Official Luthiers Forum!

My father was a carpenter all his life. I am a teacher and, to his alternating amusement and annoyance, hopeless at DIY.

My dad died last year. He left me his tools, including a big toolbox of old carpenter's tools which were his grandfathers.

For lots of reasons, some obviously to do with my dad, I'd like to try to build a classical guitar - maybe, if necessary, starting with a kit like one of those available from that mercantile place (they ship to the UK) although my dad would think that was cheating...

My question is - am I being completely daft contemplating making a guitar with no woodworking skills at all? I don't want to start by making a shelf unit or coffee table or enrolling at a night school for basic carpentry - I want to make a guitar, and if that's not possible then I will say a silent prayer of thanks for my dad's life and move on with my own existing interests - two young kids, CG, bird watching etc. I assure you I won't be spiritually bereft if the consensus is that it is too much to ask to start from scratch and expect to make anything half decent!

Most of my dad's tools won't be any use for luthiery, (some will, I'm sure - hundreds of good quality chisels, long metal rules, clamps etc etc), but I think having them is reason enough to try to use them, even if only to give my dad a good laugh from wherever he's looking down on me...

SO: should I do it? Yes or no? If yes, where on EARTH do I start? Which books? Which tools? Kit or straight in to the real thing? And how long should it take me to make one, given my absolute woodworking incompetence, full time job and family duties (I figure on an hour to myself each day - but have to practice CG in that time too!).

All advice welcome!

Many thanks,

Sean

It is really up to you and no one else. If you want to build a guitar then do it. Starting guitar building with a kit is in no way cheating. It is like saying you are cheating if you don't start your football carreer in the Premier League. A kit is the absolute best way to start with the best chance of finishing a nice instrument. Get every book you can and read them before you do anything.

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http://www.booneguitars.com
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Hi Sean. The first book I bought was Tradition and Technology
By William Cumpiano and Jonathan Natelson. Go to stewmac.com or lmii.com on top of this page and you´ll find it there. this book is almost a must to have (I think) as it talks about things your mind will probably come across as you start building. and it is written so anyone can understand it "even with no woodworking experience" You said your dad left you with lots of tools, this is great chisels are a up in guitarbuilding. alse I would recommend getting a fingerplane search for "Ibex fingerplane" get the flat bottom one. I would guess you dad left you with some ´bigger planes ? like stanley 3, 4, or 5. you will need one of these or something to thickness the tops with. although you might consider to let some of the vendors thickness the top for you on the first build, this is all up to you ! do start with buying the cumpiano book. then as you have lookt at it a bit then write back here and we´ll go from there. as this book will let you know lots. "but it dont talk about building from kits" Also give mr John Hall at blues creek guitars a call the link is on top of this page. he will help you get the right parts for a kit together, and also help you on the way with thoughts etc.
if you have an interest in working with your hands, you will love guitarbuilding, it is very addicting.

Sincerely Lars.

Hi Sean,Welcome to the OLF.
A lot of guys have jumped right in without any woodworking experience and did well.
It will take you quite a while with so much to learn but I would start with a kit.
And go with Lars' suggestion for the Cumpiano book and many other good books.
Good advice to talk to John Hall at Bluescreek. He will set you up with a nice
kit to get you going.There will be some specialty tools for guitar building that
you will have to get or make also. Have fun and good luck with it .

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Anderson Guitars
Clearwater,Fl. 33755

Sean, there is no reason why you can't do this. And yes I would advocate starting with a kit. Its not cheating. There will still be plenty of challenges for you to contend with even with a serviced kit.

Do a search for Colin S and Waddy as authors. They both build classicals and their threads are a joy to read, as well as enlightening. Colin lives in your neck of the woods as well. He should be able to help direct you if you are looking for a more local supplier.

How are you set for planes and sharpening? Sharpening is a skill that can be a tab bit tricky to learn, but one you need to master. There is nothing more dangerous than attacking wood with a dull tool. Either you or the wood will suffer and even if there isn't any blood shed, it is frustrating to use a dull tool. I'd start by learning how to use a plane, a scraper and a chisel on cheap soft wood. That includes how to sharpen them. Once you are comfortable with that then dive into your kit.

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Aoibeann

.
If you think you are beaten,
You are.

If you think you dare not,
You don't.

If you'd like to win but think you can't
Its a cinch that you won't

If you think you'll lose,
You've lost.

For out in the world you'll find

Success begins with a fellows will...

Its' all in the state of mind.

..........................Annon.


Some of my best students were gung ho adolecents
Some of my worst were adults living in fear of failure.

So dude...whats it gonna be?
A door to a whole new world with new friends all over the planet egar and willing to help you build each and every step of the way, or a or braging wall of rusty old tool?

Think about it.

blessings
the
Padma

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Audiences and dispensations on Thursdays ~ by appointment only.


.

Earlier this summer I cleaned up an old engineers tool tool chest that belonged to my father. It's a handsome wooden box and I have it sitting on my workbench, with many of my luthier-related tools and materials tucked neatly in the felt lined drawers. Now, whenever I set out to work on a guitar, it's makes me think of my dad. It's nice. Yes, you should try to build a guitar. There is no downside.

Best regards,
George :-)

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George :-)

Sean,
Being "completely daft" hasn't stopped the others on this forum from building some fine instruments! I say go for it. Read & study as much as you can find on the subject. The internet is an amazing resource for this & forums, like this one, can't be beat for their moral support & knowledge base.

Good luck,
kev

Sean -

There's no downside to giving it a go. There are some great resources out there (see other post on good books for beginners). One caveat is that method and technique of classical building ican be different in some ways from steelstring building. You'll want to be clear that you're focused on classical building (if that's what you are) when looking for help/etc.

I've been at it for three years, and am still a novice in every sense of the word - even though I feel as if I've learned an enormous amount from this forum, the ASIA and GAL event's that I've attended, and books. I feel truly blessed to have come into this group of generous, passionate and slightly wacky people who build guitars. I hope you opt to join! I'm betting you won't regret it.

Thanks for all the comments. I asked the same question on Delcamp too and I have had some great advice from both forums...
I am going to buy the cheap LMI kit and have a bash. If I don't do it, I'll never know, will I? I will read a lot first (just ordered a load of books from the library and bought one from Amazon). I expect I'll be back frequently for advice!

All the best to everyone,

Sean

PS George - that's a lovely guitar in your icon. Did you make it?

Sean, the prospect of building a guitar seems daunting when looked at as a whole, but each individual process that goes to making it is, in itself, not difficult, so you just have to think about each part of the build as you come to it. Of course you can do it, get a serviced kit, with the sides already bent etc, and have at it! There are a number of builders from the UK here, I build both steel string guitars and classicals, and you can always PM me for any advice or suppliers. I like to build my classicals in the Spanish tradition, so I build them using hand tools only, so you should be able to do it.

Colin

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I don't believe in anything, I simply make use of a set of reasonable working hypotheses.

Sean,

Someone recommended the the book "Finding Meaning in the Second Half of Life" to me by James Hollis. A slow read for me, but he said some things that got my attention in that I had never considered them before. For one, his contention is that most of us aging adults try to (continue to) live a life for our parents. Then he pointed out that we need to reconginze where this is so by looking carefully at ourselves and then giving it up. In other words, his professional advice (for whatever that's worth) is to stop living for our parents as it is unhealthy. Now I have no idea if that is what you are doing or not. Nor do I know if Hollis is "right" as a phychologist. I think that Hollis would say that your building of a guitar should be 100% for yourself and not have anything to do with your father, tools or no tools, father approval or no father approval, dead or alive.

Me, I don't know. But I am open to learning new things, even when they are hard to hear. But I have certainly found myself thinking about what my father would think, or do. I never condidered it a problem. But then again, I think that Hollis does have a point for some of us.

Good luck in your guitar building (and your memories).

Ed

Sean,
Thanks. Yes, the guitar I use as my avatar is my first. It's far from perfect, but it turned out remarkably well and was great fun to build.

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George :-)

I guess here are a couple questions I would ask...

*Do you like working with your hands?

*Does the idea of a time consuming project that you must break down into multiple small jobs sound interesting?

*Will your family be cooperative with your 60+ hour commitment... meaning they will loose you for 3-4 months worth of nights and weekends?

*Have you priced out the Kit and supplementary tools you will need? (Sharpening stones, sandpaper, finishing, guitar specific clamps, etc.)

Now.. Go ahead and buy Cumpiano and Natelsons "Guitar building tradition and technology" book. Give it a read. Does this seem like a fun project? Does it seem interesting? If you are going to do a Kit, take a look at Bill Cory's Building Kit Guitars book.

Over on another forum, they do a couple group builds a year. They seem to average about 20% of 1st timer builds completing a guitar.... I think the rest have the best of intentions.... but they just get busy with the house or the Kids or Fishing... and Life in General.... it just ends up on the shelf.

Good luck

John

Sean, YES! Absolutely! As George told you, there is no downside.
You might not get the guitar of your dreams out of your first effort. In fact, you probably won't, but you will probably get a reasonably good player out of the deal. That is why you will build a second, and a third, etc. You get the idea. There is no downside.
Go for it!!! Your Dad would be proud!

Thanks for the thoughtful reply John. Which forum are you referring to?

Sean

Personally, I wouldn't recommend a group build for a first timer. To me, it would be intimidating. I know, I know! Not possible! I built my first, a classical, from scratch. I took my time, and though I had read numerous guitar building books, Sloane, Cumpiano, Courtnall, and others, I allowed myself to learn as I went. I took a long time, a little over a year, but it came out great. If I had been following a build group, I think I'd have been very frustrated, as the group passed me in progress. I'd probably have given up. The way I did it, if I wanted to not do anything that day, I could do that.

Having said all that, I do recommend reading at least one and, possibly, more than one book on the process. If that puts you to sleep, you might not want to proceed. With me, I couldn't get enough of reading about building. It's still a problem, and I hang out on a number of forums just for that reason. A DVD would also be a good thing to get, and watch the process.

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Waddy

Photobucket Build Album Library

Sound Clips of most of my guitars

By all means YES! I started out about a year ago not knowing anything about lutherie. I never did any wood working except making an oak hood for my fish tank. Once I made the hood, I thought it looked pretty good. I have played guitar for 43 of my 50 years. My wife had recently passed away and I needed something to lift my spirits, and give me something to do so I ordered a fully serviced kit from LMI using Courtnalls plan for a Santos Hernandez flamenco. I also purchased Roy Courtnalls book which I think is great. In my day job, I am an electrical engineer and this was a really new endeavor for me. Geek meets wood! The first one I made was really a learning experience. It could have looked better, but it sounded great after about a 2 month break in for the German spruce top. The second one is now at the wet sand stage and I am going to buff it out tommorow. It looks great but how will it sound? A mystery is always fun. Right now as I type, a professional guitar player and close friend is gigging with the first guitar I built, how cool is that!

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John Nowicki

Do it! A kit is a great investment. Order the new calander from Bill Cory on this site. It is full of pictures of guitars that were built from kits. You will end up with a high end guitar.
My dad was also a woodwooker. A local ledgend. He was very talented. But he never encouraged me to work with wood. My younger brother went to work with him and also learned the business. I worked in the engineering field for almost forty years and retired. But I took up woodworking about the time my father passed. That was about thirty years ago. In April of this year, I went to New York and attended two weeks of training on building guitars and pearl inlay. Now I am building guitars. I build from scratch, but I have a fully equipped workshop, with every tool imaginable. If you are starting out new, I am sure some of your Dad's hand tools will be usefull. You will have to purchase a mold, some specialty tools, etc. Bill Cory on this site has a couple of books on building kits that are great. Read as much as you can, and then go for it. But take it slow. Mistakes are easy to make, but sometimes hard to fix. There are lots of folks on this forum that started just like you. You cannot go wrong with a kit. There are lots of them available. KMG, Blues Creek, LMI, and so on.

Mike R

Just do it! Thats what I did. I contacted John Hall at Blues Creek Guitars (link above). He deals in Martin Kits. Yeah, you could buy from Martin, but a John Hall kit comes with John Hall. And as far as I can tell, they cost the same!

I started with no experience. I started this because I wanted a Harp Guitar. The Harp was my second build. I learned so much from the kit and the folks here at OLF I had the confidence to attempt the Harp! And it all worked out well.

Mike

Go for it!
My first classical build was a LMI kit. Order kit with Prebent sides, fretted fingerboard, slotted peghed...kept the challenge down to only a few nights of lost sleep. With a couple books and the great included video step by step...you can do it. Take your time. Don't be afreaid to ask the OLF questions...no matter how stupid you might think. There are no stupid questions,,,,just stupid mistakes
Kent

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Wood Creations by Kent A. Bailey
EXCELLENCE IN SCULPTURE, CARVING, LUTHIER, ARCHITECTURAL MILLWORK AND DESIGN

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Hehe.. guys, this question was originally posted in Sept '09. I'm pretty sure I've seen some posts from winterdune indicating he's started work on his project.

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Jim Hansen

I have indeed! Slow going but I'm really enjoying it...
Sean