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neck woods?
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=13257		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  KenH [ Thu Aug 16, 2007 1:42 pm ]
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I have been using 100% mahogany necks, but I am looking at trying somethng else.


Since I am a sawmill owner and have contacts to buy all kinds of lumber, I am wondering what other kinds of wood is good for acoustic guitar necks? In particular, hard and soft maples..... I see this being used in laminate necks, but I dont see it being used as an only wood for necks. Is there a reason for this? Is weight the issue? I know that maple is used for electric guitar necks, but why not acoustic? Is carving a maple neck any harder to do than carving a mahogany neck?


I just got offered a large lot of red maple... is this hard or soft and will it work for a neck?


Are there any other domestic hardwoods that work well for necks?
Author:  zac_in_ak [ Thu Aug 16, 2007 1:50 pm ]
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the main reason you don't see maple by itself is its reputation as being less
stable without being laminated..

just my $.02 worth
Author:  David Collins [ Thu Aug 16, 2007 2:43 pm ]
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I don't know that I've ever worked with red maple, but I understand it's not
as stiff or hard as sugar maple. That may not be a bad thing however.
Quartered sugar maple is almost certainly stiffer than mahogany necks
already, so a softer, well seasoned maple may be just fine. If not you can
just load it with graphite. Necks do a lot to shape tone, and stiffer may not
always equal better. The biggest concern is stability, probably with weight
being a close second. As to how it shapes the tone, that's all subjective and
you won't really know until you build a few piles of guitars with it.

I've really been wanting put together a purely Michigan model when I get
back to building, and although rock maple is certainly abundant here I think
I may try cherry. Epiphone used it for years in their New York factory and it
served them quite well.
Author:  KenH [ Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:01 pm ]
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I hadn't even thought about cherry! Thanks!


I have a few cherry logs that will be cut up next week, so I'll be sure to cut some of it into neck sized boards and try it out!


I'm expecting some awesome looking back and sides sets out of these logs as well since they are super straight and large wild cherry logs.


I'll also have some eastern red cedar quarter sawn that I want to try to make some guitar tops out of and possibly try this material out for necks.
Author:  Rick Turner [ Thu Aug 16, 2007 3:56 pm ]
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Cherry is a fabulous wood for necks as well as backs and sides.   In the 19th Century cherry was known as "American Mahogany" due to it's color, stability, and the ease of working it.   Also walnut is great neck wood. Cherry was long a favorite among pattern makers, and walnut has been the gun stock of choice for over 100 years.   Both applications require good shrinkage numbers, excellent machinability, and superior stability.   Sounds like neck wood to me...
Author:  Sam Price [ Thu Aug 16, 2007 6:02 pm ]
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Cherry is my alltime favourite wood and am planning to use it for both necks and back & sides in a future build. I've carved with cherry exclusively until I started guitar building. (needed a break from the stuff! )

I've got a large 2" thick chunk drying, waiting to be turned into necks (Looks like I've gotta wait 2-3 years yet!!)

Author:  Jim Kirby [ Thu Aug 16, 2007 10:50 pm ]
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Ken - In addition to electric guitars, maple is the customer wood of choice in the archtop world. In his book, Bob Benedetto says that he believes it is not a good choice and produces a neck heavy guitar. He'd prefer to use mahogany, but there are those pesky customers to deal with.
Author:  Colin S [ Thu Aug 16, 2007 11:57 pm ]
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Cherry, the European one but a close relative, is my favourite neck wood for steel string guitars. Easily worked, no pores, very attractive colouring. Cherry has got it all. Look no further.

Colin
Author:  KenH [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 2:51 am ]
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WOW I Have been sitting on a treasure trove and didnt even know it. Thanks for the good info folks!  I have 3 cherry logs sitting around here that are about 24" in diameter  and 16' long that I have been waiting to saw up. Looks like I have finally found something good to do with them! I'll saw as much as I can into good back and side set size lumber and then saw the rest up into neck sized chunks.


I think I'll do the same with some of the maple and see where it leads me. I think the neck weight I am experiencing is due to the weight of the truss rod and also the tuner machines. It is surprising how much weight these items add to the neck.
Author:  Todd Rose [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 4:32 am ]
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Forgive me if I'm telling you things you already know, but some things to consider when selecting wood to cut for necks are:

Stable pieces. No matter the species, this will vary with individual pieces of wood. If the billets you're thinking of cutting into neck blanks are warping a lot this way and that as they dry, they're probably not the best candidates for neck blanks. For example, cherry trees often lean to seek sun where other taller trees are growing. If the lean is significant, the wood from that tree may not be stable.

Grain orientation. The neck should end up with the fretboard glued to a well quartered face.

Run out. Grain should run straight down the neck shaft when viewed from the top or the side.

Consistent density.

No defects of any kind.

In short, a neck should be made of near perfect pieces of wood. If all these criteria are followed, lots of wood species (among those that tend to be reasonably stable) will work for necks, though weight is also an issue (but if the back and sides are made of a heavy wood, they will help balance a heavier neck), as is ease of carving.

Everything I've said here is my opinion, which others may disagree with, and my opinion is subject to change without notice.   
Author:  Alan Carruth [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 5:29 am ]
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Butternut is another first-rate neck wood, particularly for classicals. It has properties very similar to cedro.
Author:  Sam Price [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 6:05 am ]
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[QUOTE=Alan Carruth] Butternut is another first-rate neck wood, particularly for classicals. It has properties very similar to cedro.
[/QUOTE]

Alan, is that the same species as Platanus Occidentalis, or American Sycamore? (Or a further translation, London Plane? )
Author:  Alan Carruth [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 6:23 am ]
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Sam Price asked:
"Alan, is that the same species as Platanus Occidentalis, or American Sycamore? "

Butternut is a relative of walnut, Juglans cinerea, if I've got the latin spelling right. It is lighter, both in density and color, than black walnut, with a somewhat coarser grain structure. It used to be used, under the name 'white walnut', in the larger cabinets of a walnut dining set, for example, where the weight saving was appreciated. It can stain up to look very much like walnut. Without the stain it has a very reflective ginger/gold color. Like all the walnuts, it is stable, easy to work and glue, and, because it's softer than black walnut, it's a real pleasure to carve. It is, however, too soft for sides; it tends to crush on the inside of bends.
Author:  Sam Price [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 6:32 am ]
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Sounds like really nice stuff. I'll have to visit my local wood store to see if they've got any in stock.

On reflection, I was actually thinking of buttonwood, not butternut....alas my poor addled brain.....busy day...
Author:  Kelby [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 6:33 am ]
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Nothing wrong with maple if you don't mind the weight.

Regardless of the species, the risk of problems due to stability concerns, runout, etc. go way down if you are willing to laminate. Not to mention that laminating gives you a lot of artistic opportunities. The back of a neck is a lot of visual space with no inlay, purfling, etc. to create visual interest, and laminating contrasting materials will give the eyes something interesting to look at in that area.
Author:  Andy C [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:46 am ]
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What about sapele? It looks very similar to mahogany and it should be quite stable.
Author:  Mattia Valente [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 5:51 pm ]
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Sapele's an excellent neck wood.
Author:  David Collins [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 6:34 pm ]
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Here's a nice cherry neck from a '45 Epiphone I have in for restoration right
now. Nice color, no big pores, stiff, lighter than maple - as far as domestic
woods go, I give it my vote for best mahogany alternative, perhaps even
better in some respects.



Author:  Todd Rose [ Fri Aug 17, 2007 10:55 pm ]
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[QUOTE=Todd Rose]

Grain orientation. The neck should end up with the fretboard glued to a well quartered face.

[/QUOTE]

I meant to say "growth ring orientation".
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