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| Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10128&t=26028 |
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| Author: | WudWerkr [ Fri Feb 12, 2010 12:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
As Most of you already know , I am not a " walk the same path " Kinda guy . Not to say I wont build A's & F's . I am sure I will . However I would like to encourage people to Post Pics Here Of the Mando's , etc: That are Hybrids Of the Normal . And give us your insite into the Good / Bad / And Ugly Of your experience . ![[:Y:]](./images/smilies/smiley20.gif "Thumbs Up")
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| Author: | WudWerkr [ Fri Feb 12, 2010 6:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
I have a little Mandolin I have been playing with along . I have an abundance of Oak , and decided to play with it in my "spare " Time . Its 8-1/2" wide at the back , and 14" long . I have redwood for the top . Using a short scale "mounted at 12th fret" and old keys and tail piece off repair/replace . So this one is a bit of a " experiment " in the " lets see what happens department "  Attachment: 100_0583.jpg Attachment: 100_0584.jpg Attachment: 100_0585.jpg May be a waste of time and wood , but what the heck ! I havin fun !! 
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| Author: | sebastiaan56 [ Fri Feb 12, 2010 6:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
Hi Wud, I have an OM flat top underway and a bent top Mandola half put together. When I get a camera going I'll post some photos. Graham McDonald's book "The Mandolin Project" is a great resource for the different types of mandolins. There are those who think that the only real mandolins are the Gibson style carved top A's and F's, Graham goes into a lot more interesting types. |
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| Author: | WudWerkr [ Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
I AGREE 100 yrs ago there were no A & F styles . Now Im NOT knocking them They are Beautifull Instruments . But they are not the everlasting end to the design of mandolins . If they are why the he.... are we building . Just give up and let it all die ? NOT A PRAYER 
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| Author: | the Padma [ Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! and Mando's Outside the norm ! Ummm...2 questions 1st....What line? 2nd...Norm who? the Padma |
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| Author: | WudWerkr [ Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
You know what i mean old man the line in the sand that alot of mandolin players think its against the gods to cross and Norm from cheers
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| Author: | MRS [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 12:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
I feel its alright to color outside the lines as long as the outcome has an advantage of improvement over the norm. It should also be appeasing to the eye. I don't consider radical shapes just for the sake of radical shapes to be coloring outsides the lines. |
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| Author: | Haans [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 7:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
There are a couple of ways to look at outside the box. If you are planning to sell instruments (especially at a price that will net you anything over 2 bucks an hour), you better be learning how to build a good carved A or F. The "norm" is the Loar F5. There are a few exceptions such as Bill Bussman's melondolin or his cheesehead mandolin, or Duffy's "duck", but they are one off's or a couple. Two points are seemingly pretty safe as Jethro played one, and lots of builders are doing them. I opted for 2-1/2 points and have had some orders. The second way to look at it if you are just having fun. Cigar box, weird shapes are fine, don't expect to make a living at it, and don't expect to outdo a Loar. A couple of instruments I've always wanted to make are the Dyer Bros. harp and a carved solid wood copy of my old Kay Kraft.  Would I get orders from either of these projects...doubtful at the price I would have to charge. |
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| Author: | WudWerkr [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 9:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
MRS wrote: I feel its alright to color outside the lines as long as the outcome has an advantage of improvement over the norm. It should also be appeasing to the eye. I don't consider radical shapes just for the sake of radical shapes to be coloring outsides the lines. Good Point ! |
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| Author: | WudWerkr [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 9:20 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
Beautifull work on that Haans . Those are two good points made . Right now I am simply having fun . ( " BTW " I love your V4 , that is one sweet mando ) My Objective is simple , I am building what strikes my Fancy and changing bracing , thickness , neck to body joint locations, nut width to see what I LIKE best. If Someone wants to purchase my work , they can , if not . Thats ok too ! I may feel the need to build an A or an F someday . As for now , its about enjoying the wood and my own creative mind ! 
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| Author: | Haans [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
Actually, James, that is the old Kay. Paid through the nose for it, and it needed a neck reset, new F/B and bridge plus some serious re-inforcement around the soundhole. Sounds OK for a laminated instrument. |
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| Author: | WudWerkr [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:58 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
its still a nice looking unit , cant tell its a laminate from pic . I do like the body design . One reason for my thread , is that when i went to spbgma in nashville , I had several people play my first build . I just wanted honest feed back . I got everything from " I like the design / sounds good / needs volume / little smaller neck / Good work , make a few adjustments and the next one will be awsome to " what the HE.. is that ? / Can it even be tuned ( tuned it when i went in ) / I cant play that / its NOT a %*&?#@^%) mandolin / why waste time on somthing like that . So while I agree that " coloring outside the lines " is subjective idea at best . Some Mandolin Players can be quite "stuck" in their thinking . I dont want to , or mean ANY disrespect to ANYONE . I just wanna see what some of the other thinkers out there have done as well. And this thread doesnt " disqualify A's Or F's " Show us your work !! |
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| Author: | WudWerkr [ Sun Feb 14, 2010 8:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
Some Updated Pics Of The " Casket" My 11 Yr Old said " Daddy Its the shape of a Casket " SOOOOOOOOOOOO  I Guess Its What Were Calling ItAttachment: 100_0591.jpg Attachment: 100_0590.jpg Attachment: 100_0589.jpg Attachment: 100_0588.jpg Attachment: 100_0587.jpg I have Tried to Match the shape in the head stock . In the neck , at the heal I have started adding a curve 1" dia. as a Build Signature on My work. I dont know If anyone else uses that . However I doubt its exactly like anyone elses . The top is Redwood and I am trying a bracing pattern that is basically a box that surrounds the bridge point . Hopefully I will have enough bracing . We shall see |
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| Author: | sebastiaan56 [ Wed Feb 17, 2010 12:09 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
Hi Wud, I dont know if this is out of the norm but here is a Bent Top Mandola WIP. Its not a pliage, its a proper bent top. Mostly ready for binding. Bearclaw Spruce top, Tassie Myrtle back and sides, Northern Silky Oak neck, Koa headplate. Fretboard, bridge and bindings will be Ebony. String length will be 430mm. I always give my instruments a swooge coat so that I can see damage Im doing when I bind. I'll post some more in a couple of weeks. Next two weekends are tied up. |
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| Author: | WudWerkr [ Wed Feb 17, 2010 8:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
Beautifull work !! ![[clap]](./images/smilies/smiley32.gif "adulations") Yes this is exactly what we need to see . I have met several people in my efforts that have the " if it dont look like an "A" or an "F" it cant really be a mando. So yes this is exactly what I had in mind . I look forward to seeing more from you. Question. Is it the angle of the pic , or are the waist two diffrent curves? |
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| Author: | sebastiaan56 [ Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
Just the angle Wud, although there is merit in the idea.... |
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| Author: | WudWerkr [ Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:34 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
sebastiaan56 wrote: Just the angle Wud, although there is merit in the idea.... I agree
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| Author: | sebastiaan56 [ Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:48 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Coloring Outside The Lines ! Mando's Outside the norm ! |
Of course there needs to be a good reason to do these things. Being different for its own sake is an aesthetic choice IMHO. I chose a bent top rather then a carved top as Im cheap and you can get a lot of sound from less timber. The bent top produces a tighter / clearer sound than a flat top. Classical mandolins have used them for centuries. Removing the upper waist will increase soundboard area and therefore volume. Having a lower waist makes the instrument comfortable to play when sitting. By thinning the lower bout, or using a bent top you would solve the elbow dent problem. Worth drawing up as say an OM or even Mandocello. I know Viola D'Gambas were plucked and played across the knee. I wonder how they coped with the bulky lower bout? Good thing I have no one to please but myself.... 
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