Official Luthiers Forum!

For those interested in making a wood rose like mine !
I will first explain how; then try to send pics of jigs and sample roses.
It will take a few days so please be patient with me.
Thanks
Mike Collins

_________________
Mike Collins

Looking forward to it, Mike. Thanks.

Thanks Mike, can't wait!

_________________
Dave Rector
Rector Guitars

The first thing you have to do is -
1 -what size sound hole are you putting this rose around.
2 -How far from the edge of the S.H. do you want your rose.
3 -How wide do you want the rose to be (including purfling or pearl)
4 -make a drawing on posterboard(the fairly heavy stuff)
5 -deside how many pieces you want of the spalted or ambrosia (or any wood) in the rose.
I use a 8 piece and a 12 piece rose-it can depend on the size of the piece your starting with .And the look I want!
A 8 piece has 4 bookmatched faces when done and the 12 has 6 !
So the 12 piece can look very busy!
Next -draw with a compass the s.h.-and the rose on the posterboard-that is the actual size of both!
I usually for classicals use a 87-88mm S.H. and 96mm for steels.
I make small steels!
I like my rose at least 3mm from the edge of the S.Hole!
I'll post more tomorrow-I neeed to get back to work!
Mike

_________________
Mike Collins

yup, we are looking forward to it! peterm38958.6411574074

_________________
Peter M.
Cornerstone Guitars
http://www.cornerstoneukes.com

Thanks
What a great offer. I have always wanted to create my own!!!!

_________________
Andy Z.
http://www.lazydogguitars.com

Thanks Mike for posting the method. Dense me is more visual in grasping concepts so your pictures will be very welcome indeed!

I appreciate this info, too, Mike. Thanks

Ron

_________________
OLD MAN formerly (and formally) known as:

Ron Wisdom

Somewhere in the middle of Arkansas......

WOW
I just spent 30 minutes writing a description of how i make the roses and with a unknown touch of the mouse it all got deleted!!
I'll try again tomorrow!
mike

_________________
Mike Collins

Ya know there is allot of that going about lately. I had the same problem....had it all together and "poof" it was gone to BFE....knew it was there but it just disappeared!

ditto with the pix of Mike's roses on the other post

I can't edit my posts...I can only edit once..

Sam - why can't you edit?...is that option no available at the bottom of each of your posts?

O.K.
Let me try this again!
Thanks jeanne for the e-mail!
If you read my first post I left off with using a compass to draw the sound hole(S.H.) size and the inside diameter of the rose size!
If you want the rose to be 3 or 4 mm from the S.H.
then make an exact drawing with the compass.
Then you must determine the width of the rose with purfling or pearl (what ever trim you want).
Lets say you want a 19mm rose (sorry only metric) with purfling then draw that!
I do a 19 mm rose so I'll work off that diameter!

Then measure the width of the purfling that your going to use!lets say it's 3.5mm
so 3.5mm on each side of the rose -S.H. side and outside equals 7mm.Draw that now!That leaves you with a 12mm piece of wood needed for the rose.
Then take a protractor and devide the rose into what ever size pieces you need !
lets say you have a very small piece of highly figured wood and need to get 12 pieces to make a full size rose then start with making a 90 degree line straight across the rose template at the center of
the S.H.Then make a line that's striaght up & down with the top centerline!
This will give you a 4 piece rose-then just devide equally the remaining pieces to get the number of pieces you need !
Devide 4 into 8 the devide those into 16 and so on!
Remember the more pieces you use the more glue joints you'll have to make invisible.
Cut out one piece of the rose from the posterboard(4 piece or, 8 ,etc) you just drew and transfer it to plexiglass!
This will give you a hard template to transfer you piece size to the wood you've chosen for the rose!

I'll send some more tomorrow or so!
Mike



You can make a 8 piece or 12 -or what ever you need to get the desired effect out of the grain your looking at!
You'll find that it is 22.5 degrees between pieces!
transfer the template to the wood piece your using for the rose(draw it on the wood!)

When i first started making these I sanded all sides carefully with a belt and drum sander!!
WOW that was tough!
Then I made a jig to sand the outside curve and still did the insiade on my belt because it was so close to the right curve.
I also made a jig ti sand the glue joints which I'll describe soon!

_________________
Mike Collins

I love cliffhangers !!!!

Ron

_________________
OLD MAN formerly (and formally) known as:

Ron Wisdom

Somewhere in the middle of Arkansas......

[QUOTE=Jeanne] Ya know there is allot of that going about lately. I had the same problem....had it all together and "poof" it was gone to BFE....knew it was there but it just disappeared! [/QUOTE]

Had the same problem when writing a PM to my bud Al Desforges, i wrote a full page and " pouf "(french version ) it all disapeared, i had to rewrite everything in a hurry before heading back to the day job! Serge Poirier38959.0423842593

Hello again
sorry for the cliff hanging!
You only need a piece of wood 55 to 60mm long X 22mm thick X 25 to 50mm wide depending if your making a 8 or 16 piece rose.
I put my plexiglass template up to the end grain of some nicely figured wood and being able to see the actual size of the piece I find grain I like and that will usually have a dramatic affect when cut and bookmatched.
Trace around your template to show the wood you want to use.
I then cut this piece in the demensions described above and carefully plane or sand to the lines -I made a jig for my disc sander that sands the outside curve.I then snad the indide radius with my stationary beltsander by eye!
The you can plane or sand the joint edge -very carefully.
This sounds harder that it is to do but I've never had to throw a piece away because of bad demensions.
I also made a jig for my sanding disc for truing up the glue joints that are butted together to form the rose.
NOW you should have a piece that has a outside radius -a inside one and the butt ends and at 22.5 degrees.
Then go to your band saw or miter box and slice the
piece from butt joint to butt joint like bologna -(tape off your bandsaw opening if you have one so the pieces do not fall through)I cut my slices at 3mm -mark each (number)face as they come off the saw so you can reassemble them with perfect bookmatches
Now transfer your rose demensions to the top you want to inlay-remember that you are only going to rout for this inlay at this time.
I cut a 13mm slot that is for classicals 51mm from the S.H. center-rout this at 2/3 the final top thickness.
I start at the center line at the bridge side of the channel-I line up the gluejoint of the rose pieces with the centerline of the top -you must start with pieces number 4and 5if using a 8 piece rose.
pieces 7 and 8 for a 16 piece rose.
line all your pieces in the routed channel and adjust the glue joints so they are tight -when they all fit perfect go back and start gluing them at the top centerline where you first started fitting them.
NOW i made a jig that has a batten on it to fit in the slot on my sanding disc table-- fitted to a piece of med.density p .board that is exactly one half of my rose size.I made this by simply drawing my rose size and routing a channel in the piece and then cutting it in half so I had the right angle for my joints to be sanded on the disc at the right angle-I turn the disc by hand !!!!!!!
It only taks a few swipes of the paper to level these small pieces.
More latter!
mike

_________________
Mike Collins

Mike, do you have some pics? would love too see how they look!

Thanks

_________________
Peter M.
Cornerstone Guitars
http://www.cornerstoneukes.com

Mike, your process is easy to follow so far, but some pics of the different stages or the jigs would also be helpful. BTW, thanks for writing all this out for us!

_________________
Dave Rector
Rector Guitars

It's posts like this that make the OLF so great. Thanks Mike.

_________________
Joe Breault
Merrimack, NH
Perpetual novice

Yes, thanks Mike, file saved!

Again- My last post disappeared!!!!!!!!
I'll send pics soon and the finish to this saga!
I'm busy all this weekend with players and repairs ;so I'll try to post early in the morning or late at night;or next week!I'll get some pics posted as well!!!!
Thanks for your interest-these style roses will set your guitar apart from the common mainstream roses.
By the way if anyone wants some of the purflings I use around my rose let me know !
Take care all!
Mike

_________________
Mike Collins

Mike,

Are you typing your post directly in the forum box at the end of the thread, or are you prepping in Word and copying it over?........

Mike...if you've spent a lot of time typing a reply, highlight the whole thing and use your "copy" function under "edit," at the top of your screen (if you're using a PC, anyway). Then if your post makes like a ghost, you can just "paste" into a fresh box and try again. It works for me.