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The tablesaw is finaly back together, aligned and waiting to be used. The blade that came with is not worth putting back on, so I'm off to buy another one. Before I spend the money, I'd like to hear what you all have to recommend for a general purpose blade.

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Aoibeann

I switched to all Forrest. The last 3 Frueds were almost as good as harbor freight.
john hall

Forrest

Thanks.

Is there anything to their hype at In-line?Aoibeann39011.8178587963

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Aoibeann

All Freud here.....


The last 3 Frueds were almost as good as harbor freight.

There's the problem; they were imitations. Real ones would have had the spelling right...

Like Mario (following his advice) I had a Freud 184mm 40 tooth Diablo as my main blade. However since getting some of the thin kerf 1.3mm and 1.7mm CMT blades, the 250mm 60 tooth blade or the 184mm 40tooth tends to sit in the saw most of the time. The bigger blade cuts scarf joints perfectly, with the smaller one for most other work.

I've always preferred CMT router bits and their saw blades are just as good.

Colin

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I don't believe in anything, I simply make use of a set of reasonable working hypotheses.

Amana has an ad for a combination blade in Fine Woodworking that might be worth checking out.

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Todd Rose
Ithaca, NY

https://www.dreamingrosesecobnb.com/todds-art-music

https://www.facebook.com/ToddRoseGuitars/

Actuall I did misspell Freud. I just find the Forrest a better blade. The carbide tore out of my freud and the supplier won't stand behind them so if the service isn't good I won't use them. Not all carbide is the same.
   A good blade is worth the investment. As pointed out the life of the blade is longer. I have a cheapie for the stuff you don't want to use a good blade for. Stay away from a blade you see in discount stores.
john hall

I just have to wonder if the Forrest blade is truly worth the price. I don't have the experience with other blades to judge, but it seems like blades by other high-quality companies (e.g. Amana) that are about half the price might really be a better buy.

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Todd Rose
Ithaca, NY

https://www.dreamingrosesecobnb.com/todds-art-music

https://www.facebook.com/ToddRoseGuitars/

Or you can use a $12 Freud Diablo that lasts 2 years, leaves a ready-for-glue surface, has a .051" kerf, and toss it when it finally goes dull...

I have one, just one, operation that requires a 10" blade... the rest all make use of the 7-1/4".

I have a 3/4" deep gouge in my bench vise that shows how tough these blades can be(and how stupid it is to clamp wood in a cast iron vise and try to cut it with a Skil saw..). That blade is still, 7 years, and a house fire later(fire ruined the wiring, but couldn't kill the saw or balde), in the saw. I've built 3 shops and 3/4 of a house(house burned before it was done..long story..) with that blade. For all I know, the thing is siezed onto the saw's shaft....

I'm sure the Forrest blades are tops in absolute quality of cut, but for value and use...

   There always seems to be a yin yang effect with the quality of tools, and ol' Murphy's law rules their value. Whenever you finally buy the good blade, it's the only one you have cut something nasty with, so you mistreat it. Then you buy a cheaper one you don't have to worry about and curse it when you can't cut hard woods. I think the mark of fine craftsmanship must be the ability to make do as much as make good investments.
It sounds pretty wise to keep a cheaper 71/4" in there for most cuts and take time out to change for a forrest or something when you need it .

I have one of those weird variable tooth porter cable ones in mine now. It's pretty scary but I'm used to it now and sort of like it. I won't say what it did to my finger a while back though.

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"Preoccupation with an effect gives it power and enhances the error"
from "Your Owner's Manual" by Burt Hotchkiss.

So, Todd, it sounds like you're saying you think the Forrest blade is worth it for you, in large part because, with repeated sharpenings, it will last twice as long as other blades.

At the same time you are saying that sharpening is not cost effective for a business, making a less expensive blade the better choice, from a cost perspective.

Am I understanding you right -- that you're making a distinction between what you feel is cost effective for you (and perhaps for others who are not operating as a business per se), and what is cost effective for a business?

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Todd Rose
Ithaca, NY

https://www.dreamingrosesecobnb.com/todds-art-music

https://www.facebook.com/ToddRoseGuitars/

For this hobby builder doing 3 or 4 guitars a year my 3 blades will last me about ten years before I have to have them sharpened. So of course I won't bother I'll just sling them out and get a new set. Life is too short to stuff a mushroom, or to spend ?25 getting a ?35 blade resharpened!

Colin

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I don't believe in anything, I simply make use of a set of reasonable working hypotheses.

Mario goes through 7-8 disposable blades

Actually, Mario has likely not owned more than 7-8 blades in the 9-10 years since Mario discovered these little wonders, and Mario still has all of them(use the older ones when cutting aluminum, or CF, or whatever....).. At $12-$16 per blade..... do the math. To this day, not one of them, including the one that cut into the cast iron vise, is dull enough to warrant tossing out.

Just yesterday, I cut through not one, not two, but three #8 screws in a piece of wood(don't ask...), then went ahead and ripped a couple BRW RW bridge blanks, and the cut was smooth and effortless, still. I intended to pull the blade to look it over, but forgot, and it dawned on me as I was cutting through the first bridge blank(a 1-1/2" tall cut...) that all was well with the blade. Because of the .051" kerf, I get twice as many bridges from my blanks as I would if I used any other blade, and the surface left by the little wonders from Italy takes all of 2-3 seconds on the belt sander to clean up(with 180 grit).

Honestly, in the 10 years I've been in this business, I haven't spent enough on all my table saw blades to buy one Forrest..., and with their wider kerf, I would't use one as my main blade even if it were given to me. It's not that I'm cheap; if I truly belived it would help me, I'd have one. I believe in good tools. But I'm practical with my tools and what I aquire, and why.

   Tools
    I feel that price isn't allways a good index to quality though good quality tools usually cost more than discount tools. Allways buy the best you can afford. I don't think we complain with a tool when it works , it is when it doesn't that we gripe.
     As for me I use my tools differently than Mario. He uses his different than I so we both have a viable input as to our experience. Forrest blades are worth the extra buck and I mean every penny.
     Again it comes to what you use and how you use it. If you use the blade for alot of functions or need it for something that is highly accurate , then a cheap blade won't be your friend and your results won't be as consistent.
     Thin kerf for the most part are fine as luthier grade lumber doesn't have the knots that you would see in construction grade. However some of the woods are harder and they can cause more blade deflection.
something to think about when purchasing a blade.
john hall
blues creek guitars

or need it for something that is highly accurate , then a cheap blade won't be your friend

I hate to be so argumentive, but I make all my wood bindings, and much of my pruflings, and these 'cheap" blades are accurate enough that most of the time, it's straight from the saw to the instrument. My neck and end blocks come off needing a minimum of sanding, and for the longest time, I'd re-size my laminated braces by running them between the saw balde and fence, using the table saw as a horizontal planer of sorts, and these would come off the saw, and go straight to the instrument. I shape my headstocks on the table saw(see the last "Guitarmaker" for how i do it. No big cleanup, if any, left after the saw. I likely use my table saw as much or more than most other guitar makers, as it's the most used tool in my shop. All with these 'cheap' blades.....

C'mon, sharp is sharp, and true is true, no matter who made the thing.

Yes, if you're cutting up 2x10s by the truck load, knotty pine by the skid, and 3/4" hardwood plywood by the lift, forget everything I say. But since this is a luthier's forum.....

Hey Mario, is this the Freud blade you use?

Great neckmaking article, by the way, I've already read through it a couple times.

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Jonathan Kendall, Siloam Springs AR

Jon, that's the one. Not trying to answer for Mario but I learned about these from him over on the MIMF several years ago. I seldom use anything else now.

BTW, it's worth a trip to your local Home Depot to see if they have them. I usually pay several dollars less for them there.

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Dave Rector
Rector Guitars

That's the one. They also come in gold, but I'm not sure if there's a difference or not. If you can find some older ones(try a Mom&Pop hardware store), the kerf was even narrower.

I also like the 24 tooth one.

Forrest.

Hank

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Hank Mauel

Freud Diablo, thanks Mario from 5 years ago. Same blade on the saw from 5 years ago, cut through some thick and nasty, knotty planks too. I've cut 1-1/2" thick ebony with no prolems. Now I only use the 24 tooth so I tend to sand all my cuts before any gluing, but I bet if I got the 40 tooth, I could go right to gluing after the cut.

It is a matter of opinion though, and everyone is entitled to their own right?

Now if Lillian is still following all this banter about tablesaw blades, she will have seen the recommendations and has probably purchased her blade by now.

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"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson

LOL Yes, I'm still reading but no Rod, I haven't bought anything yet. I've been working out of town all week and just got home. Well, I'm here long enough to get dinner and dump my dirty cloths before I have to work an overnight job. People seem to get pissy when we shut down three lanes of I-5 during the day, so.... It was a nice note to find tape to my monitor when we got back to the office.

Oh, and thanks for all the input. Its been very insightful. I do appreciate it.Aoibeann39016.9250810185

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Aoibeann

I-5, ok so you live on the west coast..... state? city?

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My Facebook Guitar Page

"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson

WA, Federal Way

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Aoibeann

Ahhhh, So, do you go to GAL this year?

Another Pacific Northwest member. Great

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My Facebook Guitar Page

"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson