Official Luthiers Forum!

Just spotted this on the Oz Woodworking forum that is run by the manufacturer of Ubeaut Hard Shellac.

Better jump in quick !!!

Cheers

Bob


Quote

"U-Beaut Polishes Hard Shellac - A small supply of this brilliant product is now available in the USA.

After receiving many requests for it from US guitar makers, I have finally sent 5 dozen bottles to our US agents. This is only a trial run to see how it is accepted.

Purchase from next Monday 12th February (until sold out) only available from:

PENN STATE INDUSTRIES
2800 Comly Road, Philadelphia, PA 19154
Local phone: 215 676-7609 Fax: 215 676-7603
Toll-Free: 800 377-7297 Orders only
Web Site: http://www.pennstateind.com/ - E-mail: psind@pennstateind.com

There are only 60 x 500ml bottles available and they will sell fast so get in early or you will most likely miss out.

Cheers - Neil"

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Bob Connor
Geelong, Australia

Thanks for the update...I am dying to try it and having a US source is a big plus for me.

I hope the results will be good and lead to continued shipments.

We had a couple of threads on this back in 2005. I know that David Bland was able to get his hands on it and gave it a try. However, I don't remember him ever posting a final review (seems it looked good but he was waiting to test the hardness).

OH DAVID, WHERE ARE YOU!!!!!

Anyway, thanks for the post as I have been wanting to give it try as well.

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Don Atwood
Arlington, VA

Comes in a plastic premixed bottle Hesh. The shellac is harder and more durable . I've used it . It has additives (secret formula ). Takes a fair while to cure !

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CRAIG LAWRENCE of AUSTRALIA
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Per the Ubeaut website:

Ever wished you had a finish that was as easy to use as shellac but with the durability of polyurethane? Well wish no more, because here it is.

This unique Hardened Shellac creates a film with a high resistance to heat, water and alcohol, yet it is used in exactly the same was as any normal shellac. It can be applied with a rubber as French polish, brushed, sprayed and dipped.

HOW IS THIS POSSIBLE?
After shellac has been dissolved in ethanol* it is possible to introduce additives that cause the shellac to cross link after it has dried. This cross linking takes about 20 days to completely cure, less in hot weather.

The only negative I see is the time to full cure and I am not sure if it can be reapplied in the same way a french polish shellac finish can.

Cure time is around 20 days but you can accelerate this with higher temperatures.

The attraction is that it is resistant to water and alcohol staining.

Heaps of furniture restorers are using it here in Oz for horizontal surfaces on tables, sideboards etc.

There is also no need to thin it unless you want to.

We've been spraying two undiluted coats. I belive PaulB form Sydney is doing the same.

Cheers

Bob

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Bob Connor
Geelong, Australia

To our OZ friends...Since it's crosslinked, I wonder how repairable the finish is as well as other issues. I would be reluctant to try this on a guitar before hearing of others' findings specifically related to FP.

The feature of being alcohol and water resistant, however, is appealing!

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JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com

Man, I love this stuff. Does take a while to fully harden, but once it does it buffs up to a great shine. I've french polished with it and sprayed it. Spraying is just a faster way of putting it down and I'm not very good at FP. Either way works just as well.

You US guys want to jump on this and snap yourself up a couple of bottles.

[QUOTE=JJ Donohue] To our OZ friends...Since it's crosslinked, I wonder how repairable the finish is as well as other issues. I would be reluctant to try this on a guitar before hearing of others' findings specifically related to FP.

The feature of being alcohol and water resistant, however, is appealing! [/QUOTE]

It's just as repairable as normal FP. It doesn't seem any different to except for the increased durability.

That should read:

It's just as repairable as normal FP. It doesn't seem any different to ordinary FP, except for the increased durability.

I miss that edit button....

They refuse to say whats in it? I'd be quite hesitant to ever use something on my guitars that the manufacturer won't disclose the ingredients of. If thats the case, I'm surprised anyone is using it at all.

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Instagram: @jfrenchluthier
Web: https://www.jfrenchguitars.com/

[QUOTE=PaulB] It's just as repairable as normal FP.[/QUOTE]
It can't be, can it? If it's alcohol-resistant a repair application won't "burn in" like it does with a basic shellac/alcohol mix. In fact, it sounds a lot like varnish. Comments?   

What Carlton said...he's a wise man.

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JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com

I just completed my order with them. I am the first one in the US to order it. They actually made up a product ID number while I was on the phone with them. For anyone who is interested, it is item code: PKWAXHS

I plan to do some testing with it as soon as I get it. I'll report back then. Any particulars I should test for? I'll just be doing some french polishing with it.
-j.

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“If God dwells inside us like some people say, I sure hope He likes enchiladas, because that's what He's getting”
-jack handy

J...I'll take a shot of some characteristics I'd be interested if seeing:

1) How does it lay down a build compared to a 1# cut shellac. Can it be thinned with ETOH.

2) Does the pad "feel" any different from the shellac

3) Does it stick like an almost depleted shellac pad and does a drop of oil restore the glide.

4) Do you see the tell-tale vapor trail

5) How long do you need to wait between sessions. How many sessions are required to produce a similar thickness to the shellac.

6) Is the surface smooth or are there ridges.

7) Can it be leveled using 1000 grit.

8) How long does it take to dry compared to shellac

9) Is spiriting off with ETOH possible to remove any oil.

10) After curing out for the 20 days, is it possible to reactivate the surface with ETOH...can it be repaired.

11) Sratch resistance after curing

12) Alcohol and water resistance after curing

13) Shine compared to shellac...can it be buffed

14) Any crazing or cracking after freezing and then immediately brought up to RT.

Others may have more questions.

Thanks for doing this J...looking forward to your evaluation.

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JJ
Napa, CA
http://www.DonohueGuitars.com

Has anyone thought of emailing Neil at Ubeaut with questions about the product? Neil is very approachable and helpful with any queries.

No problem. I hope to see if Robbie O'Brien can give me a hand with it for a more expert opion on the "feel" of the applications as well.
I did contact the U-Beaut people for some preliminary anwers to some of those very questions. Hopefully I'll hear from them and I'll be able to at least make some sort of practical judgement about it.
-j.

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“If God dwells inside us like some people say, I sure hope He likes enchiladas, because that's what He's getting”
-jack handy

I emailed Neil last night to see if he'll jump on board and answer any questions.

He's only about five minutes away from me so if he doesn't respond in a few days I'll drop in to the factory and see if I can twist his arm.

I've never met the bloke but I've heard he's a nice guy so I'm hoping we'll be able to get him to jump in here with some answers for us soon.

Cheers

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Bob Connor
Geelong, Australia

Bob,

Im having trouble logging into the Ubeaut Woodworking forums. Have you been able to log in ok? Might be because Im using Firefox on a Mac..sometimes it doesnt seem to like the site.

Cheers Martin

Thanks, Bob. One other thing I'm particularly interested in with regards to repairability...
Later on down the road, can it be repaired with regular shellac if the owner or shop doesn't know about this magic U-Beaut concoction...
-j.

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“If God dwells inside us like some people say, I sure hope He likes enchiladas, because that's what He's getting”
-jack handy

I'm just giving this a bump as I spoke with Neil Ellis today and I'm hoping he might chime in with some answers to everyones questions.

Cheers

Bob

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Bob Connor
Geelong, Australia

I got a bottle of hard shellac yesterday and will use it for a french polish job on the next classical I build. Will post results of same in a month or so.