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Inexpensive binding channel cutter?
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=3311		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  harmonist34 [ Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:48 am ]
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I'm still working on the process of getting my guitar operation started here in Nicaragua. One thing I need to address is that the luthiers down here are not used to U.S. style binding. The first guy I worked with attached thin strips of wood to the outside edge of the top before gluing it on and then used some type of thick plastic-y paint to create purfling/binding. I know there are about as many different ways of cutting binding channels as there are luthiers, but if I had to pick one tool/bit combination that would be versatile and relatively inexpensive, what would it be? I'm thinking perhaps a Dremel tool and the binding cutting kit from Stew-macs, or perhaps a full size router and several bits.

Any help would be greatly appreciated, as always.

Andrew Wright
Author:  RussellR [ Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:04 am ]
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Hi Andrew

I used to cut with a dremel, but to me it is just completely underpowered for the job, I like to use a laminate trimmer as it is still relatively light but much more powerful and takes standard bits.

I would also recomend some sort of binding fixture so you are not routing direct off the body, Don Williams has an excellant one in the jigs section.

Just my 2 pence worth.
Author:  Wade Sylvester [ Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:06 am ]
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Andrew,
If you need one tool to do double duty, I think a router is a good choice because it is usefull for many differect opperations in the building prosses.
I have seen jigs made for routers that are good for cutting binding channels and alow you to take out the router easyly for other applications.
I suppose it depends on how much of a "guitar operation" you are talking about.

Wade
Author:  tl507362 [ Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:31 am ]
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I suggest using a laminate trimmer with an angle base to adjust the base to the dome of the back or top. The cheapest bit/bearing set you will find anywhere on the internet is on my website Here
Good luck!
Tracy
Author:  tippie53 [ Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:32 am ]
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   Routers make terrible binding cutters. The back radius will throw the cutter off parallel and the binding on the back will appear "thin".
    There are so many designs. Williams has one . I like simplicity. Also what are the current requirements? Do you have 220 or 120
john hall
Author:  Shane Neifer [ Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:38 am ]
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Andrew,
THe jig on the Guitar Jigs site above is the way I am going to go. Some of my customers have been using this for decades and it works GREAT! I will make my own as I have a couple of things I specifically want. But the price for the one shown is very very reasonable and will save you big time in the long run.

Shane
Author:  harmonist34 [ Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:40 am ]
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It will be fairly small scale, at least for now. Maybe 2-4 guitars a month max for the first year. I guess a router would be considerably more versatile, I'm just thinking that the expense of buying a good one and getting it shipped down here (probably $100 more, minimum) might be too much when I don't really know if this whole thing is going to work. I assume I'd want a router that could take 1/2" bits, and if I'm going to spend the $ to get one shipped, I should buy a good one.

Something like this, perhaps? http://tinyurl.com/drxew

Thanks,
Andrew
Author:  Michael McBroom [ Sat Sep 24, 2005 6:48 am ]
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I recently purchased a DeWalt laminate trimmer for binding tasks. It is a stout tool, and much better than a Dremel for this sort of operation. I have a bit and complete set of bearings I bought from Tracy that I use with it. Works great.

I like using a laminate trimmer better than a router for binding, but the opening for bits for the laminate trimmer is rather narrow, so it is somewhat limited in what it can do in terms of the bit size it can handle.

Best,

Michael
Author:  Rod True [ Sat Sep 24, 2005 12:09 pm ]
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Wow, Andrew, 2-4 guitars per month is not considered small scale. 24-48 guitars per year is a lot. Ask the guys around here and I bet only an handfull are doing more than 24 guitars per year. Dennis Scannell at True North Guitars is an amazing builder in my opinion and he only builds 9-10 per year. Now for a full timer, that is low unless of course your getting $5,400-$6,800 per guitar than I guess that will pay the bills.

If you plan to build 2-4 guitars per month, you will most likly need to invest in some very good tools and buy or build some very good fixtures, especially to cut the binding chanels. This is not my favourate task and as John stated, a router on its own is not the easiest or the best setup for the job, maybe if you are only doing 1-2 per year, that can work, but for the number your talking about, you may want to consider something a lot more consistant than just a router.

Just my opinion.
Author:  harmonist34 [ Sun Sep 25, 2005 6:52 am ]
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I may be working with two luthiers...if it's only the one, it will be around 2 a month. The guys here take a guitar from start to finish in about 2 weeks. They have an assistant or two, and they may do nothing but work on one guitar for 8-10 hours a day. My standards for quality are going to be higher than they're used to, so I'm sure some steps will take longer, so maybe 2 a month is too much.

We're also talking about less ornate (and pristine) guitars then the full-time small shop guys are putting out in the U.S.. But they're getting $3000+ a guitar and mine will probably be coming in at around the $500 mark.

I guess I'll do some research into the laminate trimmer option. I suppose if I had to purchase both eventually that wouldn't be the end of the world.

Thanks for the help,

Andrew
Author:  Alan Carruth [ Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:36 am ]
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I still do bindings the old fashioned way from time to time: with a marking gauge, chisel and file. It's a lot slower than any sort of router setup: with a laminate trimmer I can do bindng and purfling channels in an afternoon or less, and it takes two days with the chisel. If you've got a sharp chisel there's no loss in accuracy. I still have not set up a rig that will cut bindings correctly on archtops, so when I make one of those I just resign myself to the extra time.

For the laminate trimmer I made a setup that has a large post that guides on the _side_ of the guitar, and a little wheel that runs on the top or back. That way the rabbet is parallel to the side, and not perpendicular to the back, as it would be with just the router base. Using the router base yeilds undercut binding rabbets around the upper bout on the back, where the taper and arch combine most strongly to make the back out of perpendicular to the sides. My rig is far from perfect, and I'm hoping one day to make the time to set up an improved one, but for now....
Author:  Arnt Rian [ Mon Sep 26, 2005 7:53 am ]
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I posted a picture of my inexpensive base on a Hitachi trimmer in a thread about this 2 weeks or so ago (?). It's a double bearing that rides on the guitar's side, same principle as the Guitar Jig's one and what Alan is describing above. About $3 in parts + some scraps, 2 hous to make, works great!
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:00 am ]
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Arnt, what was the topic name. I must have missed it. I have bee contenplating something on the same order
Author:  Don A [ Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:06 am ]
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Michael, here is the link to the thread. Binding cutter
Author:  Michael Dale Payne [ Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:11 am ]
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Thanks Don

Arnt, I quit following that thread too soon. Nice fixture. I assume the top/back is incontact with the metal washer on the base. Very small footprint. Again very well planed fixture. You need to build and sell these MichaelP38621.7203472222
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