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Canopy Glue
http://w-ww.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10137&t=54889		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Fri Apr 08, 2022 10:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Canopy Glue
I just saw a youtube of a repairman using Canopy glue for re-attaching plastic binding to an older guitar. It sounds like it might be the solution I have been in search of, which is a glue that works well on plastic and wood, but is also water soluble and does not damage adjacent finished surfaces. Also, it supposedly is flexible so it might not be as prone to re-fracture as CA is for binding repair.

Anybody used or even heard of this glue? It is used in the model making to glue clear plastic windshields to model airplanes. I will probably be running some tests with it on bindings.

Canopy Glue

Someone in the next to the last post on this blog mentions using the glue on guitar bindings.

Modeling blogspot

And here: The Acoustic Guitar Forum

This is about all I could find but it has me intrigued.
Author:  Hesh [ Sat Apr 09, 2022 3:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
It does sound promising and Pacer or Zap Tech the parent company is well known for CA glues and many formulations. I wonder if this is a CA based glue too but with plasticizers and other additives to remain flexible, etc.
Author:  joshnothing [ Sat Apr 09, 2022 7:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
Thanks for this Barry, it’s totally new to me but something I’ll check out.


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Author:  phavriluk [ Sat Apr 09, 2022 8:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
I've used Pacer's 'canopy glue' for 30 years to glue canopies (!) on my model airplanes. No relationship to CA at all, I think it's a white glue cousin to Elmer's. Dries clear. Might as well use Elmer's. No solvent property that I ever noticed. Someone more observant than me might do a better response...
Author:  Hesh [ Sat Apr 09, 2022 8:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
phavriluk wrote:
I've used Pacer's 'canopy glue' for 30 years to glue canopies (!) on my model airplanes. No relationship to CA at all, I think it's a white glue cousin to Elmer's. Dries clear. Might as well use Elmer's. No solvent property that I ever noticed. Someone more observant than me might do a better response...


You know now that you mention it Peter I think I have too. I used to build and fly RC airplanes and later helicopters and toward the end jets. That was my money pit before learning to build guitars :) I built a 1/4 scale Extra and I think I used this glue because I remember a special canopy glue and it was like white glue as you described it.
Author:  Lou Thier [ Sat Apr 09, 2022 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
Never heard of such a thing but I have NOW.


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Author:  joshnothing [ Sat Apr 09, 2022 6:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
Barry, I’ve been looking around on YouTube trying to find that video but haven’t found it so far - do you happen to have a link?
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Sun Apr 10, 2022 12:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
Here is the link where I first heard about it. You have to listen carefully but he mentions canopy glue 2 or 3 times.

YouTube
Author:  joshnothing [ Sun Apr 10, 2022 4:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
Thanks Barry, appreciate it.
Author:  Conor_Searl [ Thu Apr 14, 2022 6:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
Super intriguing. I've been scratching my head on an old Guild that had all of the binding pretty much disintegrate. All of the glues I've seen used are either CA which will be hard to clean up, or glues with Acetone which will melt the finish. I'm hesitant to mask the finish too much because the finish is already flaking quite a bit in certain areas.
Author:  phavriluk [ Thu Apr 14, 2022 6:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
I'd experimentally try Elmer's first on some test pieces. It may do the job and it's readily available and inexpensive.
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Fri Apr 15, 2022 9:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
My initial tests with the Canopy glue are positive. It grips the plastic much better than Titebond or white glue.
Author:  Conor_Searl [ Fri Apr 15, 2022 1:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
Barry Daniels wrote:
My initial tests with the Canopy glue are positive. It grips the plastic much better than Titebond or white glue.


How does it clean up? Could a person theoretically glue a lot of binding, leave it it taped over night and clean up in the morning without disturbing the finish?
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Fri Apr 15, 2022 2:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
That is one of the big questions that I will be testing. I will let you know when I figure that out.
Author:  lownslow58 [ Mon Apr 18, 2022 5:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
I recently bought a bottle, tried it and had good results when I applied and left it taped for a few days, that was a fairly big piece. I did try a small piece repair the other day that I only left taped for about 8 hrs and I had to touch it up with the stew mac stuff to get it to stick the next day but I believe that may have been my impatience. It did clean up easy and no worries of finish problems so I am anxious to try it again.
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Mon Apr 18, 2022 10:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
My initial testing has given good enough results that I am going to adopt it as my go to glue for plastic bindings. It does wipe off finished surfaces with a damp rag similar to Titebond. Takes a bit of wiping but it is definitely water soluble. And it grips like hell on plastic and wood. Every strip I tested pulled wood fibers off and left them on the plastic. Definitely better adhesion on the plastic than Titebond. It cured sufficiently after 4 hours to remove the masking tape and start cleaning up, but you can wait overnight and still get the dried glue cleaned up. Any large drops of squeeze out kind of turn into a blob of rubber but it still will clean up well. The rubbery nature of the glue does indicate that the dried glue if flexible, which I have surmised is a good thing for this application. Plastic binding and wood expand differently during seasonal changes which will stress a rigid glue joint and this is certainly a factor in binding delams. Canopy glue should hold up better to this movement.

This photo is a strip that was pulled up after a one hour cure. Not really long enough but it still pulled up a large sliver of mahogany.
Author:  phavriluk [ Mon Apr 18, 2022 11:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
What a treat to read about tests with this glue. Barry's done us a big favor. Now there is a demonstrably good glue to use on non-wood bindings. And it's easy enough to obtain. This gets my gold star!
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Mon Apr 18, 2022 11:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
Thanks Peter. I may do a bit more testing before jumping into the deep end. I think I will setup a side by side comparison of Canopy to Titebond.

Also, I forgot to mention that the testing above was done on plastic strips that had been freshly sanded which definitely was better than a slick plastic surface that did not glue well.
Author:  joshnothing [ Tue Apr 19, 2022 5:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
Barry, my thanks also. My bottle of canopy glue arrived today and I have the perfect test mule - the first guitar I ever built, which I rarely play but whose ABS bindings have just pulled loose at the waist after the most recent extreme damp / dry weather cycle.
Author:  phavriluk [ Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
I think that Titebond is a non-starter and there's little to be learned by testing its strength on plastics. There's a reason Titebond isn't used to attach metal to anything, and metal is just as porous as plastic.
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Tue Apr 19, 2022 9:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
I have used Titebond with a pre-wash of acetone which opens up the plastic and gives the glue something to get ahold of. That works fairly well.
Author:  RogerHaggstrom [ Thu Apr 28, 2022 1:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
I've been looking for a good glue for celluloid/plastic bindings on old parlor guitars. I have tried Stewmac superglue no 20, Stewmac Bind-All, Duco cement and some other glues. Duco cement is the one I've been using, even if it is too aggressive on lacquer., I have to tape up the bottom and sides to keep the lacquer intact.

I had to try "canopy glue". This is a home-run if you ask me. It really binds plastic to wood, have a long set-time (not too long), it is easy to clean up (probably water based), not aggressive, transparent and a bit elastic when dry. I'd' say it's the perfect glue for a celluloid/plastic guitar binding! :)

My only worry is that it may be irritation for an allergy sufferer like me. I may need to have some plastic gloves on.
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Wed May 18, 2022 3:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
I finally got around to using the canopy glue on a guitar ('70s D-18). I had to pull the back to repair extreme damage to the X-brace. In use, the canopy glue was very easy to use. Brushed it on the binding and the ledge about 6" sections at a time. Cleaned up with a quick wipe with a damp cloth, and got small beads of squeeze out when applying the tape.

I am attempting to do a plastic binding re-install on a finished instrument without doing finish repairs other than a few minor chip repairs. The first part of the process is to cleanup and even the binding ledge with my binding cutter. Took about 5 thou extra in both dimensions to get clean edges. The new black plastic binding was precisely sized with my MacRostie binding trimmer. I even beveled sanded the top edge of the binding to simulate the profile of the original binding. Since my binding cutter makes the ledge at the bottom of the guitar about 10 thou deeper that at the top I tapered the binding to match. So far it looks pretty good. I will get some detail pics when I take the tape off and get the squeeze out wiped off.
Author:  phavriluk [ Sat May 21, 2022 9:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
This aroused my curiosity: What's the yellow tape?

Thanks!
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Sun May 22, 2022 8:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Canopy Glue
Stew-Mac Multi-Purpose tape. They use to call it binding tape. Now that they have the brown tape again they call the orange tape Multi-Purpose. It is plenty strong for plastic binding.

The install came out pretty good. Once I run a buffing pad over it the sheen should even out where I was wiping with the damp rag.
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