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 Post subject: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 4:34 pm 
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Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
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I would like to use a rope style purfling for my build. It is .080” thick so it’s substantial for purfling, do I try to bend it with the binding in the bender or do I just pull it around the guitar like the regular small stuff?


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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 4:45 pm 
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Mahogany
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I tend to hand bend the thicker purflings I use. I always have problems with them cracking otherwise. YMMV

I don't know how well it would do in the bender, but I just haven't ever tried that. Might as well give it a go and see what happens! Tape them all together in the correct orientation and that will help stabilize them in the bend.


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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:58 pm 
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Koa
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Luthier1975 wrote:
I tend to hand bend the thicker purflings I use. I always have problems with them cracking otherwise. YMMV

I don't know how well it would do in the bender, but I just haven't ever tried that. Might as well give it a go and see what happens! Tape them all together in the correct orientation and that will help stabilize them in the bend.

So still use moisture and heat?


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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 6:27 pm 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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For rope and herringbone I soak them in water for a minute or so , take them out, and allow the water to be absorbed a little. Then I hand bend them into the channel sometimes using the binding to back them up. Wetting the purfling softens the glue a little and allows the pieces to slide around a little. If you use too much water the purfling falls apart so it is a bit of a balancing act.


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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:17 pm 
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I do basically the same as Clay for rope and herringbone purfling. I fill a large baking sheet with warm water, place the purfling in the water for 60-90 seconds, and then tape them on edge to the sides of the guitar body and let them dry. Once dry, they hold their bent shape.

The herringbone I've done was 0.130 wide and the rope was 0.100 wide.

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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 11:53 pm 
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Koa
Koa

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So just water ...
They are the same width as the binding so I COULD tape them up between binding parts when I bend, but I guess the heat may cause it to delaminate


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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 12:09 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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If you have an extra piece or two you can experiment to get a feel for how the stuff you have acts. Even a two or three inch scrap can help you know the right amount of moisture to use. Testing to destruction a small scrap might save some heartache later. I do one piece at a time rather than wetting them all at the same time.



These users thanked the author Clay S. for the post: SnowManSnow (Sat Dec 14, 2019 7:26 am)
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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 7:26 am 
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Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
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Thanks for the help folks
I’ll get it done:)


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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 9:07 am 
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Cocobolo
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Stew Mac has a video somewhere on their site showing how Dan Erlewine bends herringbone.

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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 9:15 am 
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I think the key to bending any layered purfling is to not ask any more than 2-3 layers to bend while still glued together. The trick to bending herringbone referenced by Greg is to disconnect the outer layers of fiber from the inside layers. The inside diagonal layers and spine then bend very easily.

Is the rope purfling attached to some outer layers? You might want to pull one of those layers loose before trying to bend. But be careful about separating both outer layers. It might all fall apart if you do that.


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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 9:33 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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https://www.stewmac.com/How-To/Trade_Se ... ng_it.html

That is a good information for doing tight bends. I cut the herringbone down the middle to do rosettes and other tight bends, but what the video shows looks like it will work better. If you cut the herringbone down the middle you can use it as a small rope binding or turn it sideways and use it for alternating block molding.


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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:44 am 
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Koa
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This is it
Image


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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 10:57 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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If you are bending it around the typical acoustic guitar, just wetting it will probably be enough to make it bend. Dan used heat, that might work too (I haven't done that). When you separate the layers you always run the risk of things falling apart. For a Venetian cutaway separating the layers would be helpful, so the risk might be worth it.


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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:03 am 
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Koa
Koa

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Clay S. wrote:
If you are bending it around the typical acoustic guitar, just wetting it will probably be enough to make it bend. Dan used heat, that might work too (I haven't done that). When you separate the layers you always run the risk of things falling apart. For a Venetian cutaway separating the layers would be helpful, so the risk might be worth it.

It’s a standard 000 shape so nothing crazy and fairly gentle curves


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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:34 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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I've used that premade "rope" style material for purfling and rosettes on a couple of guitars. I routed a little groove a piece of some sort of scrap material and prebent it using a heat gun and some water. It seemed to hold the bend well enough and not delaminate

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 Post subject: Re: Rope purfling
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 12:46 pm 
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First name: Ed
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Rank amateur here and in the last week I have bent both .130 rope and .110 rope on a hot pipe set on high. I squirted some Windex with ammonia on it. I went much tighter than you did to fit it to a rosette and had no problems. The narrower stuff was full depth, but the wider stuff was quite thin and needed care to keep it flat. I also bent ivoroid with a hair dryer and fit it into a groove to hold it and keep it flat, as it was .040 thick. The last picture is my rosette on my redwood top (with shellac). It all went easier than I thought it would

Ed


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