Official Luthiers Forum!

I was on another forum last night and a new builder asked some questions that lead one of the responders to ask “you do play don’t you” I think we can all agree that if you build you should be able to play some. I play so I can better understand what makes a guitar good. So I’m wondering who builds because they play and who plays because they build?

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Say what you do, Do what you say.

This is very interesting. My experience in my guitar building classes is that about half of the students don't play. Some don't know the first chord or even how to hold the guitar. This is a motivation to learn to play and some students go on to take lessons.
I also am suprised at the high number of engineers that take my classes. There is something about lutherie that attracts engineers.

I built my first one because I play. As I continue building it is turning into I play because I build. It hasn't yet, but it could. Does that make sense?

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"An adventure is only an inconvenience rightly considered. An inconvenience is an adventure wrongly considered." G. K. Chesterton.

I build because I play and love guitars... But I'm not that great of a guitarist, and I'm more interested in becoming a better builder than a better player.

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Jonathan Kendall, Siloam Springs AR

I am (was) an engineer in my first life. I have always loved woodworking, and equipped a nice shop while working. Didn't have time for lutherie until after I retired. I have now built two guitars, and am working on learning to play while building more. I find building guitars is more demanding of precise work than most other woodworking disciplines, and enjoy it more because of that- probably the engineering training.

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Gene

Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason- Mark Twain

I think, for me, there is less of a schism than Playing vs. Building. I both play (40 years) and enjoy making things with my hands, and for the same reason.

I enjoy the process of creation, whether it is art, music, furniture, fly rods, guitars, writings or whatever. For me the similarity in processes is striking. Creating something that was not there before, and the mental process of making value and artistic and scientific decisions and the physical process of creating with your own hands and skills is magical whether it is something ephemeral, like music, or permanent, like guitars.

What I like about guitars, there is a fusing of both art and science, and both the potential for the ephemeral and of the permanent.

Am I being silly?

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"Building guitars looks hard, but it's actually much harder than it looks." Tom Buck

I have been wanting to build for eight years. Why did I want to build? I really don't know, I just wanted to.

I am pretty much a creative person, who goes mad when I am not doing anything with my hands. I have dabbled or been serious in almost every creative discipline, painting,writing, acting, sculpture, photography, jewellery making, wood carving, fashion, embroidery and applique, wall hangings for my church, flute, bass guitar, acoustic guitar, bodhran, and a bit of piano...

My painting has gone to the wall since taking up woodcarving a few years ago, and I don't think I'll pick up a paintbrush for a while yet (those portraits of my kids will have to wait!!), for guitar building has really made a HUGE impression on me.Sam Price39106.5039814815

Don't know what it is about musical instruments that is so magical, maybe the sound they make, harmonies etc, i always love to find myself in a guitar store, all those instruments hung up there on the wall, the wood used to mke them and of course, the never ending will to play them all.

I've been playing guitars and mandolins for the last 26-27 years and besides that, i was always attracted to creative woodworking but didn't have any tools untill 5 years ago and no skills. Built a few things and one of my biggest projects prior to guitar building was a deck for my trailer at the campground which turned out really nice considering it was built by a rookie.

I now build guitars because i play and love these instruments, stringing up is a very emotional moment for me and i do that when i'm alone!

I've played for more than 40 years and I build because I play, or that's how it started. I was after a certain sound in a guitar, my choice was to lay the money down for a couple of George Lowden's or build my own. I of course took the expensive route and started to build my own.

If I ever manage to build a set of guitars that are just what I'm after, I'll stop building. But we know that won't happen, don't we.

However, if I'm asked I would still say that I'm a guitar/lute player who builds, rather than a builder who plays. They are musical instruments so the music always has to come first, otherwise they are just expensive kindling.

ColinColin S39106.5061111111

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I don't believe in anything, I simply make use of a set of reasonable working hypotheses.

It's in my genes, I think. My father was an engineer, his father was, and so was HIS father. Two of my three brothers are engineers, the third is a geophysicist. My mother's side are/were all professional woodworkers/artisans, making fine furniture and cabinetry, going back at least four generations. I studied architecture and engineering as an undergrad, and wound up with a grad degree in psychology (go figure).

Got a guitar when I was in the 6th grade, been playing ever since.

Guitarmaking was the most satisfying avocation I had, trumping even my addiction to flyfishing. Now it's the most satisfying vocation I've had.

Only trouble is, I have little time for tying flies anymore!

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James Warwick
J. Warwick Guitars, LLC
http://www.jwarwickguitars.com

Thought provoking question Dave,
There are certainly some similarities between us all. I have also been playing almost 40 years.
I guess I have always built my own instruments to play from the beginning.
I play by ear and so my approach to playing is somewhat intuitive. I build to make instruments that will inspire and support that intuitive approach to playing. These things have always been interconnected for me but I started as a player. The building takes a lifetime to do well where playing seemed to happen more quickly.
It is nice to be playing better guitars though.

Wade

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Wade
Nashua, NH
http://www.wadefx.com

I build because it is my gift to the Universe.


Ok, not much of a gift.



Truthfully, I build because I play, but creativity has a way of grabbing hold of you on many levels. One leads to the other.
I knew a guy who built guitars back in the '70's, and that got me hooked on the idea. I was also very interested in woodworking, and for many many years I was a frustrated woodworker and furniture designer, as well as a frustrated guitarmaker. I would draw up furniture etc., but not having tools or a place to work, I was unable to release all that stored up creativity. Finally a little more than 10 years ago I'd had enough and bulldosed my way into the craft.

Like Colin, I'd played a Llowden, and had heard enough Olsons to know that I wanted a better guitar than I had. I was enamored with cedar-topped instruments, but as luck would have it, I couldn't afford what I wanted, and I would have to sell my other guitars to even get a small downpayment on a guitar I would have to wait several years for. I decided it was high time to learn to build them, like I had seemingly always wanted to do.
Like Colin, if I ever build what I feel to be the "perfect guitars" for my liking, I would seriously think of quitting.

Nah....that wouldn't happen even then. There's no good 5-step program for this addiction.Don Williams39106.5192361111

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"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

[QUOTE=Robbie O'Brien] I also am suprised at the high number of engineers that take my classes. There is something about lutherie that attracts engineers. [/QUOTE]

I agree Robbie, here at Purdue there is an engineering technology course where they design a classical guitar on cad for a semester, then they all build one the following semester. Needless to say I think that course is always full.

I can't play a note, it's just a wood fetish. The first was built because I saw an ad for LMI and thought it looked fun. My guitar guru buddy said I couldn't build an acoustic. That challenge was all it took to push me over the edge.

In my daily life I remodel oversize kitchens for people who are driven by "keeping up with the joneses" to install plate warmers, built-in spaghetti cookers, three ovens, two dishwashers with two drawers each and 35 lights on the ceiling. Then they go for take-out.

Guitar building is a very personal hobby that takes me away from the endless meetings and phone calls and allows me to spand some time with myself. Kind of the same for you players too, eh?

I build because I play.

I have always wanted a Lowden, but there is no way I could justify the financial outlay because (A) my lovely wife would kill me and (B) I'm not a good enough player to merit it.

I teach Design & Technology in Highschool.

I'm supposed to have the woodworking skills.

building helps me to develop my woodworking and maybe get a decent guitar, mando, zouk & bass at the end of it.

If a few other folk want to fund my hobby by buying the results from me at a fraction more than they cost then I'm happy!!

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My soundclick xx luthier blog xx luthier soundclick

I havent met too many guitars players worth thier salt who dont know at least a bit if not alot about the construction of instruments, and if they dont know alot they definitely pretend as if they do.
Its a natural progression I think, and while most players dont take the building plunge for whatever reason,
mabye they dont know enough about woodworking,
mabye they just have too much success as a musician,
mabye thier interest is just not strong enough to warrant the expense of outfitting a shop,
or mabye life just goes in a different direction for them,
I think it would at least interest most people serious about the tone of thier instruments, to know why they sound as though they do.
I have always wanted to build guitars just cause Im fascinated with guitars.
I have ideas that I would like to try, and models I would like to play but seriously couldnt afford to buy all of them from a high end luthier or company.
After the incident that left me in a chair, I shifted from thinking about building as a hobby with a music career in the forefront, to thinking of building as a career with music as more of a hobby, either way I feel building will be just as gratifying,
Im sure to find out soon - being just about ready to commence, I couldnt imagine it benig reprehensible,
Cheers
Charliewood

Years ago I was a VW mechanic. I'd take a pile of metal and assemble a person a great engine. Lots of work went into building a four cylinder horizontally opposed engine and have it last for years. There was nothing more satisfying that hearing that pile of metal roar to life, then serve it's owner for years to come.

I get that same sense building guitars. Taking a pile of wood and making an instrument is very rewarding. That first strum is all mine. After a few chords and runs, I'm done. I'm no guitar player, I'm a builder.

Now back up a century or so, James R. Dickie was a wagonmaker in middle Tennessee 1830-1850. His son, William Henry Harrison Dickie was a wheelwright. His son, James R. Dickey was a blacksmith. These are my great grandfathers. My grandfather was a oilhand in Oklahoma, my dad a trucker. Neither of them ever built anything structurally.

On my mother's side, my grandfather, Ervan Adams, Bell Avenue, Los Angeles, was a carpenter and a darned good one. My mother could saw and hammer with the best of them, but she was beautiful and ended up being a homemaker and raising a passle of kids.

That left me, searching for an identity, and I found it in working wood and making music in a small way. Playing cello in grade school and jr. high, gave me a love for instrumental music. I married a choir girl who played guitar. We have a couple of boys and they are both greatly gifted in music.

I found a black strat for my oldest and that started my love of music all over again. Not just for him, but for me. So, building guitars combines my love of doing what I was created to do, and the music that stirs the souls of men.Bruce Dickey39111.427662037

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http://www.dickeyguitars.com

I went on holidays with my family this summer with my family. My first stop
was Squwamish BC. I found a used National single cone. About 2 weeks
later we spent the night at my brother-in-laws and he had a fairly high end
classical made by a Spanish company. After spending the morning with that
guitar don't you know I just had to have a classical. Having played many
$200 classicals, I had no idea. And having just spent 2K on a National I
didn't even try it on my wife. To make it short, I am now waiting for the
lacquer to cure on my 90% built, I'll call it a nylon string out of respect for
the traditional builders, guitar. I'm now in the process of re-tooling the
shop and dreaming of the enjoyment to come. I need a mando and my 10
year old is a great violin player. Guess what my next two builds will be!
Cheers, Danny

[QUOTE=Bruce Dickey]

Now back up a century or so, James R. Dickie was a wagonmaker in middle Tennessee 1830-1850. His son, William Henry Harrison Dickie was a wheelwright. His son, James R. Dickey was a blacksmith. These are my great grandfathers. My grandfather was a oilhand in Oklahoma, my dad a trucker. Neither of them ever built anything.

On my mother's side, my grandfather, Ervan Adams, Bell Avenue, Los Angeles, was a carpenter and a darned good one. My mother could saw and hammer with the best of them, but she was beautiful and ended up being a homemaker and raising a passle of kids.

[/QUOTE]

Totally fascinating...I'm so glad you posted this; I don't know much about my family history until I got back incontact with my estranged father again.

When I told him I was making guitars, he nearly wept...apparently his grandfather and great-grandfather were carpenters, and another relative was a master builder and he was given a small roll of chisels he treasures...my father tried a bit of carpentry, but got into programming after my Mum would criticise his wood-working efforts

Needless to say he was absolutely delighted to see the "carpentry" genes in me...I did not take it up as a qualification (my teacher was DESPERATE to see me enrol on the course, whatever that means LOL!) due to the low intake of females doing the course...being 13 at the time, it seemed mates and image was more important than abilities!!!!!Sam Price39106.5882523148

Great thread. Just great.   Keep 'em coming.

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"Building guitars looks hard, but it's actually much harder than it looks." Tom Buck

I have been playing for 20 years. I also have an engineering degree and two successful artists as parents.

Luthiery is a great way to combine my passions for visual/tactile art and music while at the same time it satisfies my need for constant intellectual and scientific challenges.

I know I'll never build a perfect instrument, but that is what I strive for. In knowing that I can enjoy the journey of guitarmaking on several levels as well as the end product. It's a win/win/win situation for me, and I'm pretty sure I'll do it till the day I die whether or not anyone cares to purchase the end product.

[QUOTE=Robbie O'Brien] I also am suprised at the high number of engineers that take my classes. There is something about lutherie that attracts engineers. [/QUOTE]

Maybe because you are located near CSM, lots of engineer types, my alma mater.

Because I am not rich enough yet to be able to ski every day, somewhere nice ... yep, I'd rather be skiing.

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Tony Karol
www.karol-guitars.com
"let my passion .. fulfill yours"

Someone said once that "Without death there would be no art". The
reason being that artists create art as a way to leave a mark on the world
that lives on after they are long gone. I think that is true for me.

Even though I played first and started building later. It seems the
building is much more important to me.

Serge said something in his post that struck me... He said something
about loving to be in a music store...   I thought about how I'm hardly
ever in a music store. I'm way more happy in the woods, around a
sawmill, or in a lumber yard! I guess I'm more interested in the guitar
that "could be... rather than the guitar that already is..

long

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"No man ever steps in the same river twice, for it's not the same river and he's not the same man.” -Heraclitus of Ephesus

[QUOTE=TonyKarol] Because I am not rich enough yet to be able to ski every day, somewhere nice ... yep, I'd rather be skiing.[/QUOTE]

Here's from my back yard. Come on over, Tony!




I like to think that I'm a much better player than builder, at least I have been doing it for a lot longer. These days I don't play much any more, and I don't build enough to become any good either, so where does that leave me...







I think I'll go skiing!

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Rian Gitar og Mandolin