Official Luthiers Forum! :: View topic - Camel bone!

Official Luthiers Forum! http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/

Camel bone! http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=7026	Page 1 of 1

Author:	Michael McBroom [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 3:58 am ]
Post subject:
A place local to me, Texas Knifemakers Supply, sells camel leg bone pieces for knife handles. I decided to pick up a pair of pieces today -- $15 for the set. They sell the sets polished and unpolished. I bought an unpolished set because they were slightly thicker. Soon as I got the bone home, I cut it up on my bandsaw: As you can see, one $15 set can yield enough for four nuts and at least four saddles too. Not a huge savings -- about 50%, and you gotta do some cutting. But for the wide-necked 10-strings I'm building, this is exactly what I've been looking for. This camel bone is pretty dense stuff. I measured and weighed one of the nut blanks I cut out -- density is about 1.9 g/cm^3. Anybody happen to know what the density of cow bone is? The fellow at the shop claims camel bone is denser than cow bone. Best, Michael

Author:	Steve Kinnaird [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 6:19 am ]
Post subject:
You should get some Camel bone, Hesh, if for no other reason than to see how your dog reacts. We want a full report. Steve

Author:	RussellR [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 6:36 am ]
Post subject:
Hesh Just wait till he gets a stiff of Hide Glue when you are cooking it up

Author:	RussellR [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 7:05 am ]
Post subject:
My Shop Cat Steve is usually pretty mild mannered, but hturn on the hide glue and you have to fend him off with a go bar rod RussellR38875.6704976852

Author:	A Peebels [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 7:19 am ]
Post subject:
Michael I noticed that your saddles are on a rubber router pad. Be careful with those things. I once layed a lacquered guitar on one for a couple of days and it imprinted the lacquer, and would not polish out. I ended up having to sand it back and refinish. Al

Author:	Steve Kinnaird [ Wed Jun 07, 2006 8:52 am ]
Post subject:
[QUOTE=RussellR] My Shop Cat Steve is usually pretty mild mannered, but hturn on the hide glue and you have to fend him off with a go bar rod [/QUOTE] Russ, we want a picture of that. SK

Author:	Michael McBroom [ Thu Jun 08, 2006 1:45 am ]
Post subject:
[QUOTE=A Peebels] Michael I noticed that your saddles are on a rubber router pad. Be careful with those things. I once layed a lacquered guitar on one for a couple of days and it imprinted the lacquer, and would not polish out. I ended up having to sand it back and refinish. [/QUOTE] Thanks for the tip, Al. Actually, I bought a roll of the stuff. It's a no-slip shelf-liner material. I've been using it for quite a while now, and have had no problems with it messing with a finish. But then, I french polish, and haven't used lacquer. Best, Michael

Author:	Michael McBroom [ Thu Jun 08, 2006 5:02 am ]
Post subject:
Well, I was able to anser my own question. I'd forgotten that I had purchased a couple of bone saddles and nuts from stewmac a while back. I measured and weighed one of the bone nuts and the density is virtually the same as camel bone. I got 1.87 g/cm^3 for the camel bone and 1.88 g/cm^3 for the cow bone. Round to the nearest tenth of a gram, and both are 1.9 g/cm^3. I shaped a couple of pieces into 10-string saddles and the two thick ones into 10-string nuts. With some of the leftover saddle material, I fashioned a mitred tie block for one of the bridges. Here's a pic of two 10-string bridges with saddles, and one of the 10-strings with nut blank installed. Regarding mitering a tie block inlay, I'm wondering how you guys who do this do it. I've always found it to be a giant PITA. If you look closely at the bridge with the camel bone inlay, you can tell I missed on a couple of corners. Filled one of them with baking soda and CA. Didn't come out as well as I hoped. Grrr.... Best, Michael

Author:	Steve Kinnaird [ Thu Jun 08, 2006 5:18 am ]
Post subject:
Michael, I've done only one, and you are right on. They are a pain. But I've sworn off using CA for any kind of fill work where light colors are involved. You might have had better luck with backing soda and white glue Steve P.S.--pretty work!

Author:	npalen [ Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:28 am ]
Post subject:
I don't know specifically Michael but a cow is a low rider and bred to be fat. A camel has a high CG and tends to be more athletic, at least they are in the movies...... Hesh--So it follows that the camel bone would be better for the high notes? Reminds me of the old camel joke regarding two rocks.

Author:	mikev [ Thu Jun 08, 2006 1:11 pm ]
Post subject:
I read somewhere a long time ago that pronghorn antelope bones where 6 times stronger then cows. So any you midwesterners who hunt or know hunters might want to try them for nuts and saddles. Must be to handle the crazy speed those critters can get to. Mikemikev38876.9252314815

Author:	Grant Goltz [ Fri Jun 09, 2006 2:06 pm ]
Post subject:
There is more to bone density than the species involved. The location on the skeleton is often more significant. Bones from the upper portions of legs (femur, humerus) are well supported by muscle and tend to be a bit more porous (less dense). Farther down the leg (tibia, radius) the bone is a bit better, but not much. The densest bone is in the lower leg (metacarpal and metarsal). These bones not only carry the entire weight of the animal, but are also not supported by muscle. This bone is both thicker walled and less porous. That is the only bone that I even consider worth using and I find that deer and moose bone is much better than cow bone. Grant

Author:	Michael McBroom [ Fri Jun 09, 2006 3:30 pm ]
Post subject:
Grant, I sorted through all the unpolished sets they had and chose the thickest set that had no evidence of porosity on the inside, which was the flat side of each piece. Based on the radius of the porosity showing on some of the pieces, I can only assume these were tibias, but I have no way of knowing for sure, and I'm sure that the folks at TKS don't know. I asked the store manager if they received the pieces as bulk (because they do shape a number of handles from bulk pieces of various materials), or if they received them already shaped. He told me that they got them already shaped. So this tells me that we're talking about a bone diameter that is probably in the neighborhood of 2" to 2.5"(including the porosity evidence I mentioned above). Not being conversant on camel physiology, this is why I'm assuming they are from the tibias, but I wouldn't be willing to bet on it Unless I were butchering the animal or knew somebody who was, I suspect it would be difficult to insist on metacarpals or metatarsals as a preferred bone material. Good to know your preferences, though Next time (if ever) I have that opportunity, I'll make my preferences known. Just curious, can you get an 88mm long nut out of a moose metacarpal/tarsal? Best, Michael Michael McBroom38878.4016666667

Author:	Grant Goltz [ Sat Jun 10, 2006 11:25 pm ]
Post subject:
Michael, I will cut a couple and send them down. Grant

Author:	Dave-SKG [ Sun Jun 11, 2006 9:20 am ]
Post subject:
Michael, I have used camel bone pins for some time now and like them.

Page 1 of 1	All times are UTC - 5 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/