Official Luthiers Forum!

Some of you may remember my thread a while back where I posted pics of my shop tour of Lowden. I ordered a Lowden while I was there and it's supposed to be ready sometime in August-ish. It'll be a small bodied S-25 custom with an LS redwood top.

I ordered it with a Fishman Matrix Blend at George's suggestion. That's the one with the under-the-saddle pickup and a soundhole mic with onboard controls at the edge of the soundhole.

The more I research and think about it, I think I'd like to switch to a different pickup system. 95% of the time I'll be playing at church with drums behind me and a wedge monitor at my feet, and I can foresee all kinds of feedback problems with the soundhole mic.

I'm kicking around the idea of switching to a K&K bridgeplate transducer system, or maybe an I-beam or some such thing.

Any other suggestions? Or should I just stick with the Fishman?

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Jonathan Kendall, Siloam Springs AR

Ha ha...

That's very helpful to know about your friend's H&D. I just hadn't been able to find that many reviews of it. I'd be curious to know if he's happy with how it sounds. Would you mind passing along the question, or perhaps you could PM me his email (with his permission of course)?

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Jonathan Kendall, Siloam Springs AR

I have a K & K in my grand concert I built, and I play in church too. About 85 dB on stage. (Full band)and it gets "woofy". I can stand back from the amp a little and be okay, or put a soundhole cover in it...but it's more feedback prone than my "pre-pickup" era Taylor which I installed a Fishman under saddle pickup.

I like the puity of the pickup sound. I hear that B Band pickups do a great job too.

EDIT:

I love the purity of the K & K pickup. I bought mine from Bruce Dickey.

im not exactly sure how similar they are, but i have an lr baggs... i believe it was called the "double barrel" a handful of years ago when i bought it. it is an under saddle paired with a soundhole mic. as far as sound goes, i think it does a great job of amplifiing what i think is quite an amazing guitar. i have played in plenty of full band sunday morning type worship settings and had no problems with it. the great thing is with the right cable (i believe it is a TRS - tip/ring/sleeve) you can mix the signal from both pickups to get the sound just right. which also means you can just do away with the mic all together. i hope that helps some.

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sweat the small stuff.

Sounds like my fears about feedback may be unfounded. The Matrix Blend system has an onboard preamp control that sits on the inside of the soundhole and will do the mixing right there, so no need for anything external to blend the signals.

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Jonathan Kendall, Siloam Springs AR

excellent

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sweat the small stuff.

Hey John,

I installed a K and K Sound Trinty Western (the bridge plate patches and soundhole mic) on a friend/customers guitar that he uses in his original music folk/rock band. He LOVES it! The great thing about K and K is that the pre-amp (and battery) are external so you add almost no weight to the guitar (aren't we always trying to cut weight in these things?). He mounts his pre-amp to his mic stand so he can adjust as he wants and can actually see what he is doing! AND they are stereo so you can adjust the mic and the patches independantly.

If you choose this route I am sure that George can get them directly from K and K or a number of us on this forum are distributors as well.

Good luck with your choice!

Shane

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Canada

I put the K&K in the Lowden that George custom built for me...walnut and LS redwood. It plays in church and the system is flawless. You will get the most accurate reproduction of the guitar, IMHO.

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Hank Mauel

I agree with Hank, it's accurate reproduction. Be aware that if you're a percussive player, and thump the top or bridge, it'll pick that up more than a peizo would. Can be advantageous to your style, or annoying. Just be aware. It can be eq'd out if necessary, but I've been very happy with the amazing accuracy of my Pure Western system. I may go for a K & K system with a mic added next time, but I'm pretty happy with what I have

This has probably been posted here previously at one time or another, but there is a site with a series of VERY in-depth, well-controlled and well-documented comparison tests of various acoustic guitar transducers at: http://www.dougyoungguitar.com/pickuptest.htm. Harmony-Central also has a gigantic section of user-submitted reviews at http://reviews.harmony-central.com/reviews/Acoustic+Guitar+P ickup#manufacturer. You could read enough between these two sites to confuse yourself for life, I think. I came close to it myself.

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Rick Jones
Rochester Hills, MI
http://home.comcast.net/~rajones19

Hey Jon, I use a Baggs saddle pick-up, I can't remember the model, but it's the one that has the saddle attached to it. Then I go through the Baggs DI box, which has a couple of anti feedback settings that help a lot. Before you change your pick-up, try not having the mic pick-up on, and fiddle around with your pre-amp knobs, especially the mid frequencies, it might help. Also, get a soundhole cover too. Good luck. You probably have one of the best pick-up systems for acoustic that one can get. Alan.

Thanks for the advice guys. Rick, Doug Young's site is really helpful.

I think I'm leaning towards the Fishman afterall. I have a baggs I-beam (soundboard transducer) in my old Martin and it sounds great except it gets "woofy" (thanks for the nomenclature Terry) at higher volumes. I have a Fishman Matrix UST in my Larrivee and the tone's a little more controllable at high volume.

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Jonathan Kendall, Siloam Springs AR

Remember, Jon, that the Lowdens have a split saddle...two high strings on a small, separate saddle for intonation compensation. This may limit the pick up choices if you want top go "under saddle".

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Hank Mauel

Forgot to add that if George is installing it, it's a non issue, but if you wait till it's here, that could be a factor.

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Hank Mauel

I thought about that, he must get them supplied that way from Fishman. I'm planning on having him install it at the shop before he sends it. Which makes me lean towards getting the Fishman UST, because I can always install a standard K&K later if I'm just not happy at all with the Fishman. From the comments and reviews here and elsewhere, I think I'll probably be pleased with either one.

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Jonathan Kendall, Siloam Springs AR

I chose the Matrix Blend for my current favourite guitar (Sapele & Euro OM [ish] cutaway) & am really happy with it. I like the big warm sound of the mike, balanced with the thinner, trebly output from the piezo. The onboard controls let me select the ratio of mike to transducer that sounds best to me in any situation. The volume control is super handy too.
I did have bad feedback problems on one installation (a boomy maple bodied Taylor dred)& found that positioning the mike further away from the back of the guitar fixed the problem completely.
My experience with this system is pretty limited, (And this is a highly subjective thing) but I sure like it better than any undersaddle or "dot" system I've tried to date.
Just one guy's opinion, but if Lowden is recommending the "Blend" system, I'd give it a good workout before rejecting the idea.