Official Luthiers Forum!

I got a couple questions 'bout mahogany

1) What is y'alls favorite, soundwise?

b) When someone says "mahogany" (as in b&s), is a specific type of
mahogany generally inferred?

TIA

_________________
Mike

"The Dude abides. I don't know about you but I take comfort in that. It's good knowin' he's out there. The Dude. Takin' 'er easy for all us sinners. Shoosh." The Stranger

In response to your second question: the specific type is blocks! Ha ha ha!
no just kidding. Saw the joke, had to take it.

I feel like all I ever hear about is Honduran Mohogany, but then I hear it is getting harder and harder to find. I would also like to know what is in, as far as a hierarchial declination of mohogany species.

When you hear 'mahogany', it'll generally be in reference to Honduran (S. Macrophylla). My fave, soundwise....not sure, really. I've got a few Cuban sets I'm really looking forward to using (very different tap to the honduran and african varieties I've got), and I've got a soft spot of Sapele, and Khaya and Sipo (latter three are all African Melicae species, related to mahogany) too.

Basic rundown seems to be:

Best: Cuban.
Next best: Small Leaf (Microphylla) mahogany
Standard: Honduran

Then there's the African stuff.

Even though the African stuff is at the bottom of the list don't sell it short. I have built some killer sounding guitars out of the stuff! Allied has had some great sales on African Mahogany where you can pick up sets for almost nothing $20-30.

I am a big mahogany fan!

_________________
Josh House

Canadian Luthier Supply
http://www.canadianluthiersupply.com
https://www.facebook.com/canadianluthiersupply?ref=hl
House Guitars - Custom Built Acoustic Instruments.
http://www.houseguitars.com

Many wood stores list Honduran as "Genuine Mahogany", although the debate is that what we refer to as Cuban is the real genuine. They are both real mahoganies though, of the Swietenia genus. The African varieties are not true mahoganies by classification, but are still excellent tonewoods. I have some African Mahogany that is so close looking to Cuban and Honduran, that you wouldn't believe it's not a true mahogany. But there are so many varieties of true mahoganies, it's hard to know what is what.

_________________
"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

Thanks so much everyone.

Don, thanks for the clarification. I had always assumed that "Genuine"
was different from both Honduran and Cuban.

_________________
Mike

"The Dude abides. I don't know about you but I take comfort in that. It's good knowin' he's out there. The Dude. Takin' 'er easy for all us sinners. Shoosh." The Stranger

I phoned all over Canada yesterday to try and find 3" Hondo mahogany boards, it took a long time - but I finally found some {4" foggetaboudit} - its not only getting scarce, it will be impossible to find soon, due to its newly listed CITES status.
If its as endangered as they say thats prolly a good thing - but I still stand my opinion that people such as luthiers who rely on these woods for thier livelyhoods, need to start standing up to the wasteful industries {such as furniture, and veneer} and the wasteful industry practices that are causing these species to become endangered in the first place.
But alas this is a topic thats is not to be covered here at the OLF.
Cheers
Charliewood

I just got a couple of sets of the african mahogany from Don (very nice wood) and it looks exactly like most of the honduran I have. In fact according to a book I have on timber identification (written by one of the Constantines, who have been in the wood business since 1812)it is a true mahogany "Khaye ivorensis....is probably the most widely used of the true mahoganies.........."
Sound wise, is there any noticable difference? I've never built with the african before, just wondering what to expect.
                          Paul

Charliewood, the scarcity is no bueno.

What woods are considered similar sounding to Mahogany?

_________________
Mike

"The Dude abides. I don't know about you but I take comfort in that. It's good knowin' he's out there. The Dude. Takin' 'er easy for all us sinners. Shoosh." The Stranger

Interesting... I thought, or was lead to believe that a wood had to ba a swietenia in order to be a true mahogany, just like a wood has to be a dalbergia in order to be a true rosewood. Any wood experts out there?

Regarding mahogany of a thick nature, I still have access to a place that gets 12/4 and 16/4 Honduran (S.American). Perhaps it wouldn't be a bad idea to stock up while it's still available...Don Williams39044.5555092593

_________________
"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

[QUOTE=Josh H] Even though the African stuff is at the bottom of the list don't sell it short. I have built some killer sounding guitars out of the stuff! Allied has had some great sales on African Mahogany where you can pick up sets for almost nothing $20-30.

I am a big mahogany fan! [/QUOTE]

Oh, defintitely! The African Mahoganies (if we can call them that) are some of my very favourite woods. Great stuff. Heck, the majority of my board materials is some primo quartered ribbon Khaya. The heavy kind.

As for availability, the local place I go to still has a decent stock of older 8/4 mahogany, but nothing thicker. Since I don't build one-piece necks, this is fine with me. And when I can't get it anymore, well, I'll build with Sapele. Or Walnut. Or Cherry. Plenty of options.

Right now, the African varieties are absurdly cheap from the Spanish suppliers (for you European folks), to the tune of significantly under 20 dollars/set for any of them.Mattia Valente39044.5661574074

Sapele is very nice too. Another wood that is under rated IMO because of its inexpensive price point.

_________________
Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

Perhaps a group buy might be in order soon, mabye the person who can source hondo the cheapest could get it together? Just a thought
Cheers
Charliewood

Charliewood
Great idea for a group buy....I would definitely be in...
I wouldn't know where to get it

_________________
Andy Z.
http://www.lazydogguitars.com

I'd be in for a group buy as well.

_________________
Mike

"The Dude abides. I don't know about you but I take comfort in that. It's good knowin' he's out there. The Dude. Takin' 'er easy for all us sinners. Shoosh." The Stranger

Group buy of what exactly? What are you looking for?

_________________
"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

I would like to see some pieces suitable to use for end blocks and neck blocks as well as for necks.

Has anyone used Sapele or Lyptus for necks or blocks??? Is it useable? (I think the answer is "yes" to that one). Is it more inexpensive than mahogany? (I dunno?)

[QUOTE=harry]
Has anyone used Sapele or Lyptus for necks or blocks??? Is it useable? [/QUOTE]

I've used Sapele for neck blocks. It works very well but is a little heavier than mahogany. Now I use lime (basswood in the US?) which is lighter than mahogany, carves/planes really well, is strong and is cheap and readilly available here in the UK.

_________________
Dave White
De Faoite Stringed Instruments
". . . the one thing a machine just can't do is give you character and personalities and sometimes that comes with flaws, but it always comes with humanity" Monty Don talking about hand weaving, "Mastercrafts", Weaving, BBC March 2010

[QUOTE=Don Williams] Group buy of what exactly? What are you looking for?[/QUOTE]

Anything. I'm really just into group activities and got caught up in the moment.

Really though, I was thinking thicker stock for necks and neck blocks, etc as well. Maybe not a group buy thing?

_________________
Mike

"The Dude abides. I don't know about you but I take comfort in that. It's good knowin' he's out there. The Dude. Takin' 'er easy for all us sinners. Shoosh." The Stranger

[QUOTE=Mattia Valente]
As for availability, the local place I go to still has a decent stock of older 8/4 mahogany, but nothing thicker. Since I don't build one-piece necks, this is fine with me.
[/QUOTE]

Same here! I have been buying a plank or two every now and then from a local lumber yard for years, and the same pile just sits there every time I go there. Mahogany has fallen out of favour with the cabinet makers over here, it seems I'm the only one in town buying it, perhaps this is just a European thing? It is mostly flat or flat / rift sawn so it is not ideal for backs and sides, but great for two piece necks. I have made 4 or 5 guitars with this material for backs and sides without stability issues however; one of the nice things about mahogany is that it is dimensionally quite stable even if not quartered.

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Rian Gitar og Mandolin

Arnt,
I think that mabye mahogany has fallen out of favor because of the rising price of it. ?
I think the idea for a group buy was concerning hondo mahogany Don - but I just realized I and fellow Canadians might not be able to participate - as I dont think your allowed to ship it across the border anymore on account of the new Cites status -
Thats what I heard from someone anyway.
I know where to get some here in Canada, mabye we could organize two buys if thats the case.
Cheers
Charliewood charliewood39045.490462963

[QUOTE=charliewood] I dont think your allowed to ship it across the border anymore on account of the new Cites status -
[/QUOTE]

Yes, I'm pretty sure you're right about that.

_________________
Mike

"The Dude abides. I don't know about you but I take comfort in that. It's good knowin' he's out there. The Dude. Takin' 'er easy for all us sinners. Shoosh." The Stranger

I'd be interested is seeing what's available. Would especially like some about 3 1/2 square, or 16/4 even, QS, for two-one piece necks, or maybe some 8/4 or so, flat/rift sawn for two piece necks.

Ron

_________________
OLD MAN formerly (and formally) known as:

Ron Wisdom

Somewhere in the middle of Arkansas......

I have not heard anything of Mahogany making CITES category one??? Maybe CITES 2, but nothing at all about cat 1 like BRW.

I could be wrong about that, but it is interesting to observe how when a rumour spreads or even a suggestion is made of a short fall in supply of a commodity, how that commodity will immediately jump in price without the need for validation of the claim.

For some, this tendency for our species to jump to conclusions can be a very handy tool indeed, but generally, it is seldom beneficial to the majority......look at how much you are paying for your fuel.

With all this so called shortness or threat to supply being bought about by this natural disaster and that political unrest or this sparrow farting in the North Sea, I would like to know when was the last time that you stopped to fuel up and actually got turned away because the servo had no fuel left to sell you?? Has not happened here ever, just lucky I guess.

What is also interesting, is how when a commodity producer does get caught out bluffing the market place, how quickly they will promote the angle that the inflated prices of their commodity was morally justifiable in the name of conservation. For whilst supply of their commodity may not have been as threatened as initially represented to the market, the price hike was necessary to ensure that it did not become so. Ata boy you good corporate citizen you

I will give you 10 to 1 that very little, if any, of the increase to profit margins generated in the name of conservation by these morally upstanding environmental saviours will ever find it's way back toward actually supporting anything but the shareholders, but then, I can be a little cynical at times .

Sorry, off me box and back on topic. I ordered a couple of sets of Cuban from one of our OLF sponsors AC Woods. The sets looked very very nice on the site and the staff were really helpful people, Thanks Jean-Louis I have read such good things about Cuban like that it is THE best Mahogany for guitar builders, or the only Mahogany used on pre-war Martins was Cuban. I do not know how true these statements are, but with Colin's and Dave's endorsement for Cuban, the choice was pretty easy.

Cheers

Kim

I got a set of that Cuban from AC Woods - I think you will be very happy - very nice stuff.

                      Peace,Paul