Official Luthiers Forum!

In my recent setup, I have noticed a mild muting to the B string. It doesn't
sound like a fret buzz. What is odd about it, is that it improves as you go up
the neck towards the saddle. The break point at the saddle seems fine.
It is clearly worse open, but fretting at the 1st doesn't make it that much
better.   Any suggestions??? The string seems to be seated correctly through
the bridge.
TIA

_________________
Andy Z.
http://www.lazydogguitars.com

Have you tried another string? Sounds like you might have a weak patch in the string that goes away when you get higher on the fretboard.

YOU WOULD BE A MILLIONAIRE IF YOU COULD SOLVE THE MYSTERY
OF THE 'B' STRING SYNDROME. WE BOTH COULD BE MILLIONARES IF WE BOTH COULD SOLVE THE MYSTERY.

I WISH WE COULD SOLVE THIS PROBLEM.
PERHAPS CHANGE THE TUNING OF THE STRING TO A MORE TOLERABLE OPEN TUNED KEY, BUT THEN WE WOULD HAVE TO
DESIGN A NEW SET OF CHORDS.

Some of Walter's chicken fat might work here too.

Ron

_________________
OLD MAN formerly (and formally) known as:

Ron Wisdom

Somewhere in the middle of Arkansas......

Bad string, tight nut slot are the places I would check.

Andy,

If trying all of the above suggestions still leaves the B string muted, you might try my Sound is Round method. The B string, when muted, is usually being dampened by the lower side braces being too heavy. This depends on the geometry of the braces and top thickness, but is a good place to start.

Pluck the B string and feel the top over those braces. If there is no vibration there, but there is above and below the lower side braces, then here is your problem. Reshape them into parabolas and work them lower with successive restringings, until you can feel vibration over them. There is a picture of a top I braced on the Tapered/Parabolic OM's subject, showing these the way I shape them, which is copied from those on vintage Martins.

The problem can also be caused by the junction of the upper belly brace with the X brace. It should not butt up against the X, but taper down to close to zero height at this point. Again, pluck the B and feel over this place. I wrote about this 10 years ago in "American Lutherie", #47. John Calkin, head honcho under Huss and Dalton, told me has become a believer in this.

The reason the B string gets louder as you go up the neck is that the higher notes are resonating with rings of smaller diameter, and they no longer pass over these side braces. The upper side braces also influence the treble range, but higher notes, being closer to the cross point of the X, and you can do the same test over these braces plucking the high E string.

At least, these braces are easy to reach...

Scott

Thanks

_________________
Andy Z.
http://www.lazydogguitars.com

Andy, if you live in the real world , try a different saddle; often, bone will have a soft area near or under a string, muting that one somewhat. Same can happen if your saddle isn't well seated; check that there's no dust or chips a the bottom of the slot, and draw a pencil line down the length of the saddle,on the bottom, and run it a few times over something dead flat to check for high spots or dips. I use a 600 grit diamond sharpening plate for this(the one that StewMac sells for leveling frets.

Before even that, change strings....

OK, Andy, You've got advise from the world's expert, and someone who thinks he knows everything, not necessarily in that order.

Let's play "Stump the Chump". Let us know if any of it is other than low grade detritus.

Scott

With all due respects, Sir, when the car doesn't start, check that there is gas in the tank before re-building the engine.

In other words, check the obvious first.

In this case, if all the physical and mechanical reasons for a -slightly- muted string doesn't reveal any faults, then should, by all means, delve into the belly of the beast, with caution.

Mario,

If you re-read my first post on this subject, you will notice that the first thing I said was to check the oil, to follow the previous posts' advise, which seemed to cover any superficial or obvious aspect, such as the saddle or string.

And so, finding no "physical" or "mechanical...faults",if you were to "delve into the belly of the beast", would you be so helpful as to give Andy specific advise as to what you would do to bring up the volume of a B string?

Scott

I changed stings and cleaned up the saddle slot and the bridge and it is
better. Thanks for all of the advice

_________________
Andy Z.
http://www.lazydogguitars.com

Andy,

A disappointing end to this thread.    

I can't allow myself the option of settling for "better", when working on someone else's guitar, knowing that I can always make it "right" once I go through all of the possible sound snags.

However, I realize it's a major leap of faith to reach into that ol' soundhole with implements of destruction. And so, please do not take me as being critical in any way.

Did you pluck the B string and feel over the lower side braces?

    "I feel the Earth move, under my feet"

Free advise is often worth no more than its cost, but not always...

ScottScott van Linge39028.4587962963

Scott
I will do it.
Which lower side brace should I feel. I assume the lower finger brace on the
treble side????
Andy

_________________
Andy Z.
http://www.lazydogguitars.com

Hi Andy,

Thanks for asking. Actually, the rings I refer to are symmetrical, centered at the cross point of the X. That is why both lower finger braces could be dampening the B string. The Sound is Round diagram is on my web site, on the "Bio and Brace Talk" page. It shows approximately where the ring is found for each string, although there is variation with woods and thickness. It could also be the upper side braces or the junction of the upper belly brace with the X.

Basically, the more of each ring that can vibrate, the more sound it will generate.

Happy feeling,

Scott