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Hey,

I just wanted to share what may be common method with custom fretboard inlays, but is new to me.  I have not done this much (These are my second attempts on my first two guitars) but I found that inlaying the pearl slightly deeper than the radiused surface and then flooding out the surface with CA glue eliminated much of the anticipation and likelihood of sand-through.

When using dremel routers and handcut inlay from unsurfaced shell, doing it this way removed several very difficult to control variables.

Thanks

Stephen 

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www.ziegenfussguitars.com

Nice Hummers Stephen, thanks for sharing.

You have some great material there, fantastic.

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http://www.dickeyguitars.com

Stephan,

Thanks for sharing this tip. I'm just starting to attempt inlay- only my initial and the fingerboard markers so far, nothing as complex as your's.

Beautiful

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Gene

Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason- Mark Twain

Great lookin inlay ! Looks like you have been doing it for years

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Reguards,

Ken H

Question, Stephen:

Are you saying that it is the CA that is flush with the surface of the fret board? And that the shell is actually a smidgeon below the surface of the board? That should work, I'd think, IF you polish up that CA. Seems to me--if I've stated your scenario correctly--that you'd need that stuff optically clear to not dull the look of the pearl.

I once bought some Paua blanks from a lapidary store just to find that the majority of the blank was some polymer coating (of some sort) bonded to a thin veneer of Paua. But it was so highly polished that it looked like a solid piece.

And by the way, those hummers are very nice!

Steve

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From Nacogdoches...the oldest town in Texas.

http://www.stephenkinnaird.com

Excellent work Steve! Will you be bringing them over this weekend for a closer look

L

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Lance@LuthiersForum.com

Steve Kinnaird,

Yes, I did lay the pearl a smidgeon below the surface of the fretboard.  I followed Larry Robinsons method of cutting and shaping each piece individually, and then gluing them together in their patterned places on wax paper on top of the pattern on top of the fretboard.  This gave me 5 solid inlay pieces out of the original 34.  Then I routed the cavity slightly proud and laid the pearl in...I flooded it with CA glue in stages, and then leveled off it off flush with the board...

But you are right, the CA will require more buffing than if it was just pearl, but I will gladly do that and remove the awful possibility of sanding through another inlay...in fact, I am quite good at sanding through inlays if anybody needs any advice on how to do that...It is quite easy really...

 

Thanks

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www.ziegenfussguitars.com

Yeah...I'm real good at sand-thru's as well

Greg

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Gwaltney Guitars

[QUOTE=Ziegenfuss] ...in fact, I am quite good at sanding through inlays if anybody needs any advice on how to do that...It is quite easy really...
[/QUOTE]

Ooooh, another tutorial in the making!
Though, like yourself, I'm pretty good at this too.
Some things in lutherie seem to come naturally, don't they?

Steve

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From Nacogdoches...the oldest town in Texas.

http://www.stephenkinnaird.com

It always seems to be the tasks that occur after hours of laborious setup to get to the position that you are currently in...pleasant- quite really, the way things work...

Very Cool

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www.ziegenfussguitars.com

I'm not sure where I heard this quote, but it goes something like this,

"Experience is something you get right after you needed it"

On another note, Steve, how do you suspect the CA will hold up as a FB surface? Will it dull over time, with the strings rubbing on it?

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Lance@LuthiersForum.com

Lance, am I the "Steve" you are questioning?
You talkin to me?

Anyway, I will add a couple of cents here, just to say good thought---valid concern. That hadn't even entered my mind.
But it does now. I think you are right, Lance, and would feel more comfy with the shell itself taking the string wear.

Steve

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From Nacogdoches...the oldest town in Texas.

http://www.stephenkinnaird.com

Hi Steve, not you, this was for SteveZ, maybe we should call him Ziggy

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Lance@LuthiersForum.com

Hi Guys

I have been watching this thread and I feel that now is the time

Stephen - first- those are great first efforts. You should be proud. They are way better than my very first ones.

second- glue as a surface is a negative, CA will thin, shrink, develop cracks, and change color over time- even in the bottle, so as a surface it's wearability over a large surface area is negative in my opinion. Small bits here and there fine- but over a few fret spaces- I would rather not. The shell should be at the surface. The problem you are fixing is creating another potential problem.

You also can't engrave CA very well, it will develop flare outs and white areas due to pressure, so you really want to keep it to just a glue and a gap filler.

Shell may crack overtime as well, but at least it will wear harder than most woods. Plastics wear relatively well too, same with recon stone.

Dealing with sand throughs is actually very easy.
What those of you getting sand throughs are most likely NOT doing is checking your inlay against the radius at varying stages- making sure to compensate for the thinnest material. You should be able to look at the inlay after it's cut and assembled and lay it against the board and see potential problems. I have only had sand throughs (shell=GONE)- you know- I never have had a sand through... Just a possible little bit of one once when I first started- but it's not because I have any special ability at it- it's because I check, then check again, then re-check everything constantly. Many times I am inlaying in reverse over a radius as well, so I need to really check for the deepest depth, keeping the thinnest material at the surface so it doesn't sand through at the deepest part. Now I have had sub-level glue left over on top a few times, meaning the pearl piece (in a multi piece inlay) was a little lower than the rest- which is what Stephen seems to be shooting for here. The problems with that are as I stated before. Color off- etc.. Also- I use ebony dust as a fill in small gaps, so any dust particles getting into the glue HAVE to be sanded away.
If not they will be there forever. Little black bits all over certain pieces of shell, while others stay clean.

If your having sand throughs check your pattern first- if it's not good re-design your pattern- then start over again. There is a limit to shell ark over the radius, but it's visible from underneath.

I hope this didn't sound like a rant. I know how I get..



Craig Lavin
www.handcraftinlay.com

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www.handcraftinlay.com

Thanks Craig.

That makes very much sense.  Part of this was me not wanting to face the possibility of sanding through again, as I did with my first attempts.  For some reason, even though I glued up the inlays on the radiused neck, I make the mistake in the cavity routing.  I either rout the crown to deeply or the edges to thinly.  The former creates a fretboard that is too thin, the latter sands through on the inlay edges. 

I will certainly pay significantly more attention next time and try to get the pearl and the FB to match in all manner of the radius.

To be honest:  I did not even think about FB wear.  Obviously the pearl would fair much better than the glue...Things to do next time I suppose.  I think that it would just be too disheartening to start again, but so this hobby goes, I guess...

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www.ziegenfussguitars.com

Start over, Oh heck no!

Just a tip for your "Next"
We all know there WILL be a next. Ive yet to see ONE person stop after just one, you have three going! Id say your pretty much sucked in to Lutherie beyond hope.

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Lance@LuthiersForum.com

Lance,

what would you say would be the thinnest FB crown dimension at its last fret that would still be safe to work with.

I could remove the CA glue from the top with probably about 0.01" removal of the current leveled surface.  But I feel as though I am already thin.  I will show it to you next time I swing by.  You can help me decide then.

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www.ziegenfussguitars.com

at different places depending on where you think it would be deeper on the board?

Set the router to the depth of the thinnest piece and that's it. The depth of the route shouldn't change- it's all based on the layout of the materials.

Good luck.

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www.handcraftinlay.com

I feel as though I may not be getting the router bit to perpendicularly hit the fretboard tangent at every spot across the pattern.  But again, it goes back to what you said about checking and re-checking all the time.  I must not have been enough attention to detail.

 

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www.ziegenfussguitars.com