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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:57 am 
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Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
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Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2004 1:20 pm
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Location: United States

I haven't read the article yet, but AG has an article about getting started in home PC recording in this month's edition.

I just got it yesterday.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 3:17 am 
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Koa
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Location: United States
Hesh,

It's not clear from your post how much you already know about recording in general, so I apologize if I oversimplify this.

Starting at the beginning of the chain (after the guitar), here's what you need for a decent recording:

(1) a mic, unless you are only recording through a pickup, in which case you just need a cord.
(2) a pre-amp (to boost the mic's signal)
(3) a soundcard with an that will accept the boosted signal
(4) recording software that will capture the signal from the soundcard.

On all of these, the brands & models you will want depend a lot on your budget. Here's some good starter recommendations that would produce a perfectly acceptable recording, but spending more would improve the sound.

Mic: An SM 57 is about the best price/performance mic on the market. Guitar Center used to sell Octavia MC012 mics on sale for a great price, but I don't see them on the Musicians Friend site anymore, so maybe they stopped selling them.

Pre-amp: The M-Audio Audio Buddy is good for the money.

Soundcard: M-Audio again offers a good price/performance line. Their lower-end soundcards are still very good.

Recording software: I think the best value on the market today is Magix Music studio for about $80.

The setup described above will be a bit of an investment -- figure $400-$500.

I think there are some cheaper "bundle" products out there. M-Audio makes something called a "Fast track Studio USB Bundle" for about $150 that has a mic, pre-amp and a soundcard equivalent (it plugs into your usb port) for $150. I wouldn't expect great sound from it, but it would probably work. Kelby38828.5131712963


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 3:25 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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There are any number of different setups/options. Basic requirements: a decent mic, some form of preamp (mixer is a good bet), and a decent soundcard (24bit/96kHz in). M-Audio makes great stuff, although I also quite like Line6's things; if you're into electric guitar playing at all, their TonePort looks like a great deal. I've got the guitarport, and an M-Audio Audiophile 2496 (stereo soundcard), and the GuitarPort sounds are really **** good. Condenser mics are the bees knees in mic land, some AKG C1000's or similar (a pair, stereo recording, one obliquely aimed at 12th fret, one at the bridge or thereabouts; opinions differ) will work well, although I have to say I'm impressed by the budget mics musician's friend and co sell (I forget the brand..chinese made).

In terms of software, there's more available for PC than there is for Mac anyway, and the power's pretty much identical, cross-platform. A basic version of Cakewalk (software) should do, although some sound cards might come with some recording software on-board. For the budget-oriented, n-Track studio's a good bet.LanceK38849.3077546296


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 4:04 am 
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Koa
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Location: Spokane, Washington
First name: Pat
Last Name: Foster
State: Eastern WA
Focus: Build
Hesh,

I'm REALLY cheap sometimes, so I used a Logitech QuickCam Pro 4000 Web Cam which has a built-in mic. Plugs into a USB port. It being for video chat, the low-end is a bit weak, but overall quality is surprisingly good.

mp3

Plus, since the camera has adjustable focus, you can stick it inside your guitars and take pictures! I found the camera used on ebay, so total cost was about $30.

I used the free Audacity program from sourceforge.net for recording, which also accomodates a LAME-type encoder for MP3.

If you're looking for something for marketing, this may be too low-end.

Have fun!burbank38828.5458449074

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 4:06 am 
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Koa
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City: Duluth
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Hesh, I have done a tiny bit of direct-to-disk PC recording, but I am FAR from being an expert on the subject.

It will help if you can let folks here know what your budget is for hardware and software. It's easy to get crazy and spend $1000 on a microphone alone, but many professional reviewers say that there now are some excellent alternatives in the $100 to $300 price point.

You know, in guitar construction, the focus is the soundboard; in cameras the critical component is the lens; and in recording, the critical element is the microphone. Obviously, is each case, the critical component is supported by the other components, so the other components can't be junk.

As a broad generality, most knowledgeable people would probably recommend a condenser microphone (especially in the $100-$300 range, and especially for recording acoustic guitars.) I would think you would want a mic with a very flat response curve, so you could record exactly what the guitar sounds like (and add effects in post-processing, if desired.) Many mics that are venerated by road musicians as "do it all mics", like the Sure SM57 and SM58, give vocals a "better" sound by purposely distorting the response curve to favor certain frequencies.

I just found myself in the lucky position of having a multimedia job come my way that requires high-quality narration. So, I was able to barter for a Marshall/MXL Silicon Valve V6 microphone - about $300 worth of mic. Supposedly excellent for male voice narration, and stunning for recording acoustic guitar. If I did not have a specific project that would justify that mic, I had been looking at the MXL Pro Pac Plus ($250, includes MXL 2003 and MXL 603S microphones, plus shock mounts, cables and a case.) The same mic pair is available for $170, without the extras: Recording Pack Plus I am told that you will need a shock mount for the 2003 mic, and a very quiet recording area. It is reportedly so sensitive, even indoors, that it will pick up trucks rolling by, jets flying overhead, and ants farting.

If you record with 2 mics, you will need some way to mix them (hardware, or software), or you will need the software to be able to simultaneously record more than 1 track (Most can, if your other computer hardware can keep up.)

You'll need a mic preamp for each mic, and the preamp will need to be able to supply the voltage ("phantom power") to the mic. Be aware that the mic preamp you select may "color" the sound of the mic. If you buy a high-quality, flat response curve mic, you may want to consider a high quality mic preamp to go with it. The A.R.T. Tube MP Project Series ($65), or the slightly noisier A.R.T. Tube MP($39) are probably clean enough, without breaking the bank. If you get a mixer (like one of the Mackie VLZ series or Onyx series), you'll be getting a mixer plus several very clean mic preamps in one package. You can get a used
Mackie 1202 VLZ Mixer on Ebay for about $100.

I copied a post I made on this question in another forum, and paste it here:

==========================
... if you wanted to inexpensively get into digital recording on your computer, and have at least one good mic, "modern" computer hardware (I won't go into the CPU speed, amount of RAM, hard drive type and speed), and an OK sound card, then you can add digital recording software costing any where from free to $45 or $75, and lots more above $200.

Audacity is free
N-Track Studio is $45, or $75 if you want to record 24bit.

If you need or want more than they offer, there are others like Cakewalk, Cubase, and a bunch of them I have never heard of. Musician'S Friend Recording Software Listing

If you decide that your sound card is inadequate, and is the missing piece of the puzzle, look for a used version of recording soundcards on Ebay. For example, from Echo, there's Darla, Gina, and Mia cards, and even the older versions would do a good job.
=========================

Hope this helps!

Dennis

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Duluth, MN, USA
7th Sense Multimedia


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 4:23 am 
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Koa
Koa
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Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2006 4:33 am
Posts: 1518
Location: Canada
Sometimes the easiest way is
the soundcard{most times has an onboard preamp already}
will accept 1/8' - get a mono 1/4" to 1/8" adapter from RatShak and plug the microphone into the soundcard directly and see what kind of levels/quality you get - in order to do this you must go
My Computer>Control Panel>Sound and Audio Devices>Audio>Sound Recording, Volume - a mixer will appear - make sure your soundcard is selected and the volume is all the way up.
There is even a 20db boost in the advanced options section.
The microphone IMO is the most important ingredient, there is a excellent quality "tube mic" called an APEX for $200/or less, which is your cheapest Good quality microphone, and its 12ax7 tubed - comes with a shock absorber, a clown nose foam noisecover.
I just sold mine and Im using my SM57 which is far inferior and about half the price. Just a suggestion.
Another tip is to replace the cheepo chinese 12ax7 the APEX comes with with a good quality 12ax7 from your local tube or music store. $12-$17 +100%-500% increase in quality!
Good luck
Cheers
Charliewoodcharliewood38828.5584490741


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 5:27 am 
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Koa
Koa
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Location: Canada
Actually Hesh there is a preamp/power supply that comes with the mic as well - D'oh sorry forgot to mention that!
It has 9way selectable switch that will select anywhere between cardoid and figure8 recording patterns as well, a very nice feature - for instance figure8 does instruments nicely cardoid pattern is better for voice IMO.
It {mic}comes with a 8 pin connector to xlr - that goes directly into the preamp - u have to buy an xlr to 1/4 inch mono {or xlr to 1/8" if you can get it}patch to go into your comp -
These really are very good for the money.
Cheers
Charlie


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 7:14 am 
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Cocobolo
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Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2006 3:38 am
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Location: United States
Samson makes a mike that plugs straight into a USB port that is not terribly expensive - 80$ or so.



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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 7:19 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

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Posts: 2749
Location: Netherlands
I gotta make a confession: The guitarport, with the new 2.4 (or whatever it's at) software, makes a great tool for recording vocals when you turn off the amp sims, just use the speaker sims. Has a nice, simple built in compressor, some verb, and is an extra audio input. So, y'know, it's worth fiddling around with.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 9:52 am 
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Walnut
Walnut

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Posts: 33
Location: United States
Hesh, another approach that you might consider is to get a dedicated recording device that will do the recording, but where you can still get a file to use on the PC.

Tascam has an MR-8 model that will convert your recording to a WAV file and a USB interface to send it to your PC. I have an old Boss BR-8 that does pretty much the same thing. I'm very happy with it.

It has the added advantage of portability, if that has any value to you.

Just another approach to the problem...

Ron


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 3:33 am 
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Koa
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Hesh I have some software that Im not using the liscence of anymore - called cooledit2.0 its a really good and user friendly recording suite, which would work fine with the setup I mentioned.
Cheers
Charlie


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 4:45 am 
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Koa
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Hesh,

Like the other guys said, a good condensor mic is the biggest key. Condensor mics are the only way to go for live recording. After that, there are all kinds of places to spend money. Listed below are 25 of the most overlooked tips for recording to a PC. They include tips like shutting down processes that will make noise like you pc fan or hard drive kicking on and off. If you're going to record direct to a pc, these tips will help minimize computer noise.

Cheers!

John





1. Processor scheduling should be set to background services and not Programs.

Start > Settings > Control Panel > System > Advanced > Performance Settings > Advanced Tab > Background Services
   
2. Visual effects should be set to a minimum.

Start > Settings > Control Panel > System > Advanced > Performance Settings > Visual Effects Tab > Adjust for best performance
   
3. Switch Off Desktop Background Image

Right Click Desktop > Properties > Desktop Tab > Background None
   
4. Disable Screen Saver

Right Click Desktop > Properties > Screen Saver > None
   
5. Disable Fast User Switching

Start > Settings > Control Panel > User Accounts > Change the way users log on or off > Untick Use Fast User Switching
   
6. Switch Off Power Schemes

Start > Settings > Control Panel > Power Options > Always On > Turn off monitor and turn off hard discs to Never
   
7. Switch Off Hibernation

Start > Settings > Control Panel > Power Options > Hibernate > Untick Hibernation
   
8. Disable System Sounds

Start > Settings > Control Panel > Sounds and Audio Devices > Sounds Tab > Sound Scheme to None.
   
9. Do Not Map Through Soundcard

Start > Settings > Control Panel > Sounds and Audio Devices > Hardware Tab > (highlight your soundcard from the list) > Properties > Audio Devices > (highlight your soundcard from the list) > Properties, and check the "Do not map through this device" checkbox.
   
10. Disable System Restore

Start > Settings > Control Panel> System > System Restore Tab. Tick the "Turn off System Restore on all Drives"
   
11. Disable Automatic Updates

Switch off Automatic Updates by going to Control Panel, System, Automatic Updates and ticking the box labelled "Turn off automatic updating. I want to update my computer manually.".
   
12. Startup and Recovery Options

Right click My Computer and click on Properties > Advanced > Start Up & Recovery Settings and uncheck "Automatically Restart".
   
13. Disable Error Reporting

Start > Settings > Control Panel > System > Advanced TAB > Error Reporting > Click the Disable Error Reporting box (Tick the "But Notify Me When Critical Errors Occur" if you prefer)
   
14. Disable Remote Assistance

Start > Settings > Control Panel > System > Remote > Untick "Allow Remote Assistance Invitations to be sent from this computer"
   
15. Fixed Swap File (Virtual Memory)

Select the Advanced tab of the Systems applet and then select the Performance settings button. Then select the Advanced page. In here it is possible to customise the Virtual Memory. For custom size, this is often recommended to be 1.5 to 2 times the amount of your total RAM for both initial and maximum size. Set this to a fixed minimum and maximum value according to your existing RAM
   
16. Speed Up Menus

You can use this tip to speed up the Start Menu in Windows XP. You can customize the speed of the Start Menu by editing a Registry Key. Click Start, and then click Run. Type Regedit in the box, and then click OK. Expand the menu in the left panel and select the HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Control Panel\Desktop folder. Scroll down in the right panel and double click on the MenuShowDelay file. In the Value Data box, change to default value for the menu speed from 400 to a lesser number, such as 1. Click OK.
   
17. Disable Offline Files

Start > Settings > Control Panel > Folder Options > Offline Files > Untick "Enable Offline Files"
   
18. Disable Remote Desktop

Start > Settings > Control Panel > System > Remote > Untick "Allow users to connect remotely to this computer"
   
19. Disable Internet Synchronise Time

Start > Settings > Control Panel > Date and Time > Internet Time > Untick "Automatically synchronize with an internet time server"
   
20. Disable Hide Inactive Icons

Start > Settings > Taskbar and Start Menu > Taskbar TAB > Uncheck "Hide Inactive Icons"
   
21. Disable Automatic Desktop Cleanup Wizard

Start > Settings > Control Panel > Display > Desktop > Customise Desktop > Untick "Run Desktop Cleanup Wizard every 60 days"
   
22. Disable NTFS Last Access Time Logging (NTFS Only)

Start > Run > regedit > HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE > SYSTEM > CURRENTCONTROLSET > CONTROL > FILESYSTEM Add a new DWORD value - "NtfsDisableLastAccessUpdate" (without quotes) and set the value to 1. Then reboot to make changes effective
   
23. Disable Notification Area Balloon Tips

Click Start , click Run , type regedit , and then press ENTER. HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\ CurrentVersion\Explorer\Advanced Right-click the right pane, create a new DWORD value, and then name it EnableBalloonTips . Double-click this new entry, and then give it a hexadecimal value of 0 . Quit Registry Editor. Log off Windows, and then log back on.
   
24. Disable CDROM Autoplay


One of the very important (and well documented) tweaks in Windows 98SE, was to disable CDROM autoplay (auto insert notification). Disabling CDROM autoplay no longer offers a significant performance benefit in Windows XP, and therefore you do not need to disable it. Just don't insert a CD during a crucial recording.

However, if you really want to disable it then here a few different methods.

Method 1

Start > Run > Regedit

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\Cdrom

Set autorun to 0.

Method 2

Open My Computer Right Click on each CDROM and choose Properties Click on the Auto Play tab In the drop down box you can choose the Action for each choice shown in the drop down box

Method 3

Go to Start->Run->gpedit.msc Computer Config -> Administrative Template -> System Double click Turn off Autoplay Enable it.

   
25. Disable Disc Indexing



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