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peterm
PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 4:23 pm 
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doncaparker wrote:
Everyone will have a different view of this, but if it were me, I would move somewhere that is reasonably close to the family members that I want to see with some frequency. I would not choose where to live based on the outside RH. In most parts of the USA, you will need to control RH inside your shop. Just spend the money and do it well, whatever the circumstances. Then you get to live where your children and grandchildren can see you more than once or twice a year. YMMV.


children and grandchildren are in California. They'll end up following...

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peterm
PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 4:27 pm 
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ballbanjos wrote:
A few years ago, I retired to the "High Country" of North Carolina and am still in the process of moving my shop up here. It's a couple of thousand feet higher than Asheville and much more rural. The county I live in has a total population of 17,000. I have bears, foxes and bobcats come visit our place pretty routinely. There's a nest of eagles in the woods below my house, and scads of wild turkeys. The Linville River is at the foot of the mountain I live on, and there's good trout fishing there. Hardly any light pollution. Nearest Interstate is about an hour away. Pretty idyllic from my perspective, and cost just a fraction of what I would have had to pay for the same house in Knoxville where I came from. I'm not anti-social, but I don't like places like Asheville where it gets pretty crowded.

Prices here have been going up, but are still just a fraction of prices in the Asheville area, and it's a good 10 to 15 degrees cooler here year round (which I like...). I live just inside the boundaries of Pisgah National Forest--the forest keeps the humidity fairly high in the summertime, but it's been fairly easy to control so far. I moved here from Tennessee which has no income tax but has super high sales taxes. Here in NC, I pay income tax (but not on Social Security) and lower sales tax. It's been pretty much a wash in terms of taxes.

We used to own a farm in Lenoir City--It was my Father in Law's place. Part of the acreage sat on a flood plain, and it did flood on occasion, but as John mentioned, it dried off quickly. It was just a pasture so no big deal. The house and barns never got wet since they were up hill. If you consider moving anywhere in this part of the country, just check the flood plain maps for the status of any property you are considering. I'm on top of a mountain but have been evacuated by the rescue squad for flooding when some of the hurricanes have come through, but it's because there is a bridge over the Linville River that I have to cross to get here. It's several hundred feet of elevation lower than my house. If it were to wash out, I'd be stuck here. But dry.

But there are quite a few good instrument makers in East Tennessee and Western North Carolina--must be something good about the place!

Dave


My brother in law just bought a house in Bakersville west of Asheville. Its definitely a big consideration

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johnparchem
PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 4:32 pm 
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I would consider Oregon or Washington on the pacific side. They both have very moderate swings in humidity and temperature. I do not know NC as well, I do have my sister's family there.

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ballbanjos
PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 4:33 pm 
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Bakersville is not far from me--very cool town. Lots of artists there--sort of an artists community down town, and not far from Spruce Pine, where it's a bit more (but only a bit) urban. They have a hospital and a Walmart....

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Ruby50
PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 5:54 pm 
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If you are retired, look into a place with a hospital, and then make sure it is not on the chopping block. We chose a rural spot with a lot of history on the Eastern Shore of MD and we have a hospital 4 minutes away, a lovely small college to help keep us young, and the river 3 blocks away for a bit of electric boating. Yes we have taxes, but . . .
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ballbanjos
PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 6:32 pm 
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Ruby50 wrote:
If you are retired, look into a place with a hospital, and then make sure it is not on the chopping block. We chose a rural spot with a lot of history on the Eastern Shore of MD and we have a hospital 4 minutes away, a lovely small college to help keep us young, and the river 3 blocks away for a bit of electric boating. Yes we have taxes, but . . .


Good advice. We have a hospital at the foot of the hill a few miles down the road. Not a big one, but they have an ER and a helicopter pad to evac if things are too bad for them to handle.

Dave
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Brad Goodman
PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 7:36 pm 
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We can definitely scratch NY off the list..... I have lived here all my life and am tired of the insanely high taxes and other stuff..

All my family, friends and business are here so-oh well!

A good thing is that they don't tax SS and pensions, and since I am about to retire from my day job I will be getting both so that is some consolation.......

I actually like the weather except for a when it snows a lot.
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Skarsaune
PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 8:21 pm 
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We're an hour north of Dave / ballbanjos in TN.

Very rural, fairly poor except for the resort/vacation cabin folks and the folks moving in from out of state.

We moved here because we always came to the mountains anyways. My commute to work is a road I used to ride on my motorcycle as part of a vacation.

Low taxes, we're a farm so low property tax, small town 15 minutes away with the necessities and Boone/Abingdon/Johnson City all about an hour.

Suits us just fine.
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Toonces
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 1:33 am 
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Hi Peter,
I'm fairly certain I'll end up near Asheville in the next couple of years. Washington would be my dream place to live but it would be so far away from family. In particular, White Salmon WA is awesome and located right next to Hood River, OR. Washington has some absolutely incredible scenery. The Hood River area is also fairly moderate temperature wise and not too rainy. Unfortunately, it is expensive (but coming from California it might seem to bad to you).

Just below Asheville are Brevard and Hendersonville - and they are two very nice towns. I wouldn't want to live right in Asheville. The area has amazing hikes and the Fall scenery is supposed to be one of the best in the nation.

Let us know where you end up and good luck !!!
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Michael.N.
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 2:52 am 
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Go where there are no bears, poisonous snakes, sharks, alligators, tarantulas and other human beings. Bit safer. Oh and avoid places with vending machines, they kill people too.
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Woodie G
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 7:07 am 
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Also look at shifting demographics...that flood tide of individual and business movement out of certain states based on the nature and size of government and the impact of the policies they inflicted matters in terms of future regulation, taxation, and quality of life. In a mobile society, the states receiving the 'boon' of that flood of refugees from losing states will likely see at least some of those refugees demand the same things that created the mess where they used to live...human nature, and an illustration of the impossibility of finding a 'just right' fit for everyone. Around here, we've seen a flood of people that - having moved from Maryland to Virginia 15-20 years back for a less intrusive local and state government - are now headed here to the wilds of West Virginia as Virginia has become much more like Maryland. Plan ahead...

Also be honest with yourself about the services you desire, and the degree of control you wish to see re: local government. A place where you can sit down with the county sheriff - the sole local law enforcement agency in my little hollow in the hills - at the local diner to pick a bone with her about back road speed limit enforcement (as in, there should be none) may be a great place to live for some, but if you are prone to calling the noise police every time a neighbor's party goes past 10 on a weekend, or you routinely harass your HOA's Architectural Committee chair about the half-inch-over-height-limit of your other neighbor's back yard fence, you might want to consider a more regulated locale.

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doncaparker
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 10:28 am 
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I don't think Woodie and I would agree on which is better (more or less government), but her points about considering which one you need or prefer are valid. And don't assume anything is a given. Do you want clean water out of the tap, or can you put up with having to rely on your own filtration of your own well water? Do you want reliable electricity, or can you put up with having to run a generator fairly often? Do you want your sewage treated for you, or do you want to manage a septic tank and leach field? Do you want someone to haul your garbage away on a weekly basis, or do you want to make periodic runs to a dump on your own? Do you need high speed internet, or can you put up with slow, spotty service? And then there are the issues of roads, emergency services, proximity to other things you might want/need, etc.

Some folks assume those services are readily available everywhere. But there are lots of rural areas where one or more (sometimes all) of the above are not givens. Rural life has its downsides.

And just so you don't have an incomplete picture of my home state: while the Eastern Panhandle of West Virginia definitely has seen growth, that is mostly due to its convenient proximity to the Washington, DC area. Most of the rest of the state is losing population. That has very little to do with tax policy, and much more to do with all the other factors that drive migration. We would love to have some Huntington, CA folks come live here, but you might want to make sure you pick the right urban/rural mix for you. We have places so remote that you can go full hermit if you want. But we also have very livable towns that provide all of the things I list above.

Good luck with the decision making.


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Clay S.
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 10:38 am 
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With regard's to Woodie's post, Urban Sprawl is reaching across the Chesapeake and also creeping in from New Jersey and polluting the Delmarva peninsula. It seems to be happening everywhere from this yeast colony we call the human race. So consider how soon it will reach the idyllic setting you hope to move to, in relation to how much longer you anticipate being on this side of the dirt.
I am starting to feel the effects where I am located, but it's probably not worth the effort to move all my junk ( I'll leave it for the kid's to deal with [:Y:] laughing6-hehe ).
At this point lower, slower Delaware might be a good place for those who want to be near, but not in, the Ocean. You would still need to control the humidity.


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rlrhett
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 10:57 am 
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California’s highest tax rate is 13.3%, and kicks in at annual taxable income of over $1,000,000 per year. If your income taxes are 40% you must have seven figure income.

Let’s face it, with that kind of money you can build a bubble of luxury and privilege anywhere you go. Maybe not Manhattan or San Francisco, but certainly anywhere else.

I don’t blame you for wanting to get out of LA, but stay close to family. In the end, they are the most important thing. Get a place in the Sierras where you can find some peace and nature, but still be a couple of hours from your grandkids big soccer match or Christmas dinner. Sure it will cost you five times what a place in rural Tennessee costs, but you will never see your grandkids grow up if you go. Trust me, I know from personal experience.


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Tim L
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 11:50 am 
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Income tax is only 1 piece of what the government is taking and is the least of my worries
Property tax, Sales tax, Utility tax, gas tax, service fees and even more fees for everything you do and every where you go. The cost of living in California is 149.9% compared to other places and I haven't even included that
I don't make enough to pay more than $100 in income tax in California and that is why the burden is so high.
In a couple of years I will be forced to draw on my retirement plan, that's when I will be paying income tax on top of what I already pay

You mention the Sierras and California
Do you realize that fire insurance rates have doubled since last year
I had friends in North Star they were forced out when their fire insurance went from $4500 per year to over $9000 per year
They could no longer do it
Pretty hard to do when you are retired and donating time to non profits.
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Mark L.
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 12:00 pm 
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You can't beat upper East Tennessee, great fishing, hunting, hiking, beautiful mountains and rivers, friendly people, no state income tax, great music festivals, nascar racing, low cost of living. In Bristol you can shop on the Virginia side of town and pay a low sales tax rate. Like the big sign across State St. says "Bristol a good place to live"
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rlrhett
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 1:30 pm 
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The Sierras are not a cheap alternative. I’m trying to be helpful. I understood you to say you paid 40% income taxes.

The cost of living in California is very high, mostly in the way of housing costs. But most of the expenses you list are not significantly less in other states. I’ve lived in Virginia, Florida, Connecticut and California. Utilities and property taxes are MUCH higher in other places than California. Sales tax seems pretty consistent, especially in urban areas. I don’t heat or cool my home, saving me hundreds of dollars a month. In short, everything is a trade off, but I haven’t found a place where similar lifestyles cost significantly less once you take out the cost of your mortgage.

Unfortunately, as doncaparker pointed out, there is no free lunch. Densely populated areas are going to be more highly regulated and have more expensive infrastructure. Whether they charge income tax, property tax, or sales tax, they pay for it somehow. Likewise, popular cosmopolitan places are going to have more competition for living space which drives the cost up. Heck, I had a friend who relocated from London to LA and couldn’t believe how cheap it was to live in California (at least until his kid broke his arm, but that’s a different story.)

There is no doubt that if you move to a less densely populated area with less infrastructure you can live more cheaply. That’s true even in California. But I recommend that you talk with a real tax professional who can compare apples to oranges before you distance yourself from your children. I’m not sure where you got the 149.9% number, but everybody’s situation is different. You may have property taxes locked in from the eighties in California and be shocked at your bill in a home that cost half as much in Atlanta. Likewise, you may be shocked at a $6,000 heating oil bill for your furnace when your LA house didn’t even have heat. There is no one simple answer. I’m not suggesting this is what you did, but in general be critical of click-bait internet articles claiming to rank states or to reveal the “10 Best places to retire to”. It’s is far less clear than that.

Good luck and happy hunting!


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Pat Foster
PostPosted: Thu Apr 01, 2021 6:09 pm 
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One more thing . . .

earthquakes, but you're used to those in So Cal. Western WA is way overdue for its big one, and the topography will make a tsunami especially nasty.

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Terence Kennedy
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 1:47 am 
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Minnesota is great except for five month winters, no spring, year around road work, bugs, taxes, and tornadoes.

Does have some boring stuff like great health care and schools.

There is only a luthier under every fourth or fifth rock.

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John Arnold
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 5:44 am 
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Quote:
I moved here from Tennessee which has no income tax but has super high sales taxes. Here in NC, I pay income tax (but not on Social Security) and lower sales tax. It's been pretty much a wash in terms of taxes.


Fortunately, a few years ago TN lowered the sales tax on food by 3 percentage points. I can't remember if that was a result of the adoption of a state lottery or something other, but it did lower the cost of living.

Western NC definitely has the advantage over Eastern TN when it comes to high elevation (red spruce habitat), but driving from my house I can be hiking in NC in less than 30 minutes.

I humidify for 2 1/2 to 3 months in the dead of winter, but AC takes care of excess summer humidity.

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jfmckenna
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 9:21 am 
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Bristol is a cool little town and has come a long way over the years. Growing up it seems like everyone on the east coast wanted to head west and many did. I did for a bit but while those wide open places and deserts are beautiful there's nothing like the Appalachians in NC, VA and TN. Also I can hop on my bicycle and ride 100 miles of beautiful mountain roads and hardly see any cars too. I can see someone who grew up and spent their entire life in CA having issues moving east though.


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Marcus
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 10:14 am 
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I'm a native Washingtonian, grew up on the east side, lived the last 20 years on the west side. It is beautiful up here (the west side) if you can muscle through the fall and winter (not bad or cold, just dreary). The spring and summer are worth it. The RH doesn't swing too much and if you can avoid King Country (or any metro area), shouldn't be too expensive to live in. Beware the East side of WA tho. I love it too, but it is more of a desert.

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flemsmith
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 12:33 pm 
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Sedona is a no unless you're rich and like major congestion and tourists. Still in Az, take a look at Jerome or Bisby. Both in mountains, both small with lots of quirky artist types, if you like that. Or Prescott, although the Calif transplant growth has been huge there. Sounds exciting. Roy
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Jim Watts
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 1:51 pm 
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I live in the mountains of New Mexico in Los Alamos (about 7000 ft elevation). It's wonderful place if you are active and like the outdoors, maybe not so much if you like shopping, but Santa Fe is only 45 minutes away. Out Landscape is more similar to the lower elevations of the sierra, it's not the desolate desert which comes to mind for a lot of people. The winters can get cold, but I will say that 20 degrees with the sun shinning on you feels warmer than 45 in the fog or high humidity. We get some snow but it doesn't stick around too long in town and we have a ski area too. I don't have a dehumidifier however I pretty much run my humidifier year round. Today is about 25% rh outside but 42% in the shop.
Blue skies and great views!

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Ed Haney
PostPosted: Fri Apr 02, 2021 7:21 pm 
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Pmaj7 wrote:
Many Californians coming to Seattle area. However, we seem to be in a hand basket. Not sure where we're going. Many Seattle peeps moving to Florida and Texas.

Pat
From my view in Texas your area and Portland do look like hand baskets. I often thought this last year that I'm glad I'm not there.

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