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Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=55828		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Ed Haney [ Sun Aug 13, 2023 6:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
I made all my previous bindings myself from wood. I bent them on the same bender as my guitar side rims. Now, I'm going to build 4 ukuleles for my grandchildren for Christmas. I'm not set up to bend uke sides or bindings, so I'm going to buy some uke kits from StewMc. (Also a first, since I've never built a kit. The kits should save me enough time to get this done as I'm doing other things.)

So -- I'm planning plastic bindings and rosettes (wood will also be in the rosettes).

Question #1: Is the StewMc tool for laminating multiple plastic strands together worthwhile (I need 2 strands (bindings) and 3 strands (rosettes) glued together and I can buy the tool for just $31)

Question #2: Is the StewMc glue for plastic worthwhile, or is acetone just as easy and reliable to use? (The glue is $20)

Please this unexperienced plastic handling builder.

Thanks in advance.
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Sun Aug 13, 2023 6:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
The laminator tool works great, but I use it only with acetone. You just brush a small section at a time with acetone and pull it through the little press and it adheres instantly.

One thing to keep in mind though is that laminating strips makes them harder to bend. Not a big deal for the outer edge purflings, but I would not laminate the rosette strips. Glue all of the rosette strips in loose, and then flood with CA.
Author:  Ed Haney [ Sun Aug 13, 2023 6:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
Barry Daniels wrote:
The laminator tool works great, but I use it only with acetone. You just brush a small section at a time with acetone and pull it through the little press and it adheres instantly.

One thing to keep in mind though is that laminating strips makes them harder to bend. Not a big deal for the outer edge purflings, but I would not laminate the rosette strips. Glue all of the rosette strips in loose, and then flood with CA.


Thanks, much, Barry.

Why not flood the rosette strips with acetone to glue them in instead CA? Or is it basically the same? Does acetone stain spruce like CA does if the rosette is not sealed with shellac? (Does acetone require sealing the spruce rosette and binding channels?
Author:  Clay S. [ Sun Aug 13, 2023 7:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
Fiber purfling is another material that is easy to bend into tight circles after wetting it some. I have used it for simple ukulele rosettes. LMII and Gurian among others, sell it, and if you want a bulk quantity of BWB this eBay seller has it at a good price: https://www.ebay.com/itm/174906732446?h ... 0Ut5mex%2F
Wetting and and steaming it allows the strands to separate so you can use individual strands or recombine them to make different patterns.
Author:  SteveSmith [ Sun Aug 13, 2023 8:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
I use both fiber purfling and plastic in my rosettes, usually combined with wood or abalone rings. I put them in individually then flood with CA when all the pieces are in. Don’t forget to shellac the channel so the CA won’t stain the spruce.


Steve
Author:  Kbore [ Mon Aug 14, 2023 11:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
Ed Haney wrote:
Question #2: Is the StewMc glue for plastic worthwhile, or is acetone just as easy and reliable to use?


I've used the stewMac Bind-ALL on three guitars with plastic binding and fiber-wood/ pearl rosettes:
    Bind-ALL cement is whiteish and easy to see, and cures crystal clear.
    Bind-ALL is super tacky with an open time of MAYBE 2 minutes.
    Bind-ALL works very well for wood to wood and Plastic to wood.
    Bind-ALL is stupid expensive for a 2.4 ounce tube.

I have also used DUCO cement which is a similar adhesive:
    DUCO is crystal clear from the tube and more difficult to see
    DUCO is equally as tacky
    DUCO works like Bind-ALL
    One ounce tube of DUCO is less than $5 from Amazon


The visibility of Bind-ALL is a real plus when gluing a multi-piece stack of binding/ purfling, but the cost is outrageous. If its in your budget, try both and see which one you prefer.

On the subject of StewMac Uke Kit, I built one last year:
    I didnt like the materials; kerfing was very VERY narrow, limiting the dimensions of binding/ purfling.
    If I built another one, I would go for a larger kerfing. I would call StewMac and inquire if the kit kerfing is the same dimension as the mandolin kerfing. If the mando is larger. use it instead of the kit kerfing, or bend solid kerfing yourself.
    THe wood on my mando kit was very dull and unattractive, fingerboard was walnut.
    My local ROCKLER has some on the shelf for 1/2 price, read the review on rockler.com for a picture of the cool form the guy made with PVC TEE fittings. You will need to build a simple form

Good luck on your build!
Author:  Clay S. [ Fri Sep 01, 2023 11:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
I found this example of a fiber BWB purfling rosette. The outside edges are about 2 inches apart (50mm). It will take a pretty tight bend.
Author:  BlindGuitar [ Sun Sep 17, 2023 6:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
Ed Haney wrote:
I made all my previous bindings myself from wood. I bent them on the same bender as my guitar side rims. Now, I'm going to build 4 ukuleles for my grandchildren for Christmas. I'm not set up to bend uke sides or bindings, so I'm going to buy some uke kits from StewMc. (Also a first, since I've never built a kit. The kits should save me enough time to get this done as I'm doing other things.)

So -- I'm planning plastic bindings and rosettes (wood will also be in the rosettes).

Question #1: Is the StewMc tool for laminating multiple plastic strands together worthwhile (I need 2 strands (bindings) and 3 strands (rosettes) glued together and I can buy the tool for just $31)

Question #2: Is the StewMc glue for plastic worthwhile, or is acetone just as easy and reliable to use? (The glue is $20)

Please this unexperienced plastic handling builder.

Thanks in advance.

Be careful if you're tempted to use a heat gun as the plastic binding will shrink substantially . I personally don't like using plastic even though I have . It's wood for me next build . Cheers , Dave .
Author:  banjopicks [ Sun Sep 17, 2023 10:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
Acetone worka best with celluloid bindings. Invisible joints are easy as the acetone melts the binding into one piece. I miss buying celluloid as I need to buy too much to make the hazmat fee worth it.
Author:  Freeman [ Sun Sep 17, 2023 12:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
I bought the SM laminator and have used acetone based glues for plastic binding and its always been a battle. Now I follow the lead of something I read here - I prefit the binding and any purfling lines into the channels dry and futz around with them until they are perfect. I leave small gaps between pieces of tape and "tack weld" the binding and lines with tiny drops of water thin CA (SM#10 or equivalent). Pull the tape and run a bead of the thin CA all the way around the binding, scrape and bingo!

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IMG_7125-1.jpg


There are several advantages. When you laminate a bunch of lines it can become difficult to bend without puckering. This way the lines each take their own radius. It allows you to perfectly fit the binding to the channel - I frequently bind tight curves like headstocks and f-holes. I can take the time to get is just right without worrying about wet glue. And I have had acetone based glue fail and guess what I used to fix it with.

This method works so well that I use it with all binding - plastic, wood or a combination. One other nice thing is that the little bit of CA that soaks into the wood doesn't appear under finish like some other glues do.
Author:  CarlD [ Sun Sep 17, 2023 1:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
That's the way I do it too, but prep the channels with shellac to prevent any CA stains leeching into the spruce.
Author:  SteveSmith [ Sun Sep 17, 2023 1:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Need help with plastic bindings and perflings
CarlD wrote:
That's the way I do it too, but prep the channels with shellac to prevent any CA stains leeching into the spruce.

Same here. Been doing that for about 10 years. Definitely prep channels with shellac.
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