Official Luthiers Forum!

Don,

Here's a completely different opinion. You can't control how he will feel about the guitar or price, and I find it hard to believe he will appreciate the guitar more by pricing it higher. So, I recommend you work the deal with the goal of making yourself happy, especially since you retired from building. How do you do this? Well, it's a proven scientific fact that the more you are paid to build, the lower your intrinsic satisfaction is going to be. You will feel like you are a slave to the almighty dollar again, and isn't that why you retired in the first place? I would charge him the cost of materials, plus the normal labor rate for a standard family build. When we work really hard at something, we aren't always expecting equal compensation. Sometimes we work hard at things just for the experience and the satisfaction of doing a job well done. If you want to feel great about yourself during the entire build, give him a great deal, but also know you are doing something worthy for a 'brother' and you will both be happy in the longrun. After all, years down the road when you're looking back on your life, you're not going to be wishing you charged this 'brother' more money, you're going to sit back and be proud of this great thing you did for a friend, and he will also likely appreciate what a great thing this friend did for him. I think if you charge full market rate, you will be stressing yourself the entire time thinking "am I charging too much?", and "am I putting a price on friendship?", and "does he think I'm charging too much for a friend?", etc. You get the picture. Charge him full price and it's the same as any other principal-agent relationship, it's just another transaction driven by money.

Cheers!

John

Umm . . . Do you actually want to do all that pearl purfling?

_________________
Howard Klepper
http://www.klepperguitars.com

When all else fails, clean the shop.

Howard,

The question is a good one. I would love to do it, but if I build this guitar, I might farm out that part. A good friend of mine is trying hard to make a living full-time at building guitars, and he could use the work. Plus, he's done a bunch of -45's, having worked for a prominant high-end builder.

John,

The reason I "retired" was more burn-out. Besides, "retirement" is such a misunderstood word.
In my case, it means "I'm done for good!.....until I really feel like getting back at it again with a passion.". Follow? Come on....which one of us will ever fully retire from this?

_________________
"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

   I do build these and if you are doing a stock 45 with the hex or snowflakes then you better go 7 . If you want the custom with the pearl up the neck ad at least $25 an inch. on the fret board and $40 and inch up the neck and headstock
     IF you ever wrestled with all the binding then setting all the pearl you are looking at about 100 to 150 hours of work.
BRW $800 ( medium grade )
Adi top (150)
pearl top, back and side 280 inch (200)
standard inlay      (125 )
kerf $32
   Adi braces     $20
   binding   $20 side bw/tef/wb
   bridge $75 inlaid with flake or dot
   Tree of life ( $$$$$
   gold grovers $399
see it does add up fast
   I don't think $7000 is an unfair price and that is a good discount as you are giving him a $9000 guitar so think of it as a $2000 gift you are giving him.
john hall
blues creek guitars

Don,
I suspect your friend knows you pretty well. I doubt that he would ask you to build him a super deluxe guitar with all the trimmings if he weren't willing to pay for it. If he specified all those features, he probably knows what they are worth. My guess is that he's trying to help rekindle the luthierie flame in you because he knows how much you love it. This commission sounds more like a gift from him than a gift from you. Accept this gift in the spirit that it is intended.

You are going to spend the better part of a year on this instrument. I've seen your work and I know that you can make a guitar that would be considered a bargin even at the going rate for a 45. I think that your friend wants to spend the big bucks on this guitar. He trusts you to make him the guitar of his dreams. You can, and should, do this. Charge him $9000. That is a 10% discount from what you should charge a stranger. 10% is enough to show you care but not so much that you would be taking away to gift that your friend is trying to give to you by supporting your luthierie.

I can't tell you folks how much your input has meant to me with this. It is hard to balance all this stuff, and do what you feel is right. While I'm in this more for the love of the instrument than for the money, it is as many have said a significant amount of work involved, especially if I end up doing the inlay myself. That would be a fun challenge for sure. I'm going to endeavor to strike a balance between time and money and friendship, and whatever decision I make, I will be able to live comfortably with, thanks to you good folk.
I told one of the OLF'ers via PM, that we will strike a balance between how much he wants to pay me, and how little I want to charge.

BTW, I got a commission this past week...a Smiley-Uke - the Deluxe version. I love my uke!

_________________
"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

My advice, convince him to lose the -45. The trim is the most time consuming for you so you stand to lose the most cash on it. You can always reduce the price of braz. without losing cash, but the time for a -45 is the real kicker.

[QUOTE=Don Williams] I got a commission this past week...a Smiley-Uke - the Deluxe version.[/QUOTE]
Would that be an SU-45, with BRW?

No, it would be some killer Taz Blackwood...no crazy stuff like shell.



He doesn't want to lose the stye 45 stuff. He really likes it. I wouldn't even try to convince him, since that is what his heart is set on.

_________________
"I want to know what kind of pickups Vince Gill uses in his Tele, because if I had those, as good of a player as I am, I'm sure I could make it sound like that.
Only badly."

[QUOTE=pakhan] My advice, convince him to lose the -45. The trim is the most time consuming for you so you stand to lose the most cash on it. You can always reduce the price of braz. without losing cash, but the time for a -45 is the real kicker.[/QUOTE]

No offense pakhan, but that is a good way to loose customers. Even though doing a 45 style would be incredibly time consuming, tying to convince a customer to lose it would IMO be a sure fire way of loosing a customer.

Good for you Don, I'm sure you will both be happy when it's all said and done. Congrats on the HFU, I too like that instrument.

_________________
My Facebook Guitar Page

"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson