folks in my area that make jewelry from the old piano key stuff so I don't know if it's exempt or not. If it turns out to be a problem I'll just remove it and replace it with some white plastic or something.
Author:  DanKirkland [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 10:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
On secind thought. I'm going to scrap this rosette completely and replace the ivory with something like elforyn. Just not worth the potential drama of the real stuff. Oh well.
Author:  J De Rocher [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 10:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
DanKirkland wrote:
On secind thought. I'm going to scrap this rosette completely and replace the ivory with something like elforyn. Just not worth the potential drama of the real stuff. Oh well.


You could save it for a guitar you know you are going to keep or put it on a guitar you are going to give away. The drama comes in with a transfer of the ivory involving exchange of money.
Author:  Clay S. [ Sat Oct 31, 2020 11:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
I wouldn't worry about that little bit of ivory too much. Most people wouldn't know it from white plastic. It's just something to keep in mind when working with some "controlled substances" - ivory, tortoise, rosewoods, etc.
Depending on the state you live in it may be perfectly legal to buy and sell pre-ban ivory within that state.
Author:  Kbore [ Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First attempt at rosette w/piano key ivory
DanKirkland wrote:
On secind thought. I'm going to scrap this rosette completely and replace the ivory with something like elforyn. Just not worth the potential drama of the real stuff. Oh well.


That was well stated.
Nice work on your rosette!
Cant wait to see your "elforyn" version with finish on it..... :D
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