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I have been talking with someone for several months about a commission. He lives in Singapore. I have no idea what is involved with shipping him a guitar.
What problems/issues/restrictions are there with sending a custom guitar to Singapore? What would be the best way for a builder ship a guitar there?
I know nothing about that and it scares me a bit.
Will the shipper handle all the details? If I take it to FedEx or UPS will they know enough to handle it properly?
Thanks!

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"An adventure is only an inconvenience rightly considered. An inconvenience is an adventure wrongly considered." G. K. Chesterton.

Steve,

I think the humidity issue will be "interesting" for you - around 89% according to the AOL weather map I just looked up. Different sort of humidity control for the build

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Dave White
De Faoite Stringed Instruments
". . . the one thing a machine just can't do is give you character and personalities and sometimes that comes with flaws, but it always comes with humanity" Monty Don talking about hand weaving, "Mastercrafts", Weaving, BBC March 2010

You need to check the rates, it may shock you! I was quoted $800 US to ship one to Fiji. Some shippers won't even take a stringed instrument for transport, much less insure it...   Mike

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The Biggest Little City, Nevada
www.hammondguitars.com
I love building guitars!

Thanks Guys.

89% RH - Wow! That would be about a 54% jump from what I build. Do you think that might cause some trouble?

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"An adventure is only an inconvenience rightly considered. An inconvenience is an adventure wrongly considered." G. K. Chesterton.

[QUOTE=Hesh1956] 1) Get the money up front....

2) Get the money up front....

3) Get the money up front....

Beyond this you should be good-to-go......

Seriously though talk with Kevin I think he ships to Asia and is experienced with the ins and outs.[/QUOTE]

I second Hesh's comments about getting the money up front. Also, be careful of credit card fraud.

Steve, I shipped a guitar to Singapore just last summer.
No problems at all.
Well, other han my wallet took a hit: $230.00 via FedEx.

But that beats $800 all to pieces.
I "borrowed" a guitar box from a local music store, put the instrument in a good case, then layered thin 1/4" plywood either side of the case.
Of course it was insured, but who knows what would have happened if the guitar had been demolished?

Good luck!

Steve K

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From Nacogdoches...the oldest town in Texas.

http://www.stephenkinnaird.com

shudda checked--

read "other than..." on line three...

Steve

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From Nacogdoches...the oldest town in Texas.

http://www.stephenkinnaird.com

Thats good to know....I have 3 commissions to go to Singapore.

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Peter M.
Cornerstone Guitars
http://www.cornerstoneukes.com

As far as the actual shipping aspect goes it is very easy. I have to do it all the time from work. Unfortunately you will only have two options "economy" and "priority" (both will be expensive) if you use one of the big three... FedEx, UPS, DHL. Usually the difference is only a couple days and $50 or so depending on how big it is to begin with. Hesh is right though, just make sure you get the cash upfront. Definitely no Western Union... don't ask me how I know. 

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Time is a great teacher, but unfortunately it kills all its pupils - Louis Hector Berlioz

Chansen / C hansen / C. Hansen / Christian Hansen - not a handle.

Christian

First post here though I've been around here for the last year or so. I presently live in Singapore, as a graduate student, though I grew up first in Manchester, England then Amsterdam and Malaysia (where I'm originally from, and yes, there's where Malaysian blackwood originates ).

I've presently commissioned a spruce/African blackwood guitar from Joshua French whom I got to know through the OLF. Myself - I build classical guitars on weekends (probably the only one in this country ), and it's turned out to be a wonderful hobby, and I'm excited to say that I've learned much from this forum.

Shipping from the US to Singapore should cost between USD100 to 250. This I somehow gleaned after checking out a few luthiers to make and send me a classical guitar. Darren Hippner quoted me USD100 (perhaps less if I recall correctly, via USPS), while the higher end of the range was quoted to me by an eBay merchant, via FedEx (he didn't like UPS).

Laws here are *very* strict so I don't think fraud is a widespread occurrence - though you get lemons once in a while, of course. For payment, I used a postal order (a bank draft would work equally well) drawn on a US bank (Citibank) - works fine for both parties, economically. It costs about SGD8 to take out a postal order, which I used to send my deposit to Joshua.

GST of 5% is imposed on all items above SGD400 of value imported in Singapore. Sadly, this will rise to 7% on July 15 (hurry, build the guitar ). There are no duties on musical instruments, since there's no musical instrument production industry to protect.

The woods I had shipped from the US to Singapore via FedEx, who in turn settled everything including the GST charges (they did charge me SGD10 for settling the paperwork).

Humidity hits about 80+%, yes, but much lower indoors. It's stifling during hot afternoons, but Singapore isn't known as the 'air-conditioned nation' for nothing, both literally and figuratively. I've had no problems with the humidity though - anyway better higher than lower.

I'll see what else I can find out if there's any further information needed.

Glad to be here!
Cheers,
EJ   

WOW .. those shiping rates seem pretty cheap .. I shipped a guitar to Italy from Canada (thats closer than Singapore)), and it was over 600 Cdn. You can easily go into the Fedex website and put in the destinations and pkg weight/dimensions - it will give you a pretty accurate quote.

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Tony Karol
www.karol-guitars.com
"let my passion .. fulfill yours"

Yes, I could have shipped cheaper via the USPS.
That is, until they rejected the box due to size restrictions.
And from what I've gleaned, that is *almost* a post-office by post office judgment call. Unhappily, ours said "no". So, off to FedEx we went.

Steve

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From Nacogdoches...the oldest town in Texas.

http://www.stephenkinnaird.com

[QUOTE=verhoevenc] I imagine Singapore is relatively cheap because it's a HUGE port of ALL sorts, ship, air, etc. Whereas, Italy maybe not be... I guess what I'm sayin' is if you're going with the flow... and already established one that is... it's gunna cost ya less cause they're headed that way anyways.
Chris[/QUOTE]

Honestly? Italy's hooked in pretty close to bigger distributions networks than Singapore, being on the European mainland, no borders, and plenty of big ports (Genoa, Rotterdam, Hamburg) around to accept. 600 strikes me as crazy high, but it's probably surcharge size issues, and/or heavy case and guitar. I'll probably be shipping a guitar (small, electric, headless) out to Canada at some point, and I expect it to run less than 100 bucks, all told. I have noticed Canada Post is significantly more expensive than, say, USPS. It's the main reason I don't buy more wood from Canada. (well, ok, the main reason is that I'd get killed if more boxes of wood arrived here, but still...)

[QUOTE=Steve Kinnaird] Steve, I shipped a guitar to Singapore just last summer.
No problems at all.
Well, other han my wallet took a hit: $230.00 via FedEx.

But that beats $800 all to pieces.
I "borrowed" a guitar box from a local music store, put the instrument in a good case, then layered thin 1/4" plywood either side of the case.
Of course it was insured, but who knows what would have happened if the guitar had been demolished?
[/QUOTE]

Hey Steve,

Just curious -- did you use the insurance that FedEx supplies or somebody else? Reason why I've been using USPS instead of UPS or FedEx is because I haven't been able to get the insurance from them I needed.

Incidentally, this thread is helpful for me. I have a client in India who I'll be building a guitar for soon. Humidity issues have already been discussed, but tips on packing the guitar are always helpful.

Best,

Michael

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Live to Play, Play to Live

well, it wasnt Canada Post .. It was UPS .. Fedex was worse. Seeing as I am not the one paying, it doesnt concern me that much, but still ...

Guess I need to check the old post office - its just that Fedex within Canada or to the US is cheap - 90-125 bucks depending where and the size. Most guitar shop shipping stuff use Fedex or UPS, not canada Post, but i will check it out.

_________________
Tony Karol
www.karol-guitars.com
"let my passion .. fulfill yours"

EJ,

I'll be moving to singapore in july-ish- we should meet up!

Warmest regards.
Terence

Nice - most definitely.
You'll eventually come to love the biting heat and the stifling humidity - I think on the good days it's as bad as the few summers I've spent in Manchester and London.
Also, you might bring all the wood and tools you can - the only wood you will find here is plywood.
I'll PM you my contact later!

With best wishes,
EJ

I dont want to give Singaporeans a bad name - but there is some real problems with fraud and Singapore.
Its not even actual Singapore residents sometimes - but because Singapore is such a high commerce regoin, people will use Singapore as a launch point to have the fraudulently obtained merchandise shipping forwarded to thier country, or another country where it is sold at a discount.
There are cc and bank draft variations of these scams as well{not sure about money order}.
Sometimes you will cash the bank draft at your bank and recieve the money, only to find that when the bank draft arrives at the bank of origin it will be determined to be fruadulent i.e. counterfeit - this is sometimes as much as 6 weeks later. Guess who gets to take the hit?
Its never happened to me - but a friend of mine has a rock and gem business and has taken big hits...
Be wary, although Im sure your customer is on the up and up.
Cheers
Charliewood

ALSO THIS CC SCAM IS MAKING THE ROUNDS NOW AND IS VERY SLICK!! I found this on another luthier site

This one is pretty slick since they provide YOU with all the information, except the one piece they want.

Note, the callers do not ask for your card number; they already have it. This information is worth reading. By understanding how the VISA & MasterCard Telephone Credit Card Scam works, you'll be better prepared to protect yourself.

One of our employees was called on Wednesday from "VISA", and I was called on Thursday from "Master Card".

The scam works like this: Person calling says, "This is (name), and I'm calling from the Security and Fraud Department at VISA. My Badge number is 12460. Your card has been flagged for an unusual purchase pattern, and I'm calling to verify. This would be on your VISA card which was issued by (name of bank). Did you purchase an Anti-Telemarketing Device for $497.99 from a Marketing company based in Arizona?" When you say "No", the caller continues with, "Then we will be issuing a credit to your account. This is a company we have been watching and the charges range from $297 to $497, just under the $500 purchase pattern that flags most cards. Befo! re your next statement, the credit will be sent to (gives you your address), is that correct?"

You say "yes". The caller continues - "I will be starting a Fraud investigation. If you have any questions, you should call the 1- 800 number listed on the back of your card (1-800-VISA) and ask for Security.

You will need to refer to this Control Number. The caller then gives you a 6 digit number. "Do you need me to read it again?"

Here's the IMPORTANT part on how the scam works. The caller then says, "I need to verify you are in possession of your card". He'll ask you to "turn your card over and look for some numbers". ; There are 7 numbers; the first 4 are part of your card number, the next 3 are the security Numbers' that verify you are the possessor of the card. These are the numbers you sometimes use to make Internet purchases to prove you have the card. The caller will ask you to read the 3 numbers to him. After you tell the caller the 3 numbers, he'll say, "That is correct, I just needed to verify that the card has not been lost or stolen, and that you still have your card. Do you have any other ques! tions?" After you say No, the caller then thanks you and states, "Don't hesitate to call back if you do", and hangs up. What the scammers want is the 3-digit PIN number on the back of the card. Don't give it to them. Instead, tell them you'll call VISA or Master card directly for verification of their conversation. The real VISA told us that they will never ask for anything on the card as they already know the information since they issued the card! If you give the scammers your 3 Digit PIN Number, you think you're receiving a credit. However, by the time you get your statement you'll see charges for purc hases you didn't make, and by then it's almost too late and/or more difficult ! to actually file a fraud report.
What makes this more remarkable is that on Thursday, I got a call from a "Jason Richardson of Master Card" with a word-for-word repeat of the VISA scam. This time I didn't let him finish. I hung up! We filed a police report, as instructed by VISA. The police said they are taking several of these reports daily! They also urged us to tell everybody we know that this scam is happening.

[QUOTE=charliewood] I dont want to give Singaporeans a bad name - but there is some real problems with fraud and Singapore.
Its not even actual Singapore residents sometimes - but because Singapore is such a high commerce regoin, people will use Singapore as a launch point to have the fraudulently obtained merchandise shipping forwarded to thier country, or another country where it is sold at a discount.
There are cc and bank draft variations of these scams as well{not sure about money order}.
Sometimes you will cash the bank draft at your bank and recieve the money, only to find that when the bank draft arrives at the bank of origin it will be determined to be fruadulent i.e. counterfeit - this is sometimes as much as 6 weeks later. Guess who gets to take the hit?
Its never happened to me - but a friend of mine has a rock and gem business and has taken big hits...
Be wary, although Im sure your customer is on the up and up.
Cheers
Charliewood [/QUOTE]

I totally agree with Charlie here- and I'm Singaporean to boot. I usually insist on a wire transfer which cannot be cancelled or, you will need to wait until the banker's draft clears. Check with you bank over here, it takes up to 14 working days, but when you ring them up and check with customer service, they will be able to tell you if it's cleared or is fraudulent.

Warmest regards,
Terence

[QUOTE=Mattia Valente] [QUOTE=verhoevenc] I imagine Singapore is relatively cheap because it's a HUGE port of ALL sorts, ship, air, etc. Whereas, Italy maybe not be... I guess what I'm sayin' is if you're going with the flow... and already established one that is... it's gunna cost ya less cause they're headed that way anyways.
Chris[/QUOTE]

Honestly? Italy's hooked in pretty close to bigger distributions networks than Singapore, being on the European mainland, no borders, and plenty of big ports (Genoa, Rotterdam, Hamburg) around to accept. 600 strikes me as crazy high, but it's probably surcharge size issues, and/or heavy case and guitar. I'll probably be shipping a guitar (small, electric, headless) out to Canada at some point, and I expect it to run less than 100 bucks, all told. I have noticed Canada Post is significantly more expensive than, say, USPS. It's the main reason I don't buy more wood from Canada. (well, ok, the main reason is that I'd get killed if more boxes of wood arrived here, but still...)[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Mattia Valente] [QUOTE=verhoevenc] I imagine Singapore is relatively cheap because it's a HUGE port of ALL sorts, ship, air, etc. Whereas, Italy maybe not be... I guess what I'm sayin' is if you're going with the flow... and already established one that is... it's gunna cost ya less cause they're headed that way anyways.
Chris[/QUOTE]

Honestly? Italy's hooked in pretty close to bigger distributions networks than Singapore, being on the European mainland, no borders, and plenty of big ports (Genoa, Rotterdam, Hamburg) around to accept. 600 strikes me as crazy high, but it's probably surcharge size issues, and/or heavy case and guitar. I'll probably be shipping a guitar (small, electric, headless) out to Canada at some point, and I expect it to run less than 100 bucks, all told. I have noticed Canada Post is significantly more expensive than, say, USPS. It's the main reason I don't buy more wood from Canada. (well, ok, the main reason is that I'd get killed if more boxes of wood arrived here, but still...)[/QUOTE]

Mattia,

you are in Europe, too - I just checked out what shipping a guitar from Germany via German postal system/DHL would cost - it?s 85 Euro (airmail). Just for comparison.  

Regarding the shipping costs: as you say they are not not affected by the distance to the next airport, harbour etc., at least if you send from Germany. The main difference when comparing the costs of DHL/postal system with UPS, FedEx etc. is the part of the invoice they charge for the custom service (DHL doesn?t charge for this because they don?t offer it, you have to pick up your sending from the customs yoourself if the value incl. shipping exceeds a limit that is free; DHL, FedEX, UPS etc. do this job for you and charge good money for it. The difference between DHL and the other carriers that do this service can easily be 100 - 150 US$. In the end a customer can decide what this service is worth to her/him.

For all who intend to send guitars from US/Canada to Europe: my strong recommendation for this way is to check out the carrier SCHENKER (if available in your town). I paid approx. 100 US$ for New York -> Germany (Hamburg), incl. custom service. Schenker is cheap within Europe, too.

Regards,

Martin

[QUOTE=iwanttobebach]
I've presently commissioned a spruce/African blackwood guitar from Joshua French whom I got to know through the OLF. Myself - I build classical guitars on weekends (probably the only one in this country ), and it's turned out to be a wonderful hobby, and I'm excited to say that I've learned much from this forum.
Cheers,
EJ   [/QUOTE]

I have absolutely no clue about shipping to Singapore, been there a few times, drunk Singapore Slings in Raffles.

However, I'd like to welcome EJ to the Forum, and to commend you on your choice of guitar builder. In Joshua you have chosen, in my humble opinion, one of the great guitar builders, a builder of World class. One thing you can be certain, you will get a guitar that is of heirloom quality, from a supreme craftsman. The sound that Joshua can deliver from some bits of wood is sublime. You will not be dissapointed.

Colin

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I don't believe in anything, I simply make use of a set of reasonable working hypotheses.

I second Colins comments!
Welcome to the OLF EJ!

I am following this thread closely as I will have two guitars headed to Singapore sometime in the near future. This is all good info to know..

Thanks for your insight..

Lance

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Lance@LuthiersForum.com

Thanks guys, Lance, Colin for the welcome.

I've enjoyed the time I've been here and can only drool admiringly at the woods and the guitars that you've all created. I'm just about to finish FPing my first classical and am now in the midst of planning future builds.

Well, FWIW, I took months researching before deciding on Joshua (I really like his traditional approach both in style and construction) - since I'm looking at something to treasure and possibly even perhaps pass down generations (as Colin mentioned), I'd want something more in my dealings with the luthier. IMHO, it's how a luthier and the player is able to share a common ground, on which they believe that they are working towards the same goal in terms of construction, aesthetics, and of course, sound.

I believe above all, that how well a guitar sounds is not really as objective as I would like it to be, but rather it depends on how players are able to develop a certain kind of emotive relationship with the guitar, and how they're able to draw the most out of her - the kind of nuances and details that might take time, over years, to understand, nurture and to develop - and knowing how she was built makes that kind of connection that little bit more intimate (I'm treading into dangerous territory here ...).

Though I've to wait 18-24 months for my spruce/African blackwood - as I've told Joshua, it's the anticipation that keeps me going. In the meantime I have guitars to build (and a PhD to finish).

See you all around!
With best wishes,
EJ