Official Luthiers Forum!

That is if I make a blueprint/set of plans for some one elses guitar and sell it....

I have a 1972 Gibson SG and I thought instead of just sitting in the closet it could make me a dollar or two. I figured I'd Measure it and draw up a plan then add a few photos and it's off to ebay. Am I headed for trouble or is this completely legal?

Looking through the available plans on the net I can't see anything that would indicate that all these folks got the ok from the original builder.

I wouldn't muck around with anyone at all resembling Gibson's hired legal
guns...

Mark Swanson's Gibson L-00 plans say, "Guitar Based on the Gibson L-00" and "Designed by Mark Swanson." I don't know how close this plan is to the real McCoy, but there seems to be strong resemblence. In your case, the photos could be a deal-breaker. Maybe you could contact Mark through the MIMF.

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now known around here as Pat Foster
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http://www.patfosterguitars.com

    Just explain, your design is inspired by Gibson's SG model. If they sue you, I'll represent you!

"This whole courts out of order"! See I can do it, don't need no stinking law school!

Billy Dean Thomas

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Billy Dean Thomas
Covina, CA

"Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur."
(Many fear their reputation, few their conscience)

1. Change the shape slightly so that it is not the same.

2. Do NOT mention the names Gibson or SG. They sued Yamaha over using the name SGB.

Listen to Hesh and the others on this.

Be very careful...

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"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

[QUOTE=Hesh1956] Gibson is well known for bringing litigation against competitors and potential competitors. Ask Paul Reed Smith about his LP look-a-like fiasco....[/QUOTE]

But that didn't work out so well for them.

I guess my question about this is "why?" There are already a couple of really good SG plans in the market. I think more plans are great, but I would probably make something that isn't out there already.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

[QUOTE=Brock Poling] I guess my question about this is "why?" There are already a couple of really good SG plans in the market. I think more plans are great, but I would probably make something that isn't out there already.

[/QUOTE]

Well I asked about Gibson because of their penchant for litigation. Also because I have the SG, but of course my thinking was the same. I really want to do a Taylor (something) and a few high end classicals.

So let's modify the question. What about say a Taylor 710, a Ramirez 1A, a Greg Byers, a Brock Poling...

Should I forget it or should I Google for attorney and Kevlar vest.

No, my point was why put all that work into something and have several competitors in the market who are already offering a nice product?

To me it seems like if you are going to put that much work into something you would want to own the entire market for the plan you are selling.

... I think you should make the Taylor plans (or something similar to them). The X12 and the x14 would both be big sellers I am sure. You can put me down for a set of each.   

:-)

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

Ronn, My approach has always been " It's always easier to ask for forgivenance than for permission", but in this case the opposite may be the best approach. Give them a call, explain what You want to do, and go from there.

Al

Al is right on. If you get Gibson to agree to your plan (in writing) there is zero risk. Maybe you can offer a token royalty of some sort as a bargaining chip. Best figure it out up front instead of wading into murky waters.

Gibson does have rights to stop others from knocking them off. I don't know the exact standard but these kind of law suits happen all of the time.

>This is not legal advice!SteveCourtright38986.4337847222

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"Building guitars looks hard, but it's actually much harder than it looks." Tom Buck

You could always just put a typo on the drawing

"Based on a Gilson SG" maybe that would fly in court

Don't ask me though, I'm not that smart.

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My Facebook Guitar Page

"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson

Jamie Uniden has a bunch of
plans here.

As soon as I set up 40 violins and 10 cellos I am going to continue working
on an ES335 kit base on the plan there.

Scott Lentz in So Cal had been making some killer Strat & Tele knockoffs up untl a few years ago, when the Fender hit men caught up w/ him & told him to abruptly "cease & desist", and that he did. He had to redesign his whole line of guitars. The upshot of it now, is that, his 'law-suit' models, command even more than the premium prices he was asking before the door slammed shut on him. There's one currently up for sale at $3800! He does some par-excellance lacquering...

So perhaps a plan "based on my interpretation of a insert guitar name here". With a host of pictures having the stated purpose of illustrating the differences in my plan and the original. Of course the intent is to have no differences but...

Thanx for the input guys. I may be guitar shopping soon.

That's what we did with the L-00 plan I was involved with. It states that it isn't an exact replica, and there are enough differences there to get by.
I wanted to build a guitar like that and back when we made that plan there weren't any plans for that style around. So we drew up the plans! Jamie Unden did the CAD work on it, he's very good with the guitar plans.
I still don't know of anywhere else to get an L-00 plan, it made sense to make that one. I'd agree with Brock's point about why make a plan that is already out there?

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Mark Swanson
Swanson Guitars
http://www.MarkSwansonMusic.com

     Ron, I pretty sure Gidson would never mess with you unless you got big. And if you got big how bad could it be!! If they catch you, just say your name is Serge Poirier!

    Some OLF'er(Gee! That sounds bad) with a PC running off CAD drawings isn't going to bother them. Besides, is Gibson selling plans, or guitars?

   I do think Brock's point about Taylor plans has merit. There are a billion(exactly) SG plans out there, if you have access to a Taylor I think you would do better to gear up.
   I would!

    If your serious, and wise enough not to take my word, you could actually talk to an attorney. Just don't look'em directly in the eyes! (Klepper's gonna hate me now!)



    Billy T38986.9687268519

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Billy Dean Thomas
Covina, CA

"Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur."
(Many fear their reputation, few their conscience)