Official Luthiers Forum!

Hello All,

after reading several threads on temperature and humidity these past few months.
I’ve decided to move my guitar building area from my 20' X 32' shed to my basement.
The temp. stays at an average 50 to 60 degrees, and humidity 45% to 55% all year long.

The room I have available is 11' X 12'.
The question is, will it be enough to build 3 guitars simultaneously, at different stages?

I figure that I could do all my major cutting and sanding in the shed where I have to keep the big
power tools. Then do the, minor shaping, hand sanding, and assembly in the basement work shop.
Also, it would be the perfect place to do repair work for a perspective customer.

I"ve drawn a simple plan to give you all an idea of what I'm trying to do.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

Robert

_________________
Everything has beauty, But, not everyone see's it!

Because you can keep all the big tools in the shed, this is an ideal situation for you Robert.

You can keep this work area climate controlled very easily.

That is certainly a lot of bench space. You can very easily make a built in go bar deck there too, I would make it along the shortest wall. You would have enough space to glue up a back and top at the same time.

I assume that you will make drawers or some storage space below the benches although, having a machine shop area, you don't need much room for tools in here. That will free up more space to store zoot .

John How had a post about a month ago with a video of his shop. He also has a dedicated set up/glue up room like your thinking of. Take a look at it here.

I think this is really Ideal, you can limit the dust in there and have a nice glue up room.

_________________
My Facebook Guitar Page

"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson

[QUOTE=Hesh1956]

My benches are only 24" from the not 36" and I like them this size. [/QUOTE]

I agree with Hesh on the width of the benches. With a 36 inch bench, I would find it difficult to reach across and up to access stuff on shelves or hung on the wall.
Even my 24 inch bench accumulates a lot of junk at the back.
Drawers under the benches are a great idea, but leave some bench edge available for clamping- it's very convenient.
Separating the power tools/dust/shavings/noise from the 'fine woodworking' part of the shop is a good idea. I like it.
Cheers

John

Robert,

Looks like a great place to do the final assembly steps. You've started me thinking about separating the machining and assembly steps in the house I'm moving to in a couple of months. I also agree with John and Hesh about the benchtop width. Since the guitar bodies are only 19-20" long (before neck attach), I'd think 24" would work well.
You can add some shallow drawer storage underneath for your tools, some shelves for assembly jigs, and cabinets or hanging boards on the walls for other tools. I think it's a great setup

_________________
Gene

Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason- Mark Twain

Everyone here is dead on... Go with 24" benches. It'll save materials & stop you from accumulating rubble against the walls as well as giving you more elbow room. I hope the ceiling is 8' or higher... Think overhead storage.
I have a 10 X 12 "assembly room" inside my shop. There is a tall cupboard on one side for hanging instruments once the neck is attached. On top of the cupboard is storage space for lots of guitar bodies... & the dehum lives up there.
Over one 5' section of bench there is an overhead shelf which serves double duty as go-deck (enough room for two decks, though it's a bit awkward getting into the corner to use the second one)& wood storage.
You'll probably find that you are reluctant to leave your small room whenever you have dusty operations to perform. I have to constantly control my urge to do "just a little bit" with the orbital sander.
My little space stays *fairly* dust free & the temp & humidity control doesn't take a load of power... I love it & I'm sure you will too!
Good Luck,   Dan

Thanks All,

I knew you guys would have some good ideas!

Yes, draws and storage shelving below would be a must.

As far as the (36" in width) goes, that was a number I just sort of through in there. It sounded like a good size.
I think you all are right though, it’s a little to wide. After re-thinking this, I went to the kitchen.
Standard kitchen counter tops are approx. 24" in width (from the front edge to finish face of the back splash).
As I was standing there it seemed to me that I could use just a little more room. So, I’m thinking
30" will be perfect. I really like the 36" from the floor, (which is also standard kitchen counter top height.)
Because I like to stand when I work.

Overhead shelving is also a great idea, and no doubt I will need some. I was thinking of one or maybe
two walls with peg board installed. You can hang virtually anything on that stuff.

I’m planning on building it simply right now, (2"X4" & Plywood) but, I may change my mind.
You can get pre-fab cabinets from Home Depot or Lowes for really good prices, and they also, sell
counter top material for around $12.00/ln. ft. Its called “POST FORM.” Of course this would bring me
back to the 24" wide area, and this type of counter top would not work well for edge clamping.

Still much thinking to do on this subject, and if anyone cares to put in more, I’m open.

Thanks to All again!

Robert

_________________
Everything has beauty, But, not everyone see's it!

Robert,

Ditto on the bench depths. 24' should work fine unless you're building cellos.

May I suggest a strong shelf hung from the ceiling to use as the top half of the go bar deck. That way, you'd have usable bench space when you weren't using the deck.

_________________
now known around here as Pat Foster
_________________
http://www.patfosterguitars.com

Not to hijack, but,

Terry,

I'm guessing that you're using Safari. I've run into the same problem you're having with the spaces. Somewhere between putting in a link in the compose window of Safari and its going to the OLF server, any lines that don't fit in the compose window get a space stuck into them at the line break. You can either use a shorter URL (tinyurl.com) or another browser, such as Firefox. HTH

_________________
now known around here as Pat Foster
_________________
http://www.patfosterguitars.com

I'll second Pat's suggestion (actually I think I may have mentioned it in my first post) to make a built-in go-bar deck with some storage overtop.



Overhead storage is something I use a lot.



As you can see though, I need some better organization skills

_________________
My Facebook Guitar Page

"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson

It looks good Robert. I like having a work island like Terry also.
I recently built one and I really like it.I like being able to get all around the guitar.

_________________
Anderson Guitars
Clearwater,Fl. 33755

When I built my shop a luthier w/ more experience then I'll ever have advised me to make one of my benches an island work station. His reasoning was that with wall benches no matter how careful you are you'll occasionally hit the wall w/ your instrument.

Your space allows for a nice size island in the top half of your drawing and a wall bench along the lower wall which would probably work well for what you want to do.

[QUOTE=Roy O] When I built my shop a luthier w/ more experience then I'll ever have advised me to make one of my benches an island work station. His reasoning was that with wall benches no matter how careful you are you'll occasionally hit the wall w/ your instrument.
[/QUOTE]

Given my work techniques, my thinking along those lines would go something like this: With wall benches, my chances of knocking an instrument onto the floor is reduced by half.

_________________
now known around here as Pat Foster
_________________
http://www.patfosterguitars.com

I like working around my free standing work bench, but I would advice against an island bench in a room that small. I think you would end up with too much "traffic area" and not enough effective work and storage area. A semi island that connects to the wall mounted bench is a good option. Does the room have any windows? Positioning a work bench semi island so daylight enters the bench from the left (if you are right handed) is good.

_________________
Rian Gitar og Mandolin

Ditto to what Arnt said. Unless an "Island" can be rolled out of the way it takes up too much space in a small room & restricts your "passageways" across the room.
Do you need both doors in the shop to open? a doorway takes up a lot of usable space also.

Piggy backing on what Daniel said (also nice to see you around more Daniel) what if you made one of the sections of one of the benches on wheels so you can make a rolling island bench? That why you have the best of both worlds.

_________________
My Facebook Guitar Page

"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson

Just stick to 24 inch wide benches. I even have a wing off my bench that is only 18 inches so that I can get around three sides of a guitar without having to over reach. 30" benches will still be too wide, in my humble, 25 years of woodworking, opinion.

Shane

_________________
Canada

I did exactly what arnt & Daniel suggested. I gave myself the flexibilty of an island and extra depth for a work bench, by building one table on casters. My shop is 10'x22' and the table fits on one of the short walls. It is 36 inches deep and 60 inches long with storage below and the top lip projects out so I can use it as a clamping surface. If I did it again I would probably make it only 30 inches deep but I like the mobility and the extra depth below provides storage for routers and sanders. I agree with the others that a fixed cabinet that is 36" is way to deep but since I can get to all sides of it I need to it works ok.

I really like the idea of separating power tools from the assembly area and I wish I had the room to do that.
Bob B.

Thanks to All for your input,

I haven’t quite made up my mind yet to the final design, but, I’m still leaning towards a 30" deep
work area. I think this way, cause when I stand at my kitchen counter top (which is 24" deep)
I get the feeling I need just a little more room. Also, if I go with pre-fab kitchen cabinets
(which are 24" deep) I’ll have a 6" overhang that would allow for plenty of clamping room.
Don’t know if I would ever need that much or not, but, it might be nice to have if I do.

I gotta say that, you guys have come up with some pretty good ideas! I really like the built in
go-bar system. And, the rolling island idea is a good one too!
However, I can add that at any time in the future if I need too.

Daniel, unfortunately the two doorways are already there, and cannot be moved. One goes to my
mechanical room where the furnace, pressure tank, and water heater are located. The other would
serve as the entrance to the work space.

Also, I should say that this room is un-finished, 2 concrete walls, and 2 framed walls.
But, that allows for many possibilities.

Thanks again, Robert

_________________
Everything has beauty, But, not everyone see's it!

    I have a separate machine room that remains unheated and controlled
all of the time. My main work station or bench is made up of two 3.5ft. X
7ft. benches pushe together to form a 7ft.X7ft. isand in the centr of
building area.

    The beauty of an island is that it allows me to lay a guitar on each of
the four sides while having plenty of room to work on all four as needed.
It is nice to get into a flow of working in circle around the bench and
make your way around from one instrument to another leaving one to dry
while not having to move it out of the way while clamping another.

   I would think that the wall mounted benches will work better in the
smaller room that you're moving into. An island of dimensions that can
allow you the room to work all the way around it may not give you
enough space to move freely around it so your current design ideas are
probably best.

Kevin, Thanks for your input!

My plan is be set up, so that I can build at least three guitars simultaneously at different stages.
I’m thinking of a sort of assemble line system. Perhaps starting from my left, working
clockwise around the room. Maybe, I even have room to build 4 or 5 guitars. The whole idea hear
is to get “time efficient” with out sacrificing quality. I figure, that it is possible to build 3 of, what
I would call, your standard variety guitars, in a month. Given that I had the time. I don’t know,
I could be asking a little to much of my self on this one.

Anyway, I’m open to more opinions.

Robert

_________________
Everything has beauty, But, not everyone see's it!