Official Luthiers Forum!

I just recieved my neck angle jig from luthiertool.com (wish I would have known Tracy was working on making these in the near future), but I do have to say that this jig is very stable and well made.

Does anyone have any directions for the use of this (or even the Woolson jig).

Most everything is self explanitory, but I'm struggling with understanding how to set the neck angle correctly. Do I just put the straightedge template in place, note the location on the dial indicator and then insert the body and adjust to where the indicator comes back out "X" amount to resemble the bridge and saddle?

I can take pictures tonight and post them if they would help.

Thanks in advance for your help.

_________________
Thanks,
Blain

http://www.ullrichguitar.com

"89.67% of all statistics are made up on the spot."

Wow, looks nice but sure expensive....

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Peter M.
Cornerstone Guitars
http://www.cornerstoneukes.com

Expensive is a matter of your viewpoint. If the tool does the job well, it
just might be very cost-effective. I just bought this little hand sander, and
it seems expensive, until you use it every day:

http://www.windstoneeditions.com/alberti-design/sander.html

The magnetic disc is the key to this item - instantly replaceable so
changing grits is lighting fast.

Cheers,

Frank Ford
FRETS.COM
Gryphon Stringed Instruments[/
URL">
My Home
Shop Pages

_________________
Cheers,

Frank Ford

FRETS.COM
HomeShopTech
FRETS.NET

Expensive is a matter of your viewpoint. If the tool does the job well, it
just might be very cost-effective. I just bought this little hand sander, and
it seems expensive, until you use it every day:


Alberti Sander


The magnetic disc is the key to this item - instantly replaceable so
changing grits is lighting fast.

Cheers,

Frank Ford
FRETS.COM
Gryphon Stringed Instruments[/
URL">
My Home
Shop Pages

_________________
Cheers,

Frank Ford

FRETS.COM
HomeShopTech
FRETS.NET

hmmm... never saw this one before. but it appears to be an extremely expensive(and you have to buy the templates separately) and over engineered way of do exactly the same job as paul woolsons jig adaptation. at that price they should include an operator to run the thing.

the body should always be routed at right angles to the side/block.

the dial indicator appears to replace the bolt for reading the body and setting the required angle at which to route the neck.

if you go back into the archives you can read the posts on the woolson fig and you should then understand how to use yours.

It was expensive. No doubt about that, but as Frank said, if it get's the job done and gets it's use, it could very well be worth it.

If available, I probably would have bought the Woolson type, but I do think this one is made very well and should provide years of use. And the one thing that i like that the Woolson model doesn't appear to have, is that the guitar body can be mounted onto the jig as well.

Thanks Michael, I'll check the archives to see if I can find what I need.

_________________
Thanks,
Blain

http://www.ullrichguitar.com

"89.67% of all statistics are made up on the spot."

Wow! That's a lot of $$ for something you could make for $25 and a weekend. Oh, well. Why not contact them to have them explain it to you? For that kind of money there should be a little customer service included (also an instruction sheet).

Frank Ford, thanks for the link, I need one of those!

Paul, big hint, look at the clamps on the Alberti website. Also, think about
violinmakers who are a big market.

Oops sorry Paul, I was thinking of Watkins...nevermind. But I just did buy a
dozen crappy cam clamps made by Shop Fox from Grizzly and I wished you
had made them.

the woolson jig is very readily adapted to hold the body for routing as well, and will also last for years in a single builder situation. perhaps in a factory where they are building a couple thousand a year no, but for a hand builder doing >50> a year, it would last for years.

sorry, i can't see the value. even the dial indicator could be incorporated in the jig for less than $15.

Blain,

I've seen those jigs in person they are very classy, once you figure it all out, I'm sure it will serve you well for as long as you are building guitars. Write Tracy I'm sure he'll be able to help you.

Greg

_________________
Gwaltney Guitars

I agree with Michael, that looks like overkill for its intended use. I built mine using the Woolson plans and it probably didn't cost me $25.00. Really nicely machined jig though....

_________________
Dave Rector
Rector Guitars

I just look at it as in investment for the hobby. Just like all the other tools that I've had to buy.

I do think I've got it figured out now. The straight edge jig clamps to the same plane that the neck clamps to, but it extends up to the dial indicator. From there I can center the indicator and zero it out. This is the same plane that the neck is in minus the fingerboard thickness. Once I mount the top in the jig, I should be able to adjust the neck angle to get the compensation that I want for the saddle. Or maybe I need to mount the guitar in first, zero it out and then adjust the neck angle from there (just backwards of what I previously said)....

I'll play with it a bit, but I think now it's just a matter of trial and error and getting a feel for the jig.

I certainly would have liked to give Tracy my business on this, but I wasn't aware until afterwards that he was in the process of making such a thing. Tracy will definitely have my business for the additional radius dishes that I still need to purchase. I've just been sitting here with my guitar at the same stage for so long (nervous to do any cutting of the mortise and tenon after hearing about the difficulty in neck setting) and got a nice bonus from work so it only seemed right to make the purchase.



I haven't seen the Woolson in person, but I can say that this one is definitely nicely machined and everything fits together very nicely. I think once I get used to it and don't have to reference the manual for everything it'll be a breeze to use.

_________________
Thanks,
Blain

http://www.ullrichguitar.com

"89.67% of all statistics are made up on the spot."

For those who are interested in seeing the setup. The first picture is with the straight edge that resembles the neck plane as it would extend to above the saddle (where the dial indicator is). The second picture is with the guitar mounted in the jig with the dial indicator on the centerline of where the saddle will be.

_________________
Thanks,
Blain

http://www.ullrichguitar.com

"89.67% of all statistics are made up on the spot."

[QUOTE=Pwoolson] Wow! That's a lot of $$ for something you could make for $25 and a weekend. Oh, well. Why not contact them to have them explain it to you? For that kind of money there should be a little customer service included (also an instruction sheet).
[/QUOTE]

That's my point....

_________________
Peter M.
Cornerstone Guitars
http://www.cornerstoneukes.com

Guys, why rain on someone's parade? Blain has gotten a cool new tool/toy, he is excited, and he wants to learn more about it. Let's share some useful knowelge rather than talking about how silly it is for someone to spend more than $25 for this tool. Looking at the machining work, I can see why it costs that much. It is a precision machine.

the only time the dial indicator comes into use is as in the second photo. it sets the angle for the neck holder. then you remove the body and the neck is clamped in and the tenon is routed.

i can't see how the first photo is relevant to anything.

the jig has nothing to do with compensation, or the top other than as part of the body as a whole when it measures and sets the angle for routing the tenon.

I wish I could tell from the photos how the thing works.

It has a motor somewhere, right?

_________________
Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.

That was a reply to Franks's post of the sander.

Why is it we can't edit anymore? I've asked this three times now. If it's a secret, please say so, so I can stop asking.

_________________
Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.

Thanks Microsmurf, I appreciate that.

It seems that the topic of this post has changed from how to set up the neck angle correctly to "would you pay more than $25 for this tool?". To each his own is what the latter comes down to, but I was merely looking for everyone's help in how they accomplish setting up for the neck angle using this tool or a similar tool.

The first picture was to demonstrate the straight edge jig that I'm using to resemble the plane of the neck surface and how the dial indicator reads this surface as well as the face of the guitar. I think it's perfectly relevant to show this as it's part of the process.

Thanks again Microsmurf for understanding.

_________________
Thanks,
Blain

http://www.ullrichguitar.com

"89.67% of all statistics are made up on the spot."

Blain, my appologies for my previous post. You are very right, to each his own. The main point I was making is that the company that makes the jig should indeed supply you with the information you will need to use it. I don't think anyone else here has one so we would likely be guessing as to how it works.

in use this jig does not "read the the neck surface". the dial indicator arm is used to set the neck holder angle so that the neck can be clamped in and then routed such that the cheeks will match the angle between the side/block and the top. the setting you put on the dial indicator is to simulate the thickness of your bridge and where you want the extended plane of the neck's fingerboard gluing surface to intersect the bridge.

in any event, i do hope you get your $900+ worth of value and utility out of your purchase. i is an impressive bit of engineering design, as it should be.

No worries guys. Thanks.

The company did supply about 22 pages of instructions that covers the set up of the jig and basic procedural instructions.
"Place the body in and set the bridge/saddle location"
"place the straight edge jig in...."
It does not go into detail the measurements that I should use,and I think this is probably something that changes from guitar to guitar and depending on your bridge or saddle height so I'm not sure if I should really expect this to be in the instruction. Or should I? The instructions do cover in great detail how to set up the jig and how to properly use each of the adjustments, templates, and so on.

I don't want to give the impression that this company does not provide good customer service, because that's not the case. They gave me instructions on how to use the jig. I had a couple of questions and thought I would come to you all for some help. The maker of this jig has been great. They sent me the instructions before I bought the jig so that I could decide for myself if I wanted to purchase it and they've answered any questions that I've had for them. I was even contacted to let me know that I will be recieving a cutaway attachment as an upgrade at no additional charge once they are complete. Sure one could argue, that I pretty much already paid for the cutaway attachment, but I think that they could have also just as easily not have told me about it, saved their money and made it an available item for me to purchase at an additional charge. So please don't think that they're leaving me high and dry to figure this out for myself.

Everything was clear to me except for how to precisely set the angle at which to route the tenon. I think I've got a pretty good understanding as to how this should be done now. I want the neck plane (or the flat straight edge) distance from the top face to be (bridge thickness) - (fingerboard thickness + fret height.)
So that with the Fret board and frets installed, it will just skim the top of the bridge. At least this is my understanding of the process.

Thanks again guys.

_________________
Thanks,
Blain

http://www.ullrichguitar.com

"89.67% of all statistics are made up on the spot."

What a timely post! I was going to ask similar questions.
I hope Blain doesn't mind me hitch hiking along on his thread.
I recently built a Woolson (Fox inspired?) mortise & tennon jig. (I set mine up to cut the body mortise as well as the neck tennon.)
Since the OLF was out of plans, I wasn't able to get the instructions with the jig.
I think I have the basic function figured out, but I need some advice about the length of the saddle location pin.
If I have this figured correctly, the space at the saddle location should be twice the string height at the twelfth fret. Is that right? The first guitar I'm setting up for is a 12 fret sorta "OM" style. With a 14 fretter, it'd be a bit more difficult to figure.
I'd like to know if I'm on the right track??????????
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance,   Dan