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| Oil Finish for Neck http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=3710 |
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| Author: | rich altieri [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 1:00 am ] |
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I searched the archives for an answer to this question but could not find what I was looking for. I usually use Lacquer or KTM9 for my finishes but want to experiment with a different finish for the neck. Want something that will give this guitar that electric feel - silky smooth vs. lacquer/KTM feel. So far I have applied my stain and then a filler. Was planning a couple of light coats of shellac next and then thinking of Danish Oil. Any thoughts are appreciated. |
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| Author: | Dave White [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 1:15 am ] |
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Rich, I use Tru-oil on my necks and it gives just the sort of feel you describe. My necks are usually mahogany and I polish the wood down to 12000 grade micromesh, then apply a couple of coats of the Birchwood Casey Sealer/Filler using paper kitchen towel. Then I wipe on 4-5 Tru-oil coats again using paper towel (applied very thin - fold a towel piece in 4 and hold to the top of the Tru-oil bottle and turn it upside down and back. Let the oil saok into the towel then wipe/rub on). I sand very lightly between coats with 0000 wire wool. For the first week or so of playing it will feel a little bit on the sticky side, but after this playing in it feels like you are playing on polished bare wood. Lasts very well too - the oldest neck I have with this finish is about 18 months. Also very easy to apply more coats if necessary. |
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| Author: | Mattia Valente [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 3:12 am ] |
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Dave, is Tru Oil available in Europe, then? I've never seen it anywhere. I have used other, similar oil finishes on electrics before. Honestly, for me, 'best feeling neck finish' is a head to head race between wiped on/french polished shellac, and wiped on oil. Both have a lovely, natural feel. Both are pretty simple to touch up; I haven't as yet done any proper french polishing with shellac, mostly just apply it in thin coats, and some by 'buffing' with lightly loaded cotton rags/paper towels. Look and feel lovely. |
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| Author: | Dave White [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 3:19 am ] |
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[QUOTE=Mattia Valente] Dave, is Tru Oil available in Europe, then? I've never seen it anywhere. I have used other, similar oil finishes on electrics before. [/QUOTE] Mattia, I get mine from a small gunshop in Holmfirth, Yorkshire. Their website is here: Peter Dyson Very friendly and good postal service. |
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| Author: | CarltonM [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 4:19 am ] |
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This is timely... I just yesterday picked up some woodworking magazines (Wood & American Woodworker) from the early '90's at a local antique store, and in one there was an article by expert Bob Flexner on various store-bought finishes. Flexner says there are only two types that will dry completely (he didn't include shellac in his test): varnish and polymerized oil. Oil--no good; oil/varnish mix--no good. Varnish is a mix of resins and oil that have been cooked together at a specific temperature, which changes its chemical composition, and allows it to dry. A polymerized oil has also been cooked, at 500 deg. F (IIRC) in an oxygen-free environment, which gives it much the same properties as varnish--especially its drying ability. The lesson, as I see it, is to never use raw tung or linseed oils on a guitar (or anything else, for that matter), because they will not dry completely. Oil/varnish mix--same deal. Tru-Oil is a polymerized linseed (I think) oil, and it will dry. The key to applying PO, according to Flexner, is multiple, thin coats, giving it time to dry between coats. Patience is a must. Dave, it would seem that you're not waiting long enough for drying if your necks feel sticky "for the first week or so of playing." Just add a couple of weeks for drying before playing. I know it's hard to wait, but every finish has its downside. I owned an electric guitar (Music Man) with a Tru-Oil finished neck, and it was the smoothest-playing surface I've ever felt. Good stuff! |
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| Author: | Dave White [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 5:03 am ] |
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[QUOTE=CarltonM] Tru-Oil is a polymerized linseed (I think) oil, and it will dry. The key to applying PO, according to Flexner, is multiple, thin coats, giving it time to dry between coats. Patience is a must. Dave, it would seem that you're not waiting long enough for drying if your necks feel sticky "for the first week or so of playing." Just add a couple of weeks for drying before playing. I know it's hard to wait, but every finish has its downside. I owned an electric guitar (Music Man) with a Tru-Oil finished neck, and it was the smoothest-playing surface I've ever felt. Good stuff![/QUOTE] Carlton, Thanks for this - very interesting stuff. The Birchwood-Casey website says Tru-Oil is linseed oil (plus others) based and you can certainly smell it in an old bottle of the stuff. The trick is definitely to apply the coats thin. The finish on the neck isn't sticky - that was probably the wrong word to use. Your hand "drags" a little bit initially. I suspect that the first couple of weeks playing is in effect me "buffing out" the finish. The finish continues to cure, I suspect, for quite a while afterwards. This finish on a guitar neck is the most "sensual" experience of playing you can get imho and a number of my customers have made the same comment. |
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| Author: | rich altieri [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 5:23 am ] |
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Thanks Dave and others. I will be going this route with the Tru-oil. |
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| Author: | CarltonM [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 8:05 am ] |
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[QUOTE=Dave White] The finish on the neck isn't sticky - that was probably the wrong word to use. Your hand "drags" a little bit initially. I suspect that the first couple of weeks playing is in effect me "buffing out" the finish.[/QUOTE] I see what you mean. That could well be the case. |
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| Author: | Don Williams [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 8:53 am ] |
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Grafted Coatings makes a satin version of the KTM-9 if you're interested... |
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| Author: | BruceH [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 9:12 am ] |
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Rich - I used Tru-Oil on the neck of my last guitar. As Dave said, it was a little draggy at first, but after playing for a bit, it really feels great. |
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| Author: | Wayne Clark [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 10:52 am ] |
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To those who have used Tru_oil on their guitar necks, how fo you finish the headstock? I have been considering using a combination of KTM-9 glossy and satin. The satin would go on the back of the neck and the glossy would go on the headstock. It seems like that would be a nice look. |
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| Author: | Skip Beach [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 11:35 am ] |
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I used Tru-oil for the entire finish on my 1st guitar. I thinned it to wiping varnish consistency ( approx. 50/50 with turpentine) & wiped it on in multiple ultra-thin coats. After 15 coats, the neck almost feels lubricated it's so smooth & slick - the best I've felt. Highly recommended. Wayne, if you're finishing the neck separately from the body, why not use Tru-oil for the entire neck and peghead? That way you avoid the hassle of masking off. It can be buffed to a high gloss like nitro or KTM-9. Just be careful & don't buff too much or you'll get witness lines as the Tru-oil doesn't "burn-in" to the previous coat(s). Skip |
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| Author: | BruceH [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 11:53 am ] |
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Wayne, I masked off the headstock and finished it with Target 9000. After buffing I wiped Tru-Oil on the rest of the neck. |
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| Author: | Colin S [ Fri Nov 04, 2005 9:16 pm ] |
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[QUOTE=Dave White] The trick is definitely to apply the coats thin. The finish on the neck isn't sticky - that was probably the wrong word to use. Your hand "drags" a little bit initially. I suspect that the first couple of weeks playing is in effect me "buffing out" the finish. The finish continues to cure, I suspect, for quite a while afterwards. This finish on a guitar neck is the most "sensual" experience of playing you can get imho and a number of my customers have made the same comment.[/QUOTE] Dave, this is the system that has been used on the best English shotguns for hundreds of years. They have always been very lightly oiled then buffed out with the palm of the hand, rubbed, until quite a bit of heat is generated by the friction, for many hours. My father (who had hands made of leather) used to sit for hours hand buffing my guns. You then end up with a super smooth, and hard, soft sheen that really glows. I've never done it on a neck before, always FP's as with the bodies, but the next is going to be oiled. Thanks. Colin |
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