Official Luthiers Forum!

So has anyone here ever gone abalone diving off the Cali coast? The season is coming up soon, and I'm looking to get a wetsuit and go diving! However, I have heard that 6-8 people die every year diving for them, so I am kind of wary. I don't want to get in over my head.....
So does anyone here have any advice? I'm all ears!

How much diving experience do you have?

_________________
Eschew obfuscation, espouse elucidation.

A lot of abalone are taken off our local reef system here in metro Western Australia. When I was a kid you could walk down to the beach, wade out to the reef and prize as many as you want from their grip, shuck them on the beach and takem home for the barbie. Now, due to over fishing we have a very short lived season limited to just a couple of hours early each Sunday for a few weeks, people still drown though.

In the 70's and 80's we had a huge influx of Asian immigrants and refugees, not being racist here but that is why we need the restrictions, these people just love them and don't seem to understand when enough is enough. Tragically a lot of these people can't swim a stroke but still allow the $150.00 a kilo price tag you need to pay these days for abs meat to lure them out into the surf, this is why the figures are so high, if your a strong swimmer with some surf experience it ain't so bad, in fact it's a lot of fun.

Now down in the Southwest corner of WA and South Australia it's a different story, that's the southern ocean, the abs are a bigger breed there and you do need a hooker or scuba gear to harvest them. Only real danger then if your a competent diver is the other kind of harvesting that goes on in the southern ocean, it's home to the biggest white pointers you could imagine big 18 to 20 footers and every now and them an ab diver or a surfer will be taken, usually only the bottom half though.

Cheers

Kim

Ah! a WISE GUY huhn ???






Well !! I guess they could've eaten all of them!

_________________
Billy Dean Thomas
Covina, CA

"Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur."
(Many fear their reputation, few their conscience)

read up on the local laws and restrictions, of which there definitely are size and take limits, get the animals if you find any, kill them, clean them, buy the grinder and slabbing and respirator and dust collection tools , get the slabbing maps and charts so you don't waste any, and drive to the dive site and actually take the time to do it, you'd be wondering if you were really saving money Vs. ordering it from someone like the Duke of Pearl, or Andy DePaul, or any of the other people who not only have others do all of that, but quality check for thickness and worm holes as well, as well as grade quality levels and sizes.

If you want to dive to learn to dive that's one thing. I am a diver and highly recommend it.
If your learning to dive just to get shell for guitar building then your better off diving into your wallet for your credit card, then surfacing on to the internet for some surfing time.
Of course you'll use your wallet either way, so the choice is yours. If you want great shell at minimal work, buy from a distributer.
Either way good luck.


Craig L

_________________
www.handcraftinlay.com

How is the inside shell (that we see for inlay) extracted from it? I have a couple of shells in my garage from who-knows-when... it is pretty plain and doesn't look too impressive, but would be kind of neat if I could use some.

_________________
Time is a great teacher, but unfortunately it kills all its pupils - Louis Hector Berlioz

Chansen / C hansen / C. Hansen / Christian Hansen - not a handle.

Christian

Craig buddy that was a very good post.

It sounds like learning to dive for the purpose of getting shell is not unlike learning to build a guitar because you want a really good guitar - either will cost you plenty.....

Brady,

I used to dive for abs when I was a teenager a loooooooooooong time ago off the coast of San Diego. Back in the day you could harvest abs with just a mask and snorkel. In addition to being beautiful inlay material they are delicious.

I suspect that they are not as plentiful now as the were in the 60's. Today you will probably need SCUBA gear to reach them. Don't try SCUBA diving without proper instruction. People who do end up among the statistics you mentioned.

Having said that all you need is an ab iron a(12-14 inch of leaf spring works great) and a mesh bag to hold your take in. Simply pop them off the rock with a quick flip. Do not touch the shell before you attempt to pop them off or they will take a much tighter grip on the rock and the shell can break before you can pry them loose. It is not a lot more complicated than that.

Have fun and be safe.

Cecil

Scuba is not allowed when diving for ab in California. Free diving only. There are places where you can find them only 100 yards off shore. Strict limits, and there are enforcers.

_________________
Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.

Oh, yeah, you're gonna need a lot of neoprene and a lot of lead. Water temps typically in the upper 50's.

[Isn't this posted on the wrong board?]

_________________
Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.

I don't know that this is on the wrong board. While fully respecting your opinions, which I do,
when you think about it, it is similar to "luthier fells his own trees", or "I found some shell, how do I use it".
Yes it involves sports and methods not always directed towards luthiery, however is sourcing materials, safety, methods and rules that apply to obtaining those materials and their ultimate place on a guitar not luthiery?

Maybe this is one of those thin line topics?
Sincerely,
Craig L

_________________
www.handcraftinlay.com

Yup, and some of them breed in Tomalas Bay. Don't forget that when free diving with a black wetsuit, you look a whole lot like a seal to a hungry white.

_________________
Jim Howell
Charlotte, NC

I have several friends here in northern California that dive for the abs and not the shell. They're more than happy to give me their shells. Most who die here get caught in the seaweed.

_________________
Ken Franklin
clumsy yet persistent
https://www.kenfranklinukulele.com

I took him to be sourcing a meal.

_________________
Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.

I dove a lot and would pic abalone in the process, they are delicious little fella's! But our coast is now closed to their harvest (Since about 1988 or so I think). Actually the species that exists here is the same as exists from Alaska through down to Oregon, the pinto abalone, the entire range of their population is closed in hopes of a stock rebuild. I could go into a long biology diatribe to explain why there is no harvest anymore (my past career was working for our Department of Fisheries as a Fishery Manager, specializing in dive fisheries), but that would be a LONG story. The abalone off California is the Red Abalone and if I were you I would be very sure that you know completely the laws regarding harvest. The enforcement guys just LOVE to drop in on anybody even suspected of illegal abalone harvesting. Some of our largest fines in this Province have been levied against abalone poachers.

One bit of biology, abalone are hemophiliacs, that means that if you cut them they will bleed to death. So, measure properly, be sure that the animal in front of you is one that you are going to take and know that if you use a prying tool to remove it, you better keep the animal because it will likely die anyway if you nick it. I never used prying tools, there are non invasive techniques to remove these guys but they take some practice once someone shows you how.

Shane

_________________
Canada

Thanks for all the replies, guys!



Hehe, the meal would be a secondary, or maybe tertiary goal. I think skin diving is great fun, and I also want to process the shells for inlay. I am well aware of all of the hassle, trouble, danger, in cutting up and grinding shell blanks and I'm prepared for that.

Sounds like you've done this before, Howard. I've been reading the regs, and as much other info as I can find. I have a fishing license and I'll get the abalone tags before I go. I figured on a wetsuit, but I'm not sure if any diving weights are allowed. How can you tell where the good spots are, where they are only a 100 yards offshore?

I took him to be sourcing a meal.

Good point.
Maybe I am biased..



So which is it? Dinner or luthiery?? Sate' yer case lad..




CL

If you free dive for them, I would check the regulations to make sure of the size, color, and quantity that you are allowed to take. If there are restrictions based on color (Red abalone, Green abalone...), then be very sure you can distinguish them in a living animal.

But, unless you are planning to do a massive amount of inlay, you can probably find enough dead abalone (shells) at a very low tide to take care of your needs. Get a tide chart, and look for a "minus tide" occurring during daylight hours. Put on some water shoes, and walk/wade out. Many shells are jammed in and around the surf rocks - some in pieces, some whole. Many will look like trash with other marine organisms covering the nacre side of the shell. Some of those will have small holes bored by organisms (not to be confused with the line of natural holes in the shell), but many will be beautiful shell when you grind away the surface. Those "ugly" shells will not be favored by the casual beachcomber looking for pretty soap dishes, so you may be surprised how many you'll find.

If you find any tiny ones, your wife or girlfriend might appreciate a pair of earrings and a pendant - made with shells and twisted wire. I know my wife loved hers.

Another option (maybe someone mentioned) if you want shells but not the adventure of finding them, find some divers that eat abalone. They will usually have more soap dishes than they need, and will give you the shells.

Dennis

_________________
Dennis Leahy
Duluth, MN, USA
7th Sense Multimedia

I haven't done it. I did my scuba certification dives at Monterey, and haven't dived in that cold murky California water since. But I've watched divers who were less than 100yards offshore right by the town of Mendocino come up with nice sized abalone. I can't imagine that weights aren't allowed. Standard wetsuits here are 7mm farmer John bottom covered with a 7mm step-in jacket. With scuba gear and a steel air tank it takes me about 25-30# of weights just to be able to get down in one of those.

If it's just shells you want, divers will give them away or sell cheap.

_________________
Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.

Brady, where along the coast are you? A dive shop local to your region will obviously be able to help you on the dive side of things much better than we will, but I second Howard's comments about the Monterey Bay water. It's a terrible place to dive.

James, I'm in the East Bay area. A dive shop is my next stop on the abalone quest, but I was hoping maybe one of you guys here had done this. I'd like to be able to find some specific info on where to go, how deep to dive, how far out, etc. Everything I've found on the web so far seems to be pretty general.

Thanks for the suit tips. I am gonna wrap myself in neoprene!

When I lived in the bay area, I used to do a lot of abalone diving. I always had good luck around Salt Point and the Tomales bay area. Scuba is not allowed, free diving only. There are serious restrictions on the design and size of your abalone iron, and you must carry a guage to measure their size. Be sure to follow the rules, and you can have a lot of fun, and hopefully come home with some ab steaks and shells for inlaying.

Al

I will be in Monterray for the greater part of May (doing sea tests with MBARI!!!) - and plan on doing some diving looking for abalone - But like everyone else has said, I have reduced my soon to be efforts to this list:
1. It is illegal to SCUBA dive live abalone, must be freediving (and I think that requires a lisence too)
2. If you have a lisence, they have to be fairly large - upwards of 6-7" across the shell - with a whole host of other rules on types and times and such...
3. You are participating in seal like actions (for the larger pelagic predators)

Considering I plan on just diving as normal, but keeping a particularly close eye out for dead abalone in the 30 - 80ft range...Just something more to do in the cold waters...and then I am not killing a species that has been dwindling because of over fishing...just cleaning up and making use of whats left.

Best of luck to you!
Stephen

_________________
www.ziegenfussguitars.com

Thanks for the tips on the Tomales Bay, Al, that's well within my striking distance!

Stephen, you might want to check up the local regs there in Monterey. Abalone harvesting is only allowed North of SF, and I've heard that the fish and game folks don't like people coming up with even shells. I don't know if that's really true.

Season starts in a month, so I will let you guys if I find an inlay treasure trove!