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| AR or Hide Glue? http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=12791 |
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| Author: | Andy C [ Tue Jul 10, 2007 8:40 am ] |
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Hi all, I bought Cumpiano's and Jim Williams' books and they both advise to use aliphatic resin glue, however I am fascinated by hide glue. It seems that AR is easier to use so I was wondering which one you use or recommend. I also visited some luthier supplies websites in UK and they sell Liberon pearl glue. Does anybody know what is its gram strength? |
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| Author: | Colin S [ Tue Jul 10, 2007 8:49 am ] |
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Andy, if it's your first guitar I'd probably leave Hide alone, but you could compromise and use Fish glue, it's like Hide glue with the convenience of AR glue. PM me if you want details of a European supplier. Colin |
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| Author: | Wayne Clark [ Tue Jul 10, 2007 8:55 am ] |
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Speaking of which... Has anybody read the latest issue of Fine Woodworking? There is a piece on the strength of different glues. I skimmed through it while standing in the check-put line this weekend. AR got good marks as I recall. |
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| Author: | Bob Garrish [ Wed Jul 11, 2007 5:38 am ] |
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There was a discussion on the MIMF about it. Seems the methodology wasn't so applicable to lutherie as furniture building, from what I recall. |
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| Author: | Michael Dale Payne [ Wed Jul 11, 2007 6:04 am ] |
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New builders jeep in mind that "Tradition an Technology" was written as a guide to guitar building for new builders. That said it has become one of the great reference books of all times. Certainly a best seller. So I assume anyway, that Cumpiano and Netlson intent when recommending AR glue had to do with its open time for ease in assembly and alignment to aid new builders. |
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| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Wed Jul 11, 2007 6:46 am ] |
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Also, make sure you go to Cumpiano's website and look up all the errors in the published version of the book. They are numerous, and he has the corrections on his site. Also has lots of other pointers and recommendations, and an FAQ section. |
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| Author: | burbank [ Wed Jul 11, 2007 6:52 am ] |
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Adding to what Michael said, in a Q & A from 2004, Cumpiano states, "Yes, I use strictly TiteBond or Elmer's Carpenter's Glue, both Aliphatic Resin evaporative glues." |
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| Author: | crazymanmichael [ Thu Jul 12, 2007 8:47 pm ] |
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as others have said, until you get a bit of experience i would recommend sticking to the ar. hhg is great stuff, but it is very time sensitive, as in you have very,very little available to get work positioned and clamped. and working under that sort of stress when starting out is a recipe for frustration and discouragement, if not disaster. |
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| Author: | JJ Donohue [ Thu Jul 12, 2007 11:00 pm ] |
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On the other hand, I have used HHG since #1 with success. In my case, I had to learn virtually everything about woodworking and glue ups, so why not learn with what I considered to be the best materials and methods. In the future, I will be gluing my tops and backs with Fish Glue after receiving some from David Collins. FG would be a good compromise for a beginner...especially one who is already "fascinated by HHG." Good luck Andy...you have some great builders (Colin, Dave, etc.)over there who can help enormously! |
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| Author: | Sam Price [ Fri Jul 13, 2007 12:48 am ] |
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I buy Aliphatic Resin from Craft Supplies UK...it's a little more viscuous than Titebond and whiter too...I think it must be closer to the LMII white glue, with longer open joint time, longer clamping time, but the results are brilliant. (and seem better than Titebond if I may say so.) I really like the stuff and buy the smallest bottles, although if kept airtight, never goes off. |
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| Author: | Mark B [ Fri Jul 13, 2007 3:07 am ] |
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man i have seen some downright nasty arguments about this topic, but anyhow, i use tightbond. i dont care for the hide mess, and extra headache it presents. mark |
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| Author: | Rick Turner [ Fri Jul 13, 2007 3:49 am ] |
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I believe that the LMI white glue combines many of the advantages of Titebond with the harder qualities and low creep of typical yellow AR glues. That said, I'm using both...HHG for all joints on or around the top, LMI for most other structural joints, thick superglue for CF to wood joints, Smith epoxy for neck laminations and the fingerboard joint, Franklin's polyurethane for pre-laminated multi-veneer peghead overlays, Duco for plastic bindings, and thin superglue for abalone purflings. That's seven different glues in some guitars. Each glue has it's advantages and disadvantages, and no one glue does it all. |
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| Author: | Bob Garrish [ Fri Jul 13, 2007 12:51 pm ] |
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I definitely agree with Rick on glues for different purposes. With the amount of random work I do here these days I regularly use probably five to seven kinds of glue. |
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| Author: | Rick Turner [ Sat Jul 14, 2007 4:08 am ] |
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Just re-read the first sentence of my post above, and it's a bit garbled. Please correct to: I believe that the LMI white glue combines many of the advantages of Titebond (ease of use, no heating needed, relatively long open time) with the harder qualities and lower creep of Hot Hide Glue (HHG). I've banished yellow AR glues from my shop in favor of the LMI white glue. There's no point in having it around when the LMI glue does everything Titebond does and better. |
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