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The Smell Of HHG In The Morning (Pics)
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=13326		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Steve Walden [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 3:42 am ]
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Great lookin' top Hesh.  It looks like a SJ?


Thanks for sharing.   
Author:  Bruce Dickey [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 5:34 am ]
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Hide glue boogers on a paper towel. Glad to see you are in the shop Hesh. Oh this one will sound so good!
Author:  L. Presnall [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 8:06 am ]
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Looks great Hesh! If it can't be me, I'm glad SOMEBODY'S building! (Stupid airplane job anyway )..
Author:  KenH [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 8:15 am ]
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Good job Hesh!  Thanks for the pictures on using HHG too. I havent used it, so I'm full of curiosity about it.


I've got to admit though.... the second picture had me shaking my head and going OH NO !!  Glad you cleared it up with the other pics!
Author:  James Orr [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 9:20 am ]
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Cool, Hesh! The issue I had with hide glue was how slippery it made
things. Do you have a hard time keeping the brace in position while you
clamp it up?

Ken, don't worry, it literally gels up like jello. It's so easy to peel off.
Author:  Blain [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 9:31 am ]
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Thanks Hesh!

Very good information once again.

Thanks for clearing up more questions about HHG.

Author:  Bill Greene [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 10:57 am ]
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Hesh:

Do you really get the glue on the x-brace, get it set on the top, and put 17 go-bars in place in 30 seconds? I mean, that's less than 2 seconds a go bar, not including the glue spreading, and careful placement of the x-brace on the top.

Is that really possible? That's my ONLY issue with hide glue, the working time seems so slow. And as always, thanks for posting something like this...it's a BIG deal for all us newbies!!!
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 1:10 pm ]
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Na! its an OM
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 1:11 pm ]
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opps Hesh had already answered that
Author:  Hank Mauel [ Wed Aug 22, 2007 1:32 pm ]
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The smell of HHG in the morning...do you play Wagner while working with it?

It was nice of you to stop by and say Hi at Healdsburg, and very brave of you to post my ugly mug on the web...but then again my lovely wife was next to me so hopefully most folks won't pay attention to me.
Author:  JJ Donohue [ Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:42 am ]
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After gluing up the tops and sides of 8 guitars using HHG, the method that I now use includes applying thickened HHG via the squeeze bottle method per Mario's suggestion. That shortened the application time significantly. Heating the gluing surfaces before hand also extends the open time for HHG..

But there are a few more items I make sure I accomplish even before I attempt to glue the plates. Here's my sequence:

1) Make sure that braced tops and backs fit PERFECTLY stress-free into the kerfed liner cutouts. Mario actually has described evaluating the fit by placing a flashlight inside the box and looking for light leaks. This will save you valuable seconds when placing them into position when the glue is applied to the liners.

2) Practice dry runs before applying glue and going live. I use gobars and a caul on the plate's surface. I drill a dimple into the caul at each location for a gobar. Make sure that gobars and clamps are within reach for efficient and timely setting. Time your practice runs and only go live when you are confident. BTW...after 2 guitars, I no longer needed to practice...this is really easy once you get a few successes behind you.

3) Heat the surfaces before applying glue. I use a hair drier for 5-10 minutes before going live.

4) Apply a bead of HHG to the kerfed liner surface. I significantly thicken my HHG by using less water in the mix. I use an old small titebond plastic bottle with a slit opening to apply the bead. The normal thickness runs all over the place and is too messy. The slit opening applies the proper width of bead to the gluing surface.

5) Lay on the plate in one smooth motion and immediately place your body weight of leaning on the caul for 2 minutes. This only works if the plates fit like a stress-free glove. I then apply the gobars. This initial weight allows the glue to form that initial HHG tack and draw the gluing surfaces together. The gobars then keep the surfaces mated for the time it takes for the water to evaporate.

I have very little, if any, cleanup as a result of getting the feel for the bead size. I also have everything together in less than 30 seconds prior to placing the gobars. If I place the gobars immediately I can get the assembly time completed in under 60 seconds.

Fear not...try it...it's a lot easier than you think. Hopefully someone can post a pictorial tutorial soon since I'm months away from doing this again.
Author:  jhowell [ Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:13 pm ]
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Thanks to Hesh, JJ, Todd and everyone who has chimed in here. I was inspired by Hesh's first HHG tutorial to go for it and I braced the top of my current build with HHG. I was amazed that something that had seemed so intimidating went so well!
Author:  Bill Greene [ Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:17 pm ]
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Yep, I'll confess to mixing up my first batch a couple of days ago. Bought the Rival hotpot, a thermometer, some marbles AND went to the beauty supply store and bought some "hair coloring" bottles. (By the way, LOTS of nice looking women in the beauty supply store. I can see myself needing many more plastic bottles.)

Anyway, I did a small glue-up test using two pieces of scrap spruce top. That stuff is nothing short of amazing. I'll be using it on my next build.
Author:  TonyFrancis [ Thu Aug 23, 2007 1:22 pm ]
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Nice tutorial hesh.


I also am a big fan of using brush (same ones as Todd) and keep a little tapered 8oz glass jar in my hold heet pot.


Most guitar makers use the 192 high clarity which is great stuff, but I really urge people to try the regular 251 glue. I dont notice a working time difference at all but love how it has a higher tack which allows for some joints to be rubbed...so you dont need any clamps.


Hide glue is also cheap, so I use it for everything on my hawaiian steels...top and back seams, braces, bridgeplate, neck reinforcement, fretboards, inlay, marqueterie, bridge...the lot. There is always a way of doing things quickly (like seam joints) or thoughtfully (like glueing down the back in sections). If you havent tried hide glue yet you dont know what your missing! Marvelous stuff! 


 
Author:  TonyFrancis [ Thu Aug 23, 2007 4:52 pm ]
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Not sure about the hot pot hesh. I use hold heet glue pot which are designed to hold a whopping 1 quart of glue (how many gutars is that?)...anywho, it needs to be quite full (of water) to stay at 145 degrees and surround the glass jar suspended over it in a spruce lid. If you punch a few holes in your lid it I found it keeps the temerature right on and is very reliable.

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