Official Luthiers Forum!

This is in response to Jeff's request from a thread from last week. Some pics of the neck joint I'm using.

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Jimmy Caldwell
http://www.caldwellguitars.com

pretty similar to my neck joint(ok actually Dana's) Cool pics jimmy...

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John Mayes
http://www.mayesluthier.com

John, this joint is the result of years of research and hundreds of prototypes. (Not really, I stole it from Steve Klein)

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Jimmy Caldwell
http://www.caldwellguitars.com

No offense, but I don't like it. Maybe I'm failing to see it, but I can't tell how this joint can possibly secure the heel to the rim????? Is this neck entirely held on by those four bolts going into the FB extension?

Beautiful workmanship though....

Don Williams38474.5121527778

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"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

Don,

This particular guitar has a "heel-less" neck. The bottom of the heel is only about 2" deep. Under string tension there is a slight gap (~.005) at the tip. I laminate ebony on the neck to minimize the visual impact of the gap. (It's almost invisible if you're not looking for it.)

On traditional necks, I use the same joint with an additional bolt about 2/3 of the way down the neck.

I like the ease of taking the neck off. Takes about thirty seconds.

It's just another way of doing things.

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Jimmy Caldwell
http://www.caldwellguitars.com

Beautiful work. I guess it's sort of the acoustic version of Fenders bolt on...neat!

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Dave Bland

remember...

"If it doesn't play in tune...it's just pretty wood"

All the stress of this neck is restrained by the lateral bolting plate that is cantalevered off the block I assume. seems to me that the string tension would over time bow the top inward and pull the neck up, with out restraint in the heel. Now if the cantalevered bolting plate is gusseted back to the block this would solve that. However that would add a good bit of weight. I think I would like it better with heel bolting as well. Great looking work, even if I don't like not having the heel tied to the block.MichaelP38474.5920833333

obviously, I don't know what's going on inside the guitar, but it seems like you could get a bolt into the "heel"
Now we have to see the structure that's supporting the neck from the inside. Build another, please!

Ferrington used the Fender attachment technique on his acoustics, bolting to the neck block.

There are photos of the inside on his website under Shop Photos. The middle picture appears to show braces that run from the side of the block to the waist. Jimmy, this appears to help with the tendencies of the block to tip forward. Is this correct? You are building Kasha style, I wonder how this would work on an X braced top.

Also, Jimmy, how is the neck adjusted in all dimensions and angles?
Scott Thompson38474.711412037

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Scott Thompson
Port Townsend,WA

"In a perfect world we'd all sing in tune
But this is reality so give me some room"
-Billy Bragg

Scott,

Here's a pic that might answer a lot of questions. This neck attachment is part of an overall bracing design. It works in tandem with the curved braces that come off the neck block and tie into the sidea at the waist. The curved braces have a carbon fiber center and are attached to both the top and the sides, and are further reinforced by the flying brace that comes off the top. All these things counteract the tendency for the neck to deform the top.



On x-braced guitars the neck block is identical, but it just butts up to the upper transverse brace. Here's a pic of the pieces. Note there is a hole bored in the block for a bolt about 2/3 of the way down on the neck block.



It's not an adjustable joint. It's either on or off.
Hope this helps.

Jimmy

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Jimmy Caldwell
http://www.caldwellguitars.com

Very "kasha-isk" Beautiful work Jimmy!

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Dave Bland

remember...

"If it doesn't play in tune...it's just pretty wood"

Thanks Jimmy,

I really appreciate you taking the time to post the pictures, and the explanation. Pictures help to understand what you are talking about.

Thanks again.

Jeff

How does it sound? It looks impressive, wonderful workmanship. I (being a newby) would assume that a heel tightly butted up against the body, would be integral to transmission of vibration from the body to the neck. But if there's a gap there, wouldn't this have a dampening effect? Not knocking your design, just trying to understand what it might tell us about sound transmission through the guitar.

Cheers,

Paul

there is plenty of contact through the structure under the top. I think the joint itself could use a little re-engineering, but the workmanship is outstanding.