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I think that there's no upside to building truss rods ala Cumpiano, or pinning necks on, either.

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Peter Havriluk

I started four or five before even finishing one. Literally. But I got a bit further each time.

I’m a book junkie, and Gore’s “Build” book is far and away the best “how-to” text IMO.

Also a lot to be said for videos. You used to be able to buy O’Brien’s chapter by chapter, but I’m not sure if you still can.

Joking about the first few aside, any rep is a valuable rep. IMO the first few guitars are about learning to complete tasks and gaining competency in your understanding and methods rather than making a great guitar. The more times you try something, the more comfortable you get doing it.

I also find value in trying different ways of accomplishing the various tasks involved in the guitar-making process because they help you develop a broader understanding of the whole.


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Well, misery loves company. I don't want go any further with my first one, except the neck which came out very well with a minor thinning of the binding near the nut. I'm ok with that.

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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!

I made a hard copy of that when I started building. It didn't help. Honestly, I really don't think books are going to help much as I now have been through all the steps and know most things to avoid or improve upon. I bought a book anyway and I hope it helps some. It should be delivered soon.

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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!

I built my own truss rods for my mandolins, it was pretty easy and cheap. I won't do it again though.

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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!

Quoting myself here because nobody gave an answer to a question I implied here. I've thought of just sandwiching the back-strip in when gluing the back. Is this a bad idea? I'm thinking it might be more difficult but I don't know, not having tried it. Is the router the best way to go?

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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!

I've done it both ways. The router makes a nice lap joint but one slip and it's back to the drawing board. Just make sure your edges are all true if you are going to sandwich it. I thing sandwiching it is generally considered the proper way of doing it. In fact those old marquetry style back strips were made as a sort of 'expansion joint' such that they would move instead of the joint opening up or the wood cracking.

After a cursory read of this I concluded it to be a total waste of money. There may be some tidbits here and there if I dive into it more but I won't. This is for someone who has never built an instrument of any kind and has no woodworking skills to begin with. All of this info is freely available on YT which is my preference for learning these days.

It was also suggested that I get Robbie's videos and I think these would be another waste of money for me. I already know the correct steps for doing this, I just need to build another guitar to improve my skills and learn from previous mistakes. I'm sure there will be more mistakes but they will most likely be due to me taking shortcuts or doing something stupid that I know better to do.

It's much more fun for me to read this forum and ask questions when I need to and it's fun to read all the different responses. I'm not trying to say I know everything I need to know, that would certainly be BS. Books and video instruction other than YT is not for me I guess. If I had more free cash, I would love to take a class. At least there would be someone to tell me I'm about to make a faux pas. That aint gonna happen though so guitar body number 2 will be my next course. I have neck building down really well so it's just the body stuff and neck connection. I decided to go with a bolt on for this iteration which means I'll have to either revamp my dovetailed neck or build another to allow for the bolts. I haven't decided which way yet but it seems a shame to waste a perfectly good neck.

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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!

Sounds like you should build 2 bodies, one for each neck style. I did three at a time early on and still do.

For a 40' radius you can use a flat rim and radius the braces. The back usually has a tighter radius, but there are ways to do that without using a dish.
One piece of advice I would give is when you "screw up" don't be afraid to consult the forum. Many of us have probably made the same mistake and either figured out a work around or a less painful way to redo it. They say misery loves company, so you can take some consolation in that if nothing else.
Keeping the first few instruments simply appointed can also help with success. The back strip which many guitars have isn't needed if the joint is well made, so after planing the joint you can hold it together and decide it you want the center strip. I would put the strip between the halves of the back rather than routing it in -at least for the first few guitars. It is easier to redo it if doesn't go well. In either case I would still use the back graft on the inside of the back.
The forum members will often give conflicting advice based on their experiences, so you still need to determine what seems reasonable and the best course of action for your particular skill set.
Happy building!

P.S. For your dovetailed neck you can laminate pieces to both sides to make it a straight tenon and use that for a tenoned bolt on neck. the change in grain orientation may actually make it a stronger construction.

Thanks for the tip on changing the dovetail to a tenon.

I have to have a back strip and and other fancy stuff even if it slows me down when I screw it up. My biggest item going forward will be to take the time to build a binding tower. My bindings are always iffy in spots. It seems so simple yet I manage to sand some areas too much due to one thing or another.

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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!

It's on its way back to the seller.

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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!

I have heard many critiques of the Cumpiano/Natelson book over the years but “total waste of money” is a new one to me.

My copy cost 25 cents at the local library book sale, and I have certainly gotten my moneys worth from it.
Even as an experienced builder you can find a few nuggets if you keep an open mind. It does offer many hand tool techniques which can help refine the cuts made by the machine tools we use. They mention using a purfling cutter and chisel to perfect the binding channel cut by the router. It is not unusual for a guitar maker to have to rework the binding rebates in some spots no matter what type of contraption they build to cut them. Reading starts on page 246 on my copy and offers a lot of good advice if carefully considered.

I found it too long winded and uncomfortable to read. I'm so used to reading on a pc or phone where I can make the text any size and do searches. If I had digital version, I mat have given it another shot but honestly, I feel I already have all this info just by watching youtube and reading forums. This would have been a great book 25 years ago.

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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!

I suffer from the opposite problem. When I get a new camera I download the manual onto my PC. Cameras are more complicated than in the old film camera era, and do so much more if you know how to use them. Sometimes you have to change several parameters to achieve the results you are after. I wish I had a "hard copy" of the manual to take to the field with me. Having a book at the bench could also be handy, but if you have a smart phone (I don't) that might fill the same need.

Richard—

It sounds like you don’t like reading books printed on paper, so you didn’t truly delve into the content of this specific book. That’s a fair criticism of all books printed on paper; you could have an easier time finding specific parts of the book if it had search functions. But like many books printed on paper, this particular book has a detailed table of contents that helps the reader find the various sections as needed. Just for context, you should understand that this was not merely a great book 25 years ago; at that time, it was widely considered the most thorough book there was on building acoustic guitars. Since that time, more books have been written and more varied types of media have been created. Unfortunately, the quality of what is out there for free varies, because anybody can post anything on YouTube. If other ways of learning work better for you than reading books printed on paper, it is good that you know that about yourself, but be careful about relying on the disjointed sea of good, bad, and ugly things one can find for free on the Internet. For my money, I still find a lot of valuable content in the Cumpiano/Natelson book, and rely on parts of it now, about 25 years after I built my first guitar with that book as my guide. I hope you find something that is useful for you, since this resource wasn’t. But understand that it is still a very useful resource for many of us. If at some point you realize that you need to gain some knowledge that is not available for free on the Internet, perhaps you will circle back to print media for guidance. If you ever do that, the Cumpiano/Natelson book may turn out to be more valuable to the more experienced version of you than it is to the current, less experienced version of you.

There is some great information available online. And there’s some that’s worth about what you pay for it.

I can relate to Hutch. I am a very hands on maker, learner. I read all kinds of things, but I really want to know why do it that way. I do go way more traditional, so I block out everything that isn't hand tools. I got the Benatetto book on Archtops, but even though it was my first guitar, I still didn't follow much of anything in the book! There are a lot of cool instruments in it! I had the Cupiano/Natelson book. I sold it at a garage sale. I read it, and it seemed perfectly straighforward. Just do it. I didn't make one until years later.

What I need is help with specific problems I encounter. I'm always looking for the only dimension they don;t give. And I'm wondering who even needs the other dimensions that ARE given. I know those. I guess I just think different. I like different.

That's why I like the OLF and maestronet. Even when I ask stupid questions, I get help.

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Why be normal?

I am also in the camp that acknowledges the Cumpiano and Natelson book as a classic - but it is now quite dated, and even William Cumpiano now uses a bolt-on neck and other newer techniques. I liked the Kinkade book as a guide for my first build. By the time you are onto number 4 or 5 you will be wanting the Gore/Gilet books.

I don't like reading certain books because they are hard on my eyes, even with my glasses on. They should make a digital version, then I might buy it and read it. I might. At this point in time, I just want to get the mechanics down and build a playable good looking guitar. Once I've done a few, I'll dive into tap tuning or chladni modes and select better wood. I'm in the infancy stage right now, crawling along. Being close to 70, I'll probably be dead before I figure it out. That doesn't bother me, I just would like to stay on track and keep building guitars, I'm so easily distracted by model trains and painting.

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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!

People learn in different ways. If there is one thing I hate it's Youtube videos. If they are short, succinct and straight to the point then maybe but it seems every one of them has to have some sort of flashy intro, a discussion about how your Grandma used to make cookies and then they finally get into it and you have sit there and watch... I'd rather hit the index of a book, find the page, and Boom done. Digital is nice for searching I do like that. But still.

I've built 70 guitars now and on occasion I still even go back to the very first book I used, Irving Sloane's. There are so many operations and steps involved in building a guitar that it's easy to forget so sometimes just going back and reading the procedures helps.

But again, to each their own and I suspect it's generational as well.

One thing I don't think has been mentioned is to be careful if you combine guitar-making process steps from multiple sources, you can get into trouble that way as they are not always interchangeable. If you are going to follow someones methods then pick someone reputable and follow through with them. Once you've built a few then going out on your own makes more sense. I've been doing this for over twenty years and I'm still learning new things. I've got a selection of necks, body parts, tops and even a few whole guitars stuck up here and there in the shop because they are not right - happens to all of us. Good luck and, most of all, have a good time.

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Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"

One of the things I especially like about the Gore/Gilet books is the build-process flow charts. Very valuable to me since I've only made a few guitars and those were stretched out over a few years, with the result that I can easily forget a step or cause myself more work by taking a step out of order.

Banjopicks - I sent a PM on Monday about sending you my EM6000 finishing schedule. The message is still in my Outbox which says you haven't seen it yet. Maybe you aren't getting notices when you get a PM. I know I haven't received notices for several years because that forum function doesn't appear to work anymore.

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Once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest of places if you look at it right - Robert Hunter