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| Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10123&t=41742 |
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| Author: | WindyCityBluesBox [ Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
I have a customer asking me about making a rosewood nut for his fretless bass. In my mind, it actually makes sense. violins, string basses, etc. all use ebony nuts because that is the same material as the fingerboard, and that will produce the same tone as when the string is pressed the the fingerboard. Strangely, Ive never seen this on a fretless bass guitar, and I wanted to check the idea with you guys before I waste time and money on a fruitless job. Has anybody tried this? Do you guys think it would be an improvement? -Alex |
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| Author: | B. Howard [ Wed Oct 23, 2013 1:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
I do ebony nuts from time to time on request. Sounds like a good idea just mind the grain orientation on the blank and it should work nice. |
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| Author: | Doug Balzer [ Wed Oct 23, 2013 1:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
I did an ebony nut on a fretless bass aimed at sounding more like a double bass - less sustain - very pleased with the results. Perhaps it is not the way to go if the desired sound is more like an electric bass where usually lots of sustain is desired? Those of you with more experience, does that theory hold up pertaining to the OP'ers question regarding wood vs bone nuts. |
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| Author: | Chris Pile [ Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:21 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
Rosewood or ebony are fine for nuts - bass, guitar, or otherwise. |
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| Author: | WindyCityBluesBox [ Fri Oct 25, 2013 11:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
Thanks for the excellent responses guys! |
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| Author: | James T [ Sat Nov 23, 2013 9:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
I just put a claro walnut nut on a epiphone lp for a friends kid. it worked out very well . ( it had an atrocious plastic mess on there) It's the most dense wood I've used so far, and should stand up well. |
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| Author: | Shaw [ Sun Nov 24, 2013 12:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
Claro walnut is actually pretty soft on the Janka scale compared to ebony or rosewood. 950 compared to ebony at 3200 and rosewood at 1750. |
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| Author: | nyazzip [ Sun Nov 24, 2013 12:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
in a bass, so little of the final tone "product" is high frequency that hardness really doesn't matter- it will be swamped with lower frequencies of high energy/amplitude that is unaffected by the hardness of the nut/fret/fretboard/whatever. in other words: big, fat, long strings aren't picky with regards to what material they happen to terminate against |
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| Author: | James T [ Sun Nov 24, 2013 11:34 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
Janka scale aside .. this set of feathered crotch claro is very hard . 60 grit with a sander barely phases it . I've worked with ebony that's softer. Note :Brazilian Walnut Janka -> 3684 |
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| Author: | Shaw [ Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
Brazilian walnut and claro walnut are two different woods all together. |
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| Author: | James T [ Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:40 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
agreed , and each tree is different . The hardness of wood varies with the direction of the wood grain. Testing on the surface of a plank, perpendicular to the grain, is said to be of "side hardness". Testing the cut surface of a stump (where the feathered crotch comes from ) is called a test of "end hardness". The tabulated Janka Hardness numbers are an average . The chart is not to be considered an absolute; it is meant to help people understand which woods are harder than others. |
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| Author: | Shaw [ Tue Nov 26, 2013 6:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
nyazzip wrote: in a bass, so little of the final tone "product" is high frequency that hardness really doesn't matter- it will be swamped with lower frequencies of high energy/amplitude that is unaffected by the hardness of the nut/fret/fretboard/whatever. in other words: big, fat, long strings aren't picky with regards to what material they happen to terminate against I' m sure there are a lot of bass builders who would disagree with this statement.
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| Author: | dzsmith [ Tue Nov 26, 2013 6:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
James T wrote: agreed , and each tree is different . The hardness of wood varies with the direction of the wood grain. Testing on the surface of a plank, perpendicular to the grain, is said to be of "side hardness". Testing the cut surface of a stump (where the feathered crotch comes from ) is called a test of "end hardness". The tabulated Janka Hardness numbers are an average . The chart is not to be considered an absolute; it is meant to help people understand which woods are harder than others. I believe Imbuya is also called Brazilian Walnut. That stuff can be hard as a rock and is not related to Walnut. |
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| Author: | nyazzip [ Tue Nov 26, 2013 6:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
Quote: in a bass, so little of the final tone "product" is high frequency that hardness really doesn't matter- it will be swamped with lower frequencies of high energy/amplitude that is unaffected by the hardness of the nut/fret/fretboard/whatever. in other words: big, fat, long strings aren't picky with regards to what material they happen to terminate against Quote: I' m sure there are a lot of bass builders who would disagree with this statement. probably. but outside of a brief period in musical history, in the 1980s and '90s, when slap bass/funk made electric bass into something of a lead instrument, the bass has always been intended to produce low frequencies with no glassy/shimmering high freqs in the mix, which means nut hardness isn't a really a tonal consideration. |
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| Author: | Shaw [ Tue Nov 26, 2013 8:31 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
So a piece of cork would do just fine right? Why assume hardness of a material has only something to do with high frequencies? |
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| Author: | nyazzip [ Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Rosewood nut of fretless bass. what do you guys think |
yes cork would work, within reason....but it isn't exactly durable. with hardness comes durability....but for a fretless bass, i maintain that a softer nut isn't going to be a problem, if it wears ok- which it should, as flatwound strings are used on fretless instruments. i'm not sure what point is in contention here... FWIW i'm personally not into the shimmery glassy snappy bass sound, and i assume anyone who plays a fretless wouldn't be either, or else they are barking up the wrong tree |
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