Official Luthiers Forum!

Owned and operated by Lance Kragenbrink
It is currently Wed Nov 27, 2024 8:50 am


All times are UTC - 5 hours


Forum rules


Be nice, no cussin and enjoy!




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 1:24 am 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo

Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2007 6:06 am
Posts: 329
Scary sharp method seems to bring me good results. However do all sharpening methods require this much maintenance? From reading many threads, I realize every method has it's Advantages/Disadvantages. But do most require some what of tunning and preping to use? or is this just SS method?

What am I crying about?
I have to peel off the old sand paper from glass board, scrape off the adhesive residue using razor, cut out new sand papers, drive to buy the grits of sand papers that I'm out of, glue them back on...all this to sharpen only 3-6 chisels and do it above all over again.

Please tell me I'm only able to sharpen 3-6 chisels because I'm a newbie and don't know how to sharpen using SS method. [headinwall]

If not, recommend me a method that you just simply love and can't believe you waited this long to use or switched.

Thanks, David


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 2:08 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2005 10:03 am
Posts: 6680
Location: Abbotsford, BC Canada
Once all your chisels are tuned up good and sharp, you shouldn't be going through paper very often. Really when the blade is dull, all you need to do is run it over the last two grits to bring it back up to razor sharp. And once you get the hang of it, it should only take a couple of passes and you should be sharp. You don't need to apply much pressure either.

to many passes and to much pressure can really kill your sand paper fast and you will have to replace it more often then if you use light pressure and not so many passes. Also are you using a lubricant at all? I know lots of people use water and that works well, I like to use oil (olive or baby) as it doesn't run as bad as water and I think it helps cut better.

It takes time to get use to it, but stick with it, it's a great way to sharpen your blades.

Oh and next time you go to get paper, get a bunch so you have it on hand.

_________________
My Facebook Guitar Page

"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 7:22 am 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2008 5:57 pm
Posts: 636
Location: Nr London, UK
Although I tried scary sharp I seem to have an eversion to those plane honing guides I use a small combination stone, it's a fallknivern DC3 diamond one side sapphire the other. I hold the chisel or plane in the vice and use it like a file.

http://www.fallkniven.se/misc/eng-sharp.htm

Works for me

_________________
Formerly JJH

I learn more from my mistakes than my successes


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 7:25 am 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13387
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
I like using stones.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:30 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 22, 2005 10:11 am
Posts: 2761
Location: Tampa Bay
First name: Dave
Last Name: Anderson
City: Clearwater
State: Florida
Zip/Postal Code: 33755
Country: United States
As the others have said, You don't need a lot of pressure to get your
blades up to scary sharp. It takes a little practice but keep at it.
Also ,there are quite a few videos' on YouTube on this subject.

_________________
Anderson Guitars
Clearwater,Fl. 33755


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:46 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2004 3:50 pm
Posts: 4662
Location: Napa, CA
What Rod and Todd say about the SS method. I won't comment on your unconventional method but I'd compare my SS edges to anyone's methods. It's a matter of staying with a method until you master it.

I will add that during my chiseling or planing sessions, I frequently touch up my edge in a leather strop with green compound. It keeps the edge sharp and allows it to glide through the work consistently and effortlessly...and it requires fewer trips to the sandpaper for more extensive care.

To everyone who is trying SS for the first time...Don't get frustrated...it takes work and a commitment to best practices to do excellent work. Work on your patience and learn to relax, no matter what method you select. This should be a fun and rewarding effort. Too much tension detracts from the experience!

_________________
JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 8:48 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 6:16 am
Posts: 2692
Sharpening with sandpaper (which was around a long time before someone came up with a catchy name for it) does not require that the paper be PSA or sprayed with adhesive. If you have accurate hands or are using a sharpening jig, you can simply hold the paper to the flat surface with one hand while sharpening with the other. With finer grits, you may not need to hold the paper down at all; or, you can wet the back of the paper to create some adhesion.

_________________
Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 10:58 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 9:02 am
Posts: 2351
Location: Canada
First name: Bob
Last Name: Garrish
City: Toronto
State: Ontario
Country: Canada
Status: Professional
Howard Klepper wrote:
Sharpening with sandpaper (which was around a long time before someone came up with a catchy name for it) does not require that the paper be PSA or sprayed with adhesive. If you have accurate hands or are using a sharpening jig, you can simply hold the paper to the flat surface with one hand while sharpening with the other. With finer grits, you may not need to hold the paper down at all; or, you can wet the back of the paper to create some adhesion.


What Howard said. I just wet the paper and it sticks to whatever I've decided to use this time, usually whichever piece of aluminum I've most recently face milled. The paper goes back in my storage to be used on other stuff once I'm done! The paper will last a lot longer if you only take 'back' strokes on it, to avoid the chisel scraping off the grit.

_________________
Bob Garrish
Former Canonized Purveyor of Fine CNC Luthier Services


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:08 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2008 5:21 am
Posts: 4905
Location: Central PA
First name: john
Last Name: hall
City: Hegins
State: pa
Zip/Postal Code: 17938
Country: usa
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
Being a machinist I learned how to sharpen steel. As JJ points out you need to find a system that works for you. There are a number of stones , and some that use water and some oil. The grits may be diamond or some other abrasive. . The jigged sytems works great for the beginner as it will give you repeatable results.
Most people may not realize that steel isn't steel. Steel alloys have different properties. Harder steels may be harder to sharpen but finding the correct process to sharpen can be difficult. Softer steels will sharpen easy but won't hold the edge as longs. Heating the steel with the motorized grinders can alter the temper.
Take your time and master a process. Once you can get repeatable results stay with it.
john hall

_________________
John Hall
blues creek guitars
Authorized CF Martin Repair
Co President of ASIA
You Don't know what you don't know until you know it


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:49 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 6:16 am
Posts: 2692
BTW, my flat surface for sharpening with sandpaper is a shop grade granite surface block. These became cheap several years ago when they started coming from China. The mass is helpful--no attachment to the bench is needed. There is no need for the better grades of granite surface for this purpose; even the lowest grade has an accuracy around 1/10,000 per inch.

_________________
Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 1:58 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2005 7:58 pm
Posts: 2946
Location: United States
One thing I've not heard mentioned in this thread is your chisel quality. There can be a lot of difference in hardness of steel stock even between the same manufacturer.

I have 6 cheap chisels that require so much sharpening I don't use them except for quick and dirty work. The old chisel I got from my Grandfather or my Dad, I don't even know what it is, is what I use for good cutting. One can tell easily how good the steel is by how long and well it takes an edge.

Yup! No need to glue, and in fact, it allows swarf to be washed off more easily from the paper, therefore keeping usable sharpness higher. Keep the paper lubed(oil or water) and rinsed.

_________________
Billy Dean Thomas
Covina, CA

"Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur."
(Many fear their reputation, few their conscience)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2008 2:08 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2005 7:58 pm
Posts: 2946
Location: United States
Billy T wrote:
One thing I've not heard mentioned in this thread is your chisel quality.


Except, of course John Halls thread!
oops_sign

_________________
Billy Dean Thomas
Covina, CA

"Multi famam, conscientiam, pauci verentur."
(Many fear their reputation, few their conscience)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2008 1:43 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jul 28, 2007 1:03 pm
Posts: 724
Location: NE Oklahoma, United States
First name: Steve
Last Name: Walden
City: Bartlesville
State: Oklahoma
Zip/Postal Code: 74006
Country: USA
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
Howard Klepper wrote:
BTW, my flat surface for sharpening with sandpaper is a shop grade granite surface block. These became cheap several years ago when they started coming from China. The mass is helpful--no attachment to the bench is needed. There is no need for the better grades of granite surface for this purpose; even the lowest grade has an accuracy around 1/10,000 per inch.


I bought a 15" x 12" x 2" stone from Woodcraft for $20.00 a few weeks ago. It was on sale, but, you may be able to find it there. Or, if you can find a counter top fabricator and get a sink cut-out.

_________________
Steve Walden
Aspiring Builder,
Bartlesville, OK


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: guitarjtb and 46 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
phpBB customization services by 2by2host.com