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And here is a commercial unit from Grizzly for a edge sander.

Over kill but might be good for the production line (mind you most of the production shops would tend to have a CNC machine do the compound radius for them)

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[QUOTE=WaddyT] Michael, I'll have to look at the plans. The ones I have are the old version, i.e., the 1937 Hauser ex Segovia version. GAL plan #33, and the details and a small plan are in AL #31 or Big Red Book #3.   It definately mentions relief, but I can't recall how much. I am not using them for this build, but I do have them. The only Hauser Sr, guitar I have ever played was one a friend had, and has since sold, and I don't recall whether it had bass side relief or not, and if it did, it was subtle.
[/QUOTE]

We need a separate thread here for classical fingerboards, as indeed they are not level (usually). The sanded-in relief on the bass side (between the third and 12th fret) can be as large as 0.015". If you use the Ramirez set up, which would be akin to the proverbial electrics from our youth with action that you could drive a car under, then the bass relief isn't as critical. Ramirez' are set up with something like 4.75mm of clearance on the bass side at the 12th fret. Most of us live with a much more wimpy 4mm.

I thank Rick for his persistance in earlier versions of this discussion, and will be thinking about it even more as I chase the darned buzz near the 12th fret on the B string on the one I'm just finishing now.

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Jim Kirby
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This thread is hitting at a good time since I now have 4 guitars that are almost complete and ready for necks and frets. As you may know, up until now I have been hammering my frets in with a deadblow hammer that has a hard neoprene head on it. I had not had any problems with this method until the last guitar which turned out to be a disaster because of a moment of indescretion when I hammered the last fret in without using a caul and cracked the face of the guitar and broke lose the transverse brace.

Since then, I have purchased fret pressing cauls and plan on using my drill press to press the frets in.

One thing doesnt change in my process though, and has been echoed here already.... that is to prepare the fretboard before you put the frets in. This all starts with running the fingerboard through the drum sander to start with so that I am assured that I have a straight fretboard. I sand the neck also using a block of marble with self adhesive sand paper on so that I am assured that this surface is also level. Once those two surfaces are flat and level, I glue them together. Next is sanding the face of the fretboard with a radiused block to give me the desired radius of the fingerboard. After and only after all of this is leveled, glued and sanded to prefection do I place the frets in...I have found that by properly preparing the fretboard and taking steps to assure that it is perfect I dont have to level the frets afterwards as they always come out right. This doesnt mean I dont check it anyway... ya never know and I have found frets that didnt get set properly.

Since I will be doing a lot of this in the coming week, I'll try to remember to document the whole process and post them.

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Reguards,

Ken H

First, I should say that I built this guitar using the “StewMac” kit. I followed the instructions for
the most part. Where I deviated from the instructions, is I decided to install all frets, instead of
waiting to install the remaining ones on the upper bout after the neck was installed. Also, the fret-
board was pre-slotted, with the standard radius.

Before the neck was installed, I used the neck to trace for the cutting of the fretboard, then I
trued it up using a 2' level with self adhesive sandpaper. I continued sanding, and used the neck as
a gage for the final fit of the fretboard. When I was completely satisfied with the fit,
I installed the pearl inlay dots, and the side dots. I did a final sanding with 400 grit, then cleaned with compressed
air, and it was ready for frets.

After cutting all frets, I lightly tapped the ends in, using a 4 oz. hammer. I then used my drill press,
along with a fret caul I got from “StewMac”, and pressed all of them in, being careful to check to
see if they were seated properly, if not, I simply re-pressed the fret.

Rather than using a pair of nippers, I cut all the ends of the frets off using a dremel, and a metal cutting wheel.
With my magni-focuser on, I was able to cut very close to the fretboard, without
damaging it. This allowed for very little sanding of the frets.

Then I set the fretted fingerboard on a piece of man-made marble, which is about as flat as you
can get. Holding the fingerboard at the edge of the marble, I took the same 2' level with self
adhesive sandpaper, and sanded an approximately 60 degree angle on the frets. Then, I painstakingly,
with a small flat needle file smoothed each end of each fret. (Boy, do I need some fret files!)

With the neck set, and aligned perfectly, I glued on the fretboard. I was careful to align the
fretboard before final clamping, by using spring clamps to hold it in place in the perfect position on the neck.
The next day, using a dense foam sanding pad, I sanded the frets using, in succession,
400 grit, 1200 grit, and finally, 6000 grit micromesh to polish the frets.

After all was said and done, everything looked straight and true, except there was a ever so slight
fall off from the fourteenth fret to the sound hole.

That’s about it!

Robert

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[QUOTE=jtkirby]

We need a separate thread here for classical fingerboards, as indeed they are not level (usually). The sanded-in relief on the bass side (between the third and 12th fret) can be as large as 0.015".
[/QUOTE]

I'm a bit confused about the use of the term 'relief' in this discussion. I've always understood relief to mean the amount of 'dip' or 'concavity' in the fingerboard- something which is commonly measured as the clearance under a straightedge (or taut string) resting on the 1st and 14th(or nearby) fret. That seems to be the quantity you are talking about- 0.015 between fret 1 and 12.

Some of the other posters seem to be referring to the 'twist' in the fretboard surface on a classical, where commonly the bass side is sanded away throughout the fingerboard length. An example of this is what I was taught: Sand/plane the fingerboard so that the plane of the fingerboard (without frets) intersects the bridge about 2/3 of its thickness up from the soundboard on the treble side, 1/3 up on the bass side.

I'd appreciate somebody setting me straight on this, and giving some more measurements for classical setup.

Thanks

John

I was looking at the 1937 Hauser Sr. plans.  The fretboard is 6mm @ the nut, 5mm at the soundhole on the treble side and 4mm at the soundhole on the bass side.  Then there is a note in the margin that says, "relief in fretboard .002" - .004" slack".  That would be .05mm to .10mm, but it does not say where from or where to, and there is no other mention of it in the Brune article in AL #31 which has the article on that guitar.

I'm probably not helping here.  I did note that the plain of his top is about 2mm below the bottom of the fretboard at the nut, so a 2mm negative slope on the neck. (I guess that's considered negative.)

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Waddy

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Thanks, Waddy.

Obviously the relief in this case isn't much (.003")-possibly not something 'built-in' during construction.

Cheers

John

John, I was just looking at Dave Schramm's Online Apprentice Site, and he has a pretty good tutorial on fretting, where he mentions relief from the 3rd to 12th fret, and explains how to get it.  Seems pretty good, and appears, to me anyway, that it is the full width of the board, not just in the bass side...  That would mean the board is slightly scooped (he says .010 - .020")from the 3rd to 12th fret.  The posts on leveling and polishing have either been removed, or have not been posted yet.

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Waddy

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