Official Luthiers Forum!

1/3 hp furnace motor on 12" buffs on cheap arbor mounted on 2x12 plank I can clamp to my bench with lots of overhang room. 2:1 reduction from 1725 to avoid heat. Wet and dry sand 600 thru 4000 and buff with red then ivory mazaerna,
any suggestiopns on coarseness of componds?

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Greg
http://garibaldiinstruments.com/

My point was simply that the motor would not bog down as some have stated may happen with less powerful motors....I'm certainly attentive enough to realize when too much pressure is being exerted, so I don't see "enough power" as a potential problem.....I guess there are many ways to look at this setup....small motor that bogs down before burning through, loose belt that slips when too much pressure is exerted,etc....I like mine the way it is, if I want to put a little extra pressure I know I've got the setup to do so....and to date I've never had any issues with burn-throughs.....There seem to be many paths that one could take, choose the one that fits your style.


Cheers,
Greg

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Gwaltney Guitars

[QUOTE=ToddStock] You're better off creating slippage with the belt rather than stalling the motor. I run the belt just loose enough to give some slippage when I'm getting a little too frisky.[/QUOTE]

That's what I do too. I have the regular SM buffing arbor with 12" buffs, and I use the motor from my old lathe, I believe it is 500W (3/4 hp?), and I run it at about 900 RPM. Anyways, it is powerful enough with normal use; given half a chance it will also burn through lacquer or throw a guitar to the floor.

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Rian Gitar og Mandolin

You guys have really come through, and I thank you!
So let's see, we have:
??? hp-- 1
1/4 hp-- 1 vote, w/ maybe another
1/3 hp-- 4 votes, w/ perhaps another
1/2 hp-- 2 votes, a 3rd user who wishes for more
3/4 hp-- 3 votes, w/ a wistful "someday-er"
1   hp-- 2 votes, w/ nary a complaint
2 hp-- there's a real MAN in the group!

Oh yes, and the few hand-held buffers amongst us-- 4 of you, and I know you get good results. (Did you know that Tony Ferguson has a hand-help buffing rig? And doesn't he do pretty work??)

JJ didn't really commit himself, did he?
And Hesh, I hear ya on those pesky b/w/b's!

Thanks guys, I'm not quite as confused as I was yesterday.

Steve

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From Nacogdoches...the oldest town in Texas.

http://www.stephenkinnaird.com

I am from the Tim Taylor school on this one ... "More Power, Grunt Grunt Grunt."

I have a 3HP 3phase motor on my buffer. I use 18" buffs but I run them fairly slow. I also have a VFD (Variable frequency drive) on there so I can adjust the speed with a keypad but still have have the horsepower. It is awesome. You would think this thing would burn through in a second, but I don't generate nearly the amount of heat I use to with 12" buffs on the shopfox set-up. This thing "cuts" rather than burnishing the finish (and generating heat) I have it hooked up to my dust colletor too.

The idea of stalling the buffs seems a little strange to me, but to each their own. You would think with this much power it would throw a guitar across the shop but it seems like I have a lot more control than I had with the shopfox. I love this thing, the VFD is cat's PJs.

3 hp?
Triple phase?!
John wins! (Unless there's someone out there using a PTO from their 200 hp tractor?)

Thanks again guys,

Steve

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From Nacogdoches...the oldest town in Texas.

http://www.stephenkinnaird.com

To me, the single most impressive machine that we were shown at the Martin factory tour was their automated buffer.   The buffer wheel was HUGE, like a narrow tractor wheel (now that you mention tractors), but what was even more impressive was the robot arm that held / turned / flipped the guitar and presented it to the wheel. I was reminded of a giant but extremely precise elephant trunk that gently picks flower and puts in a kids hand or something... I bet the motor that turned that wheel would beat anything mentioned in this thread!   

I think Johno has a good point though; powerful is good, but then his buffs are 18" so he needs a sturdier system throughout. Still, a more modest set up can give the same results, albeit slower. Sort of like the Honda compared to Mercedes, they will both get you there...

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Rian Gitar og Mandolin

i seem to remember that mario, who unfortunately departed the forum, and tony karol as well, are also in the smaller is better camp. i think tony said he was only using 1/5 hp on his.

as is usual when we discuss here how to do something we receive a huge range of ideas and solutions which have been successful for the proponents. just another illustration of the fact that there are lots of ways to skin that poor, abused cat in this game that will produce the desired result.

but three hp on a buffer..... hmmmm..... i wonder if the international tribunal on the use of steroid enhanced tooling in luthiery will look into this matter....?

yes todd, mario's use of plain words is illuminating and enjoyable to me as well even if it does seem to rile (HEAVY PREPOST EDITING DONE HERE TO AVOID THE POSSIBILITY LIKEWISE RILING) some. like you i enjoy seeing his ever forthright and informative posts over on the mimf. this forum is a lesser place without him.

I use a 1/2 horse (1725 RPM)& it seems perfect to me. I'm sure a 1/3 h. would do just fine. IMVHO, anything over 1/2 h. is overkill & can actually cause problems with burn through if you get too aggressive.
I can stall out my buffer if I push too hard, and I think that is a good thing.
I swing 14" Stew-Mac buffs. (Stew-Mac recommends two buffs at each end, but i find that is too wide to polish tight waist & cutaway areas.)
If you have the wall space in your shop, it's easy (and cheap) to build a buffer that will hinge up against the wall, out of the way when not in use. An added bonus with this type of rig is that there is no structure underneath the buffer to bump your instruments into while you're concentrating on the finish.
Also... I find that its less tiring if you mount the shaft at chest height. It's also easier to keep a good grip on your work when you're not stooping over.
If you want a pic of my rig, PM me with your e-mail address & I'll send one along.
Hope this is helpful.
Dan

I'm in the "JohnO camp" with 2.0 HP 3PH with VFD. Running 12" dia. on 3/4" shaft.

1 hp, smooth as butter.

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http://www.dickeyguitars.com

Hey thanks again guys, for stopping by.
Did I mention that my shaft was done by a friend that used to frequent the OLF? He found a 1" shaft, turned down the ends to 3/4" on his metal lathe, then threaded about 2 1/2" of that for the nuts. I've got the axle mounted now via two 1" pillow blocks, and will be hooking up to power this week.

I've decided to use a water wheel turned by a local creek as my power source. Big leather belts conveying the power all over the shop.

Har de har.

Steve

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From Nacogdoches...the oldest town in Texas.

http://www.stephenkinnaird.com

That looks cool!  I guess that dates me, huh?

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Waddy

Photobucket Build Album Library

Sound Clips of most of my guitars

Yep .. someone mentioned above .. 1/5 horse running single 12 inch buffs, motor weight tensions the belt, and you can still push into it if you want too. Pair of 3/4 pillow blocks, 3/4 bar 36 inch wide, treaded down to 1/2 inch on the ends, and the frame is a couple 2x4s. All in, about 40 bucks.

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Tony Karol
www.karol-guitars.com
"let my passion .. fulfill yours"

[QUOTE=Steve Kinnaird] I've decided to use a water wheel turned by a local creek as my power source. Big leather belts conveying the power all over the shop.
[/QUOTE]

So, you are moving by a Creek out in the woods? Sounds more like John. Are there any woods left in Nacogdoches?

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http://www.dickeyguitars.com

Steve...the other specs with my Caswell rig:

...3/4 HP
...1100 RPM
...3 buffs x 2 @ 14" dia.

EDITORIAL COMMENT:
I too miss Mario's posts and unselfish help and wisdom. The OLF suffers without his presence. Like Todd, the Crazyman, and others...I get my Mario-fix elsewhere.

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JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com