Official Luthiers Forum!

Several guys were discussing guitars this past weekend and we have coined a new word to discribe certain guitars. You will know one of these guitars when you see it or hear it. Use the term freely as needed.


ready???


here it is: GUITARBAGE

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Reguards,

Ken H

Very good Ken!

D.L. Huskey beat me to it, but I was going to say...."One man's guitarbage is another man's guitreasure."


Were there any instruments at the Miami show that fell into the "guitarbage" category that you'd like to share
with us. It didn't look like it from what I've been able to see so far.

Regards,
Kevin Gallagher/Omega Guitars

Right .. and when ones fruits are commonly referred to as guitarbage, luthenasia is in order .

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Tony Karol
www.karol-guitars.com
"let my passion .. fulfill yours"

When this term was born, we were talking about guitars that just didnt make the grade while building them. I know I have burned several guitars already, and aparently this is quite common with quality builders. One builder was talking about burning the guitars outside and a neighbor complaining because he thought they were good guitars. He told the neighbor he was just burning the garbage. That's when the term "guitarbage" came into play.

As far as commenting on the show guitars, I am much too humble to talk about other's work except to tell you the good qualities their guitars have. I will say this: Some guitars I was pleasantly surprised when I played them or heard them and others I was a tad bit dissappointed. I was not dissappointed in any builders guitars from this forum. Every single one of them were world class guitars and I am still in sensory overload from all of the sweet sounds I have heard for 4 days. Some of the builders had made some common mistakes, even mistakes that I have made in the past. Only another builder would be able to spot the mistakes made. Even with the mistakes, the guitars sounded good and my only concern is how long they will last before developing a belly. Some builders seemed more interested in their inlay work, which was impecable. I wish they had given more concern to the sound of the guitar. Each buyer and player has their own tastes though.

The compliments I kept hearing about my own guitars were on how well balanced they were and how well they projected. The only complaint I had was that the string spacing was too narrow and the action was a tad bit too high. I had purposly set the action of the strings a little high because of a request from one of the guys that was scheduled to play the guitar in a mini-concert. The string spacing and nut width are standard Martin Scale, so I guess a lot of people dont like Martins because of the nut width and string spacing?

One other thing I was surprised about is the number of people that came up to me telling me that I didnt know them, but they knew me. seems as though they are lurkers of this forum and never even registered with the forum. I wish they would register and join this great community of builders.

I heard at least one flamenco guitar that was an absolute cannon. It is amazing that that kind of quality sound and ear piercing volume can come from an acoustic guitar! Speaking of classicals, I got to see and play the cannon and piece of quality workmanship that our own Dave LaPlante did on the classical he posted pictures of on this forum. What a beauty!!

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Reguards,

Ken H

Jealousy, envy and all related terms enter my mind when I read your last post, Ken.

I need to go and sin no more.

Congrats to all who went to the show and sold some of thier "Guitreasures."

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Steve Walden
Aspiring Builder,
Bartlesville, OK

Ken,

Thanks for the reply. I knew that you would take the high road in response to my asking if there was any "guitarbage" at the show. I asked it with tongue in cheek. I've always been a strong believer in looking for and sharing the positive in anything built by other builders and then allowing others to make their own deduction as they look and play for themselves.

There are plenty of guys who walk around shows just looking for flaws, faults and mistakes on guitars so they can make themselves look better than they are by putting the builders down with them. It's sad and I've spoken with several builders who have fallen prey to their ignorant and self serving tactics. These guys have become well known among the builders who are more considerate and professional.

The funniest thing is that their guitars don't even hold a candle in quality to the ones that they are busy criticizing.

Regards and thanks again,
Kevin Gallagher/Omega Guitars

Thankfully, I only experienced one such person at the show. This guy walked around with a pick strumming a few chords as hard as he could until the strings buzzed. Then he said "Nice Buzz" and walked away. He didn't even give me time to point out that he was fretting the chord wrong. I think we will always meet people like this and it's a real shame.

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Don Sharp
Got Brazilian?
http://www.sharpguitars.com

Ken, perhaps I shouldn't consider exhibiting at shows - because if somebody was picking the heck out of my guitars to the point where they were buzzing and then said, "Nice Buzz." -- well, I would have quickly remarked, "Nice technique."

Simon:

You should exhibit as shows. It's an invaluable experience, definitely worth the time. These people are few and far between. The best thing to do is smile and say thanks, enjoy the show. At least that's how I handled it.

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Don Sharp
Got Brazilian?
http://www.sharpguitars.com

Simon,
I agree with Don that you should exhibit at shows. The experience is valuable on two fronts.

First, you get to be in the midst of players from all around the country and even around the world depending on the show. That
is always a great experience...in spite of the few idiots who happen to wandering around in the dark trying to make people feel like they know that they're talking about.

Second, you get to experience the guitars being built by other world class builders. There's no way you'll ever really know if your guitars are on par with what your competitors are building if you don't get some exposure to them. It is probably one of the most enlightening, challenging and inspiring things that any builder can experience.

Funny...back at the 1997 NAMM Show in Nashville, I had a guy do this exact thing as he waled into my booth and aggressively dug into the strings of each of the seven guitars guitars that I'd built for the show....all spec guitars and available for immediate sale. He had a complaint about each of the guitars and offered them in a ridiculously authoritative tone while his seemingly equally simple friend nodded in agreement.

My complete comfort with his remarks came from a very simple fact, though. Only and hour before his visit, I had sold the last of those seven guitars...and we were only half way through the first day of the show. I just told him, "You're going to have to hang that guitar back up, please. It's sold and the person who liked it enough to pay for it here at the show will pick it up from me when it's over."

Every builder experiences this kind of thing occasionally. We've all seen them express their negative opinions about guitars made in every venue from Kevin Ryan's beautiful and well tooled shop to the Asian production factories making the Esteban beauties....and every one in between. If it's a legit critique offered by someone in the know with the right attitude and motive, by all means, liste and apply what is applicable in it.

If it's just some player who exhibits obviously poor technique and then complains about a buzz or something to that effect, ignore it...and them and move on to someone who matters.

Regards,
Kevin Gallagher/Omega Guitars

Right Kevin!!

A legit critique is extremely helpful. One of the pros that demonstrated my guitars told me point blank what he did and didn't like about my instruments, and why.

This is what you need to hear. Many of the people you will deal with at a show will play your guitars and say nice, sweet, etc. That doesn't tell you much, except that they enjoyed playing it.

When someone comes along with constructive criticism, the key is to keep your ego in check, listen to what's being said, and take it all into consideration. Most of this person's comments were akin to maybe you should round this edge of your bridge because it hurts my hand to play in this certain position. In the end, I'm still making a custom instrument for the guy. And now I know exactly what he requires.

I believe that these sorts of critiques are essantial to refining or products and, ultimately, benefiting our businesses.

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Don Sharp
Got Brazilian?
http://www.sharpguitars.com

Those are spot on criticisims and are well taken here too. I make mistakes and have boo boo's too. The show guitars had a couple but you would have to be either another builder or an extremely well educated player to pick up on them. Those issues were very minor ones though. It tickled me to see someone actually finding them and pointing them out. I had a couple of other builders show me some of their flubs on their guitars, and it made me feel better to know I wasnt the only one who makes mistakes.

All in all it was a good show and the players were astonishing. I went all weekend and up until about 2 hours before the show closed before I heard the first rendition of stairway to heaven.

It gave me a good boost in respect for my own craftsmanship and the quality of my guitars also to be able to play other world class guitars for myself. There was a guy next to my booth who I had never heard of before who had a table full of parlor guitars. I was blown away at the tone and quality of those guitars. I'm going to have to build myself one and he has volunteered to help give guidance with the build. John How also had some awesome parlor guitars and I couldnt keep my eye off of one of them that had an oak colored sunburst top. Something about the look of that guitar was really appealing to me.

It was also good to get marketing tips from others who have been at this a lot longer than I have. Their guidance helped me tremendously and I am forever in debt to them for their help. I have never seen anything like this where people who are essentially in competition with each other are so generous and helpful. It was truely an amazing experience and I highly reccommend other luthiers to attend. The tips I recieved from them helped me to sell one of the guitars and take a commission on another one.

I am still getting emails and phone calls from the show.

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Reguards,

Ken H

those are not flub's and mistakes. those are design prototypes and decide not to do them again. that is what i have been taught some, my story and stickin to it.

"guitarbage" is what i specialize in. at least some days it feels that way. still there is the satisfaction that one is producing high quality, hand built firewood.

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Greg
http://garibaldiinstruments.com/