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Hi and good mornin' ya great bunch! i'm just about to glue in my very first rosette, it's solid wood, wondered which kind of glue is best for this, HHG, CA, Titebond??? i already put some shellac in the channels, thought i'd ask you first before going any further.

TIA

Serge

Oh and another one, against the inner ring of the wood , i'll have to insert b/w/b purfling that will be put against the solid wood, any tips to facilitate this, really nervous about breaking those tiny strips?Serge Poirier38802.4498958333

G'mornin' Serge, I have used titebond without any problem on my rosettes.

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Anderson Guitars
Clearwater,Fl. 33755

Thanks Dave, do you use titebond for the strips of purfling too?

Yep, Some have said that titebond swells the wood a bit but I haven't seen it ...yet.

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Anderson Guitars
Clearwater,Fl. 33755

You just rock my friend, Titebond it will be!

Thanks!

Serge

Thanks as well Hesh, i just put CA in the outer ring that a tiny 1/16" black purf line so far, will that little purf line be ok with time or should i remove it right away and redo it with Titebond?

Leave it as long as it looks right.

Al

It depends....

If the rosette fits REALLY tight already I would avoid water based glues (titebond, LMI white, etc.) It will swell the wood fibers in both the top and the rosette and you will have a tough time getting it in the channel. (Ask me how I know...    ) In this situation I would definitely go with CA.

If it is comfortable fit you could use either, but just think about the wood is going to swell if you use titebond.

Other options are Duco or Weldon.   Any of these will work fine.

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Brock Poling
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.polingguitars.com

As long as you seal the wood first I'm a fan of CA. You can fit the rosette, get it looking just the way you want it, then glue.

Brock is right on about the swelling. It may cause problems, but then maybe not if the channel is a few thousands oversized.

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Joe Beaver
Maker of Sawdust

Hola budy. If you want to save yourself come headaches, just glue those b/w/b purflings to the rosette beforehand. It might be a bit more work at the outset but it will be easier to just glue in the assembled rosette afterwards.   Don't worry about the b/w/b purflings. They can take quite the curve as long as you don't kink them too quickly. If you're worried just heat them up with a clothing iron (you can also mist them very lightly with a spray bottle). Cheers!

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Thanks for all the info guys, i have my rosette glued in, went well except from the swelling that Brock mentionned. I had to put some weight over it to keep it from getting out of there but it seems to be all right, i'll be checking it out tomorrow morning if it swelled too much.

Her are a couple of pics, let me know what you think please, if i should take it out or not.







The purple heart is hard to cut and easy to break, i had the piece crack on me twice an got a rosette in 2 pieces

Serge Poirier38803.0014351852

Looks great there Serge. Well done.

On thing you might want to be carful of if this is your layout is that the cut away is very low, so you may some problems with your top purfling (if you are putting top purfling on). It will get close to your rosette.

Otherwise looks like your well on your way there bud.

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Hey Serge, that purple heart looks real good, thats gonna be one spiffy gee-tar.
              Red

Thanks Rod and Red for the kind words,

Rod, Now that you say this, i might reconsider doing this cutaway of my own design and rather go with something more secure like plain dread. OTOH, i could maybe go with it and use the tiniest binding/purfling combo there is, what's your take coach?

Serge, your rosette is looking good! Looks gap-free, so as long as it's securely glued you should be O.K.

I think Rod is right about your cutaway. You could retain the shape as it is, and just move the whole thing up a bit to give more space between the edge and rosette. I might also mention, though, that anywhere the side contour straightens, you have a weak spot. As we know, an arch makes a wood plate stronger! You could leave the cutaway where it is, and make your curve into the neck block in a larger radius (that is, start the bend sooner and end it later). That'll also give you more space between the edge and the rosette. Or, you could just do it the way you want, and you'll probable still end up with a good guitar!

You will end up with a good guitar as Carlton said if you do it your way Serge, but you realy don't need that much access to the upper frets. I would pull the entire cut away up about 1" than you wouldn't have to worry bout the purfling scheme you choose.

Have you made the inside mold for bending yet? That my be your deciding factor.

What else do you more experienced builders think?

Paul W, John M, The Kinnard's, Lance, Kevin G, Tim McK, Mario or any of the number of seasoned vets we have round here, you know who you are.

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"There's really no wrong way, as long as the results are what's desired." Charles Fox

"We have to constantly remind ourselves what we're doing....No Luthier is putting a man on the moon!" Harry Fleishman

"Generosity is always different in the eye of the person who didn't receive anything, but who wanted some." Waddy Thomson

Thanks Carlton and Rod, i agree in the sense that i was feeling uncomfortable when i first realized how close the edge of the rosette was with the purf/binding edge of the cutaway . Yeah, i guess this cutaway will wait on another guitar, i'll just go plain dread instead, Mom and Dad won't mind, just the fact that i will be building for them is gonna make them proud anyway i'm sure, i'll just try and get better at inlaying instead!

And since it's a gift, i want them next 2 builds looking great!

Thanks for the advice, i really appreciate it!

Serge

Serge, the rosette looks great. Did you already flood it with CA? It appears that way but it might just be the sealer on the top.
I know it's after the fact but I'll throw my $.02 in for next time. If you are dealing with mulitple lines like purfling lines on the inside and outside, it's much easier to get the whole mess in the slot then when you are happy with it, hit it with CA. To me, there's nothing more frustrating than trying to get a part put in place when you have wet glue hindering your progress. I've had my doubts about the structural aspects of CA but this area isn't receiving much stress so I'm confident it will last a lifetime with CA.
In regards to your cutaway:both Rod and Carlton have great points. If it were me, I'd be concerned about the proximity to the rosette as well as the flat of the cutaway. You could easily fix both of these problems by increasing the radius of the inside curve. Not to mention that you'll be increasing your chances of a successful bend!
Good work! Keep it up!

Thanks Paul, CA was put in the outer black ring only, the rest was Titebond. The flood part is shellac. CA for me next time! For the cutaway, i'll see if i modify for this build or use a simple dread shape like on my first. Thanks!

Serge, I think you know this but Always, Always, Always make sure you have your top sealed before you go anywhere near it with CA. I think all of us can show you pics of our first attempts at rosettes or binding using CA without sealing, and the CA pulls the color into the endgrain. It's heartbreaker.

Paul, is it ok if i only used 2 layers of shellac as a sealer? Should i have used something else?

No, that's perfect. You might also want to seal the rosette itself. Double protection.

Serge, You`re making better progress than I am at the moment. I set a rosette into a top yesterday that was pretty intricate and fancy. Feeling smug with myself, started leveling it out only to find that some of the lines in the design had dissolved in the CA. Must have been a bad place in the wood I used for the lines. Now the whole rosette has to come out!
BTW, I`ve been using CA on the rosette insert itself, but when it comes to setting it into the top, I use titebond, making sure of a good fit (snug, but not tight) and getting things under weight as quick as possible to get a jump on things swelling up on you.

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Looks great, Serge! The wierd thing is that it looks almost the exact same as the one I just recently did. I'll post a pic later today after work. Keep up the good work!

Mike

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Mike

"The Dude abides. I don't know about you but I take comfort in that. It's good knowin' he's out there. The Dude. Takin' 'er easy for all us sinners. Shoosh." The Stranger